KISS: The Songs 1974-2012

Discussion in 'Music Corner' started by GodShifter, Feb 7, 2017.

  1. vamborules

    vamborules Forum Resident

    Location:
    CT
    They do sound good. It's just not the way I want to hear them.
     
  2. vamborules

    vamborules Forum Resident

    Location:
    CT
    No, I meant the song. Not your write up. That's why I cleared everything but the video out of the comment.
     
  3. npgchris

    npgchris Forum Resident

    Send me your address, and I'll add you to my Christmas Card list! I love it! :hugs:

    I wish you'd been with us when we were covering this album! ;)

    I like "Rise To It" and "The Street Giveth..." more than you do, and you definitely like "Read My Body" more than I do, but other than that, we're pretty much in total agreement!

    Thanks for sharing! :cheers:
     
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  4. GodShifter

    GodShifter Forum Member Thread Starter

    Location:
    Dallas, TX, USA
    But he didn't say they didn't sound good acoustically. He said he preferred in the context he originally heard them as: hard rock songs. I agree with him. I don't normally like acoustic versions of electric songs as it's just not my thing.
     
  5. GodShifter

    GodShifter Forum Member Thread Starter

    Location:
    Dallas, TX, USA
    No, I got it. I was just making a (apparently not funny) joke. I understood.
     
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  6. YardByrd

    YardByrd rock n roll citizen in a hip hop world

    Location:
    Europe
    agreed! I saw Unplugged the night it was broadcast and never seen it again... until yesterday when I watched God of Thunder and 2000 Man... didn't need to go any further... sounds fine, but more like a novelty as opposed to essential... which are the originals...
     
  7. Curveboy

    Curveboy Forum Resident

    Location:
    New York City
    They are right.
     
  8. walrus

    walrus Staring into nothing

    Location:
    Nashville
    That's the best version of that song, by a mile.

    Alive III was my intro to Kiss, so i'll always have a special place for it in my heart, even though it's about as 'live' as an extra on Walking Dead. Wish they'd added "Tears Are Falling" to it, since all the other 80's tunes on Alive III sound much heavier and rock harder than the studio versions.
     
  9. npgchris

    npgchris Forum Resident

    If you don't like it, you don't like it. But you almost couldn't have picked two worse songs to gauge the overall quality of the performance. Give one or two of these a shot, if you've got a few minutes: "Got To Choose", "Rock Bottom", "Sure Know Something", "See You Tonite", "Comin' Home", "Goin' Blind" or "A World Without Heroes". These are just off the top of my head, but are all fine examples of how quite a few of their songs really shined in this type of setting.
     
  10. YardByrd

    YardByrd rock n roll citizen in a hip hop world

    Location:
    Europe
    On your say so, I'll give those specific tunes a look see in the morning... time to put the young 'un to bed... I'm 10 hours ahead of you... I'm in the future... if you need a winning lottery ticket number, just ask ;-)
     
  11. yarbles

    yarbles Too sick to pray

    My imagination is running riot trying to envisage how PAUL will be tackling this type of material vocally, assuming his songs are as 'grungy' as Hate. It could well be the comedic high point of their entire catalogue, which would be no mean feat. Over the past few albums, PAUL's vocs have become an enormous irritant for me, but I haven't actually LOL'd yet. That might all be about to change.

    One observation I would make at this early stage: despite the adverse opinions of some narrow-minded 'grunge' haters, there was a huge amount of melodicism within the genre, and several of the singers had incredible voices. GENE's past material has generally lacked both of those qualities; Hate was no exception, and was proof that if you are trying to mimic 'grunge', it's not sufficient for the music just to be heavy. But at least Hate was tolerable, if instantly forgettable, and I'd hazard a guess that that will be true of his other songs here. On the other hand, when you factor in PAUL's increasingly irksome strangulated cat vocals and generally idiotic lyrics, CoS could well develop into an unlistenable nightmare.
     
