Help me build my system to match my "new" B&W Nautilus 804's

The A21 would be a great fit also. I see one listed as 2yr. old for $1500. Not a bad price. Shop around and watch the ads. Also a N.Y dealer reports he has a few used in black and one silver. He asks $1600+75 shipping. But is open to inquiries on the blacks as he has a few (Audiogoners). GL

 

Note that the home threater bypass on the Modwright LS 100 can only be accessed by pushing a button on the front panel. It is not available via the remote.
I was recently researching preamps and ran into this with the LS 100 and LS 36.5. It was a deal breaker for me since my preamp is 20 feet away from the listening position. At least the inputs are available via remote on the LS 100, unlike the 36.5 preamp, which can't even change inputs from the remote.

That could be a problem if you want to switch from the CD input to running the tuner from the HT receiver. Or if you want to switch from a concert DVD or satellite/cable input (HT) to a file server. All of my digital music is on a file server and sometimes I like to swap in a youtube video or rewind the big game to hear what just happened before switching back to music. It would be a PITA with a Modwright unit.

It's a pity because I really liked the idea of the LS 36.5 as a cheaper alternative to an ARC LS27 but with the added bonus of a rectifier tube.

 

Bonus, you will be able to rip SACDs.

 

I just reread the first few pages of this thread. I notice a trend towards the suggestion of the Tube pre-amp combined with high current ss amp. Can someone explain what the Tube portion of the pre-amp chain would add in terms of color? I noticed a good deal on the Rogue Pharoah, tube pre-amp section combined with 185 of SS power. Ought to be sufficient. I'm curious sound-wise what the pre=amp tubes adds. I prefer a softer sound, not bright. Clear mids and tight bass.

Or suggest a good Tube pre-amp (under 1k if possible).

 

I did notice an improvement from the OPPO 105. One of those ~10% improvement that is difficult to describe. Reading up on it more it will give me a lot of flexibility with digital music to use as a DAC. I also have a player now to play my 1 SACD I own, The Allman Brothers At Fillmore East.

Still bouncing around ideas on the amp. Still need to move my TT into the living room and getting it wall-mounted so I can hear analogue on these speakers. Looking forward to it.

 

Rogue Pharoah is class D. I've never heard it, but I've never heard of anybody trying to use a class D amp to drive B&W 800-series. I would stick to Class A/B in your price range and for those speakers. I do like that the preamp section would allow you to use Mullard 12AU7 tubes. But as I said before, stick with separates. This isn't rocket science. Pick a high current A/B amp and then move on to the preamp. Or get different speakers like I did, so you can be more flexible with different types of amplification. When you chose Nautilus 804s, you also chose a very specific kind of amp. You just didn't realize it yet.

 

I've used a number of ClassD amps with my B&W 800-series amps over the years. Currently, Classe Sigma Monos.

 

No weaknesses?

 

Okay, that now makes one!

 

When I use my Magnepans, the system is: Source>Quicksilver Line Stage Preamp>McCormack DNA 0.5 Amp>Magnepan MG12

The Quicksilver adds some additional warmth and meat to the bottom end. This can be controlled or enhanced somewhat by the choice of tubes - as well as the gain presented to the amp. At $995, the Quicksilver is a minimalist preamp with no remote, but it can be purchased with a home theater pass thru for peanuts:

More info: Quicksilver Line Preamplifier

 

Got my Thorens hooked up to the new speakers. Not surprisingly it sounds better than my Oppo although the Oppo is an improvement since I started this thread. Definitely sounds more lively. Not to go down the A vs D debate. I'm still reading and surfing amp deals out there. I suppose getting an A21 and later adding a tube amp could satisfy my tube curiosity. I've spent a couple weeks surfing used deals on McIntosh (among other brands) and unless I find a steal on a Mac, I won't be getting that brand. Nothing against them, the pricing is the main culprit. A shame, I love the blue meters and the quality reputation.

 

In another thread about buying CD again, I was introduced to a site about dynamic range. I can consistently seeing CD having less dynamic range as compared to vinyl. May be that is why vinyl sounds better for many here? I checked Madonna for no particular reason at Album list - Dynamic Range Database
and can see this trend started around early 1990s for her albums.

 

This may go down as the worst attempt at thread hijacking in the history of this, and all other forums . Not even a segue?

 

I have been contributing to this thread multiple times and I am doing it as a conversation with him. Where have you been in this thread other than this comment?

 

BTW, OP, to do a more apple to apple comparison of your 105 with your analog system, may be try with CD and vinyl with same dynamic range score from the same artist. For example, the ones from Vanessa Fernandez. See Album list - Dynamic Range Database .

I am very curious how both would sound to you and if you can hear which is better or not. The album is being used to demo high end systems in audio show. It would be a good test album to check how good your current system has become!

 

I like the look of McIntosh gear too. And I have owned a bunch of it. And heard plenty more. It is built well, looks nice, and has good resale value. But something I have learned over time and with more experience: it sounds fine, but is nothing special. There is better sounding gear for less money. Not knocking anybody's gear choices, just telling you something that hopefully will make you feel better about not being able to afford it. I do prefer their preamps to their amps (for current production, and perhaps for vintage too, now that I think about it).

Another option for working tubes into your system, other than the line stage (preamp), would be with a tubed phono preamp and/or DAC. I have a tubed DAC now, and love it. I have had several tubed phono preamps in the past, but I don't at the moment. I will go back to a tubed phono preamp when budget and priorities allow.

 

Why not go all tube.

You can buy a used Rogue, Cronos Magnum integrated amplifier for around $1,400 - $1,800.

With their KT-120 tubes, that will give you something without excessive brightness and 100-Watts of tube power.

That will afford you a complete and simple solution

 

I'll probably catch flak for this, but IME, the Rogue hybrids don't exhibit the commonly quoted benefits that tubes can provide. Despite their tube preamp section, I perceived barely any of the tube qualities that I've found in other tube products. IMO, the Class D output character that's still present in those amps (though less than other class D designs) is far more obvious than any tube sonics.

I get far more tube goodness through my tube DAC and SS Yamaha.

Even though I wasn't completely enamoured the Rogue CM II, I found it was a much better amp than the Pharaoh in almost every respect.


I bet the CM II would easily drive your B&Ws to sane levels, however, I also think a separate tube pre and class AB SS amp might be an ideal route.

 

The CM or the CM II either new or used would be the best bang for the buck and an easy solution.

 

+1 I had the Rogue Ares phono stage for a while and wasn't a big fan. Too noisy and not simpatico with my Soundsmith Zephyr MIMC Star cart. Not sure why. I also didn't get very good tube dynamics/holography, etc. but that might have been due to incompatibility with the cart, for whatever reason.

 

This decision is hard. I've never heard tubes and am very curious. The Rogue CM II seems like a great amp. The way it is described sounds fascinating.

 

Go out and audition some tube gear. If you absolutely must have it (like me), then sell your new B&Ws and build your system around some more sensitive and easier-to-drive speakers.

 

And don't stop there - sell your Prius and get a Model T! The connection to the road is so... immediate. After that you can trade in your fridge for an ice box (so natural, so analog).

 

There has to be a better solution than that.

 

Well I think that has been the subject of the rest of this thread. But, if he is curious about tubes, he should listen to them and see if they are his thing. In either case I am just saying that you should buy amps and speakers that work well together rather than compromise with a mismatch. Even though I am a tube guy, if I had those Nautilus speakers I would buy a high current solid state amp to make them sing and never look back. There are many paths to audio nirvana (and many more to total frustration if you don't do your homework).