  12. The Hermit

    The Hermit Wavin' that magick glowstick since 1976

    They were shouting "Boo-urns!!!"
     
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  13. carlwm

    carlwm Forum Resident

    Location:
    wales
    Appreciate that!

    Always good to connect musically with someone who's opinions you respect!

    Nice thing about this thread though is even when someone is way off the centre ground (for me, loving Crazy Nights, not much enjoying Ace's solo record) people are understanding & give informed rebuttals rather than rant & be rude. It's really refreshing.

    When I was away, my only way of listening to music was an ancient net book with such knackered speakers, they make Tom Waits sound like Alvin & The Chipmunks so I thought it wasn't fair to comment on stuff. Hopefully, I'll have heard Revenge enough to be able to add some thought tomorrow & also keep up with COS.

    Into uncharted waters from hereon in for me!
     
  14. npgchris

    npgchris Forum Resident

    It's probably a fruitless wish on my part, but I hope everyone listening to the tunes on this album can do so without strapping a ball and chain on each one, namely their feelings about "grunge". Is it a good song or not? That should be the criteria.
     
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  15. bartels76

    bartels76 Forum Hall Of Fame

    Location:
    CT
    HATE
    Great opener here and sets the tone for the rest of the album. Gene just sings from the gut here and puts on a fantastic performance. Eric does a complex drum pattern and Bruce's moody guitar fits well. Very cool, mature, deep lyrics here. Gene is taking the sound and themes from Revenge and bringing it to the next level. I'm all in.

    COS
    Most fans into the band at the time heard it by the time it was released. I was looking forward to a cleaner mix but the released version sounded almost the same as the boot. I know this is a polarizing album to a lot of fans and I understood why they may be put off from it. I think this is an experiment that works unlike the Elder. Hotter Than Hell was pretty grungy and Parasite would fit on this album perfectly. Paul talks down on this album as well but what did he want to do? Sing more about strip clubs? I don't feel his songs were faked. Paul has emotions like anyone else and if you read his bio a lot of resentment and anger. Why not put it into songs? It's a breath of fresh air I think. I do have a problem with the mix as it sounds like a bad version of the AIC's Tripod album. It's a little over the top and could've been cleaned up a bit. I think the mix tries too hard whereas I think the songs hold up. I don't know where it falls, I guess after the first 7 studio albums but before all the 80's -on aside from Creatures, LIU, and Revenge- so somewhere in the middle.
     
  16. Curveboy

    Curveboy Forum Resident

    Location:
    New York City
    Carnival of Souls contains the best vocals of Paul's career. If you don't like them...then maybe you should stick with 70's KISS.
     
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  17. npgchris

    npgchris Forum Resident

    CARNIVAL OF SOULS

    Even though I knew this was a heavily-bootlegged album, I'm glad I avoided trying to track one down prior to the official release of it. I knew I didn't want to hear it in poor quality, nor get "used to" subpar versions of the songs, that might be at too fast or too slow a tempo. @bartels76 said that he had a version just as good as the final one, so obviously there were high quality boots of it out there, which I didn't know.

    This album definitely spoke to me from the first time I heard it. Unlike every KISS album since around LIU, this one stayed in regular rotation in my CD player for years afterward. Even though I generally enjoyed KISS' music, there's no doubt that the lyrics to many of their songs hadn't exactly resonated with me for a long while. As someone who values good lyrics, this album wasn't just a breath of fresh air, but a gale-force wind.

    One criticism of this album I've read repeatedly is that this album is fake/forced/disingenuous. I couldn't disagree more. In fact, given where Paul and Gene were at that point in their lives, both in age and experience, I'd say these lyrics were for more real and honest than much of what they'd been serving up for years. There was a really good feature on KISS in Metal Edge magazine from back at this time that I wish I had access to right now. But in it, Paul stated how they worked a lot harder on these lyrics than any release beforehand. And that they accurately reflected their mindset at the time.

    Some of the revelations in Paul's recent bio only support the fact that some of these lyrics are pretty incisive and introspective. I guess some people just have too much trouble accepting that kind of approach from the guys best known for "Rock And Roll All Nite". Which is too bad.

    EDIT: I just found this online, which does quote the Metal Edge article in places. The "Self-Exploration vs. Party Anthems" section raises several good points relevant to what I am talking about:

    KISS Asylum: It Never Goes Away -- The "Carnival of Souls" Controversy

    And it's not just the lyrics. Musically, this is one of their most adventurous albums, with an unusual willingness to use the studio to add color to the songs. Unlike many of their albums, this one really lends itself to actual, bonafide analysis. "Analyze" KISS' music? Yes, you heard right. I for one greatly appreciate the effort they put into this album, and certainly Bruce deserves props for spending the extra time to add some interesting and unusual touches to the guitar tracks on COS.

    I greatly enjoyed listening to this album again the other night, and look forward to examining its excellent songs over the next 12 days!
     
    Last edited: Sep 13, 2017
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  18. GodShifter

    GodShifter Forum Member Thread Starter

    Location:
    Dallas, TX, USA
    I couldn't disagree more but as to the last part of your statement, I probably should. :/
     
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  19. vamborules

    vamborules Forum Resident

    Location:
    CT
    Paul himself says that.
     
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  20. npgchris

    npgchris Forum Resident

    KISS are well-known for hanging their failures out to dry. So was Paul lying then, or now? I have several interviews Paul conducted when the Reunion with Ace and Peter was still in its early stages. He made many references to the "album we've just finished" as being one of the best of their careers. So when it was still a fresh project, he was obviously proud of it. At a time when he had no cause to be, as it was worlds away from the feel-good nostalgia they were specializing in at that moment.

    What Paul did say in a recent podcast interview is that "KISS shouldn't be singing songs about angst", which made me chuckle. It's an acknowledgement that this kind of approach isn't what people want from KISS. Fair enough. But these lyrics are far more revealing about their state of mind at the time than they would probably lead you to believe in any contemporary interview.

    You yourself know of Gene's defense mechanism to put down KISS' music before someone else can. Paul's engaging in the same behavior here with this one, in my opinion. I'm sure they're sick of sarcastic comments about "KISS going grunge" when people refer to this album.
     
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  21. vamborules

    vamborules Forum Resident

    Location:
    CT
    Yeah, I know how they are but in this particular case I tend to think he really doesn't like it.

    I just looked up on googlebooks, and this is what he says in Behind the Mask:

    "I was dead-set against doing that kind of an album, but there are times in the band where somebody acquiesces or gives in based upon somebody else feeling strongly about something. That album was Gene believing that's what we should do. I never believed the world needs a second-rate Soundgarden, Metallica, or Alice in Chains. It was a very labored attempt at doing something that I think was a big misstep. Two stars."
     
  22. npgchris

    npgchris Forum Resident

    But the fact he was against it at the time, doesn't mean he didn't roll up his sleeves and put his best effort forward once the direction was decided. Same with THE ELDER. He was against it initially, but once they made the call to go in that direction he was all in.

    If you don't like the songs on this album, that's understandable. But I don't see how anyone who is familiar with KISS and/or Paul could fail to see the effort that was put into this. There's far more complexity to many of the arrangements, and far more work put into the lyrics, than almost any KISS album. If it's a fail, fine. But none of them were mailing this in. Far from it.

    EDIT: Put another way: if COS had been an acclaimed album, do you think Paul would still bad-mouth it? I doubt it.
     
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  23. Curveboy

    Curveboy Forum Resident

    Location:
    New York City
    But Bruce doesn't.
     
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  24. bartels76

    bartels76 Forum Hall Of Fame

    Location:
    CT
    :thumbsup:
     
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  25. Curveboy

    Curveboy Forum Resident

    Location:
    New York City
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