Power conditioner making sound worse

Discussion in 'Audio Hardware' started by Puma Cat, Apr 19, 2009.

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  1. LeeS

    LeeS Music Fan

    Location:
    Atlanta
    I have had good luck with Monster conditioners; the HTS line is designed by Richard Marsh (I have the HTS-5000) and made a nice improvement in my system. Just don't plug the amp into it. I'm using mostly after-market cords where possible from Cardas and Gutwire and one other I cannot remember.
     
  2. LeeS

    LeeS Music Fan

    Location:
    Atlanta
    Thanks for the link Baron. Been thinking about trying a new fuse.
     
  3. LouReed9

    LouReed9 Village Idiot

    Location:
    Philly Burbs
    Aren't you concerned with voltage spikes and what not Dennis? Just curious because I have everything plugged into a surge protector. It does happen to be a Monster Cable SP. :hide: I'm not a fan of Monster Cable products myself. Cables in particular I mean. I only use it to protect the equipment. It seems to have much better specs than a standard Surge protector. Not familiar with power conditioners I must admit.
     
  4. LeeS

    LeeS Music Fan

    Location:
    Atlanta
    Stereophile and The Absolute Sound have both posted rave reviews of the Monster power conditioners.

    I do feel guilty mentioning this only because of the litigious nature of this company. I will likely upgrade to PS Audio soon. By the way, the PS Audio Duet and Quintet are on sale and a tremendous deal. We used the Duet for a year on our recordings before we went to battery power. Made a nice difference.
     
  5. Puma Cat

    Puma Cat Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Location:
    East Bay, CA
  6. Shakey

    Shakey New Member

    Location:
    Chicago, Illinois
    That's what Insurance is for, the rest is all Krap!


    Edit: imo
     
  7. LouReed9

    LouReed9 Village Idiot

    Location:
    Philly Burbs
    Insurance? Homeowners you mean? If so I'm not so sure that would cover something caused by a lightning strike for example.
     
  8. Shakey

    Shakey New Member

    Location:
    Chicago, Illinois
    Yes, mine does, renters, too. And most of these things won't save you if hit by lightning anyway. Almost all will compromise SQ.
     
  9. Mike19

    Mike19 New Member

    Location:
    Tallahassee, Fla
    I have a Monster HTS 3600 that's about 8 years old. I've used it in 3 different systems - all a/v. Back in 2001, I had a "high end" system based on Wilson Cub standmounts, Sonic Frontiers pre and 2 x 110w amp, Krell CDP and Sony N999ES DVD/SACD player.

    The Monster never made any difference in sound or video quality that I could tell. Not positve or negative.

    It did, however, save my system from a lightening strike that hit the house across the street from me. This was in 2002. The fuse in the Monster blew, like its supposed to, and nothing got to my components even though the TV, pre, Krell, Sony and Sunfire True Subwoofer were all in standby mode.

    I live in Florida which a lots of lightening so plugging directly into the wall is taking a big risk.
     
  10. P2CH

    P2CH Well-Known Member

    A surge protector is nothing more than an array of varistors in parallel with the AC line voltage.

    They do nothing until they see an over-voltage condition then they short out and trip your breaker.

    They won't do anything to the sound of what is connected to the power strip. Your components are basically connected straight into the wall at this point.

    I believe you're all hearing things.
     
  11. Scott in DC

    Scott in DC Forum Resident

    Location:
    Washington, DC
    Naim Audio

    Naim Audio does not like power conditioners or power strips. They state that such products will worsen the sound of your system when they are used. They do recommend a couple of power strips but even those are "naked" power strips with no filtering or surge protection.

    Naim reps will all by yell at you if you mention that you are using "non-approved" power products with Naim components.

    Scott
     
  12. AKA-Chuck G

    AKA-Chuck G Senior Member

    Location:
    Washington NC
    I stick to Panamax and hate monster anything!
     
  13. LouReed9

    LouReed9 Village Idiot

    Location:
    Philly Burbs
    I hear no difference, personally, when it's plugged in to the MC surge protector or straight in to the wall.

    The power grid that my house is on is very unstable. No idea why. It only affects about 20 houses or so. One side of the street. Sometimes it's off and back on in a matter of seconds. Other times longer. I think I'd be flirting with danger not using the surge protector. Can't tell the difference anyway sound wise. :shrug:
     
  14. MacGyver

    MacGyver Forum Resident

    Location:
    IRRIGON, OR. U.S.

    indeed, as do i. my vintage PIONEER is far too valuable to me to be leaving unprotected. after all, some of this stuff doesn't exactly show up on the BAY every day, you know. i do not know how much the protectors affect SQ, but i DO know that my system sounds very, VERY good to my ears. so, in sum, i am quite happy with PROTECTED gear that looks and sounds superb...
     
  15. TommyTunes

    TommyTunes Senior Member

    When we discussed power conditioning you said that the 50 foot Lowes extension cord that you are using to power the Monster conditioner made a significant upgrade over the Home Depot cords. Do you think plugging the VT100 directly into the the Lowes cord would offer upgrade over going through the monster?
     
  16. Glen B

    Glen B New Member

    Location:
    USA
    MOVs that are rated too close to the line voltage can conduct on high voltage peaks. It is claimed that this can degrade sound.
     
  17. Glen B

    Glen B New Member

    Location:
    USA
    My 2-channel system power conditioning is strictly homebrew balanced power with surge protection, that has been tweaked and improved over almost 5 years. Most noticeable benefits include, darker background, greater transparency, low-level detail, and tighter, more extended sounding bass. Just last week I completed a 4th generation rebuild that has each of three duplex outlets fed by its own dedicated isolation transformer.

    Early on I included EMI/RFI filters by Corcom and Qualtek and found during extended listening that they degraded the sound, so out they came. Seeing that a lot of the commercially available line conditioning products contain internal components similar to those employed in the above-mentioned filters, I suspect they may be responsible for a lot of the negative opinions about power conditioners.

    Current version: http://img.villagephotos.com/p/2003-5/191557/2083672

    Past versions: http://img.villagephotos.com/p/2003-5/191557/1741050
     
  18. TONEPUB

    TONEPUB Senior Member

    Location:
    Portland, Oregon
    If you get a good power conditioner, you won't have this problem.

    The cheapie power conditioners just make your system sound worse....

    Get Running Springs or Shunyata and you won't have a problem!
     
  19. Mike in OR

    Mike in OR Through Middle-earth...onto Heart of The Sunrise

    Location:
    Portland, Oregon
    Score yourself some used Shunyata 2s. Buy them as they become available and/or when you can afford them. Stay away from the cheap stuff built with nasty sounding cheap MOVs.

    Check into the Shunyata Guardian series, that is another option.
     
  20. emkay

    emkay Senior Member

    Location:
    New Jersey, USA
    You might be better off with something like a choke to clean the power on the circuit where your gear is plugged in. It'll get rid of the "grit" without getting rid of the music.

    I think those Monster power strips result in "clipped" peaks, so you'd probably lose some actual music and transients.

    I popped one in the room where my gear is and it's been good for (it improved the performance of) basically everything in the room. You don't even need to run your equipment "through" it -- it conditions the taps on the wall. As others have said, don't use a power strip... just plug into the wall.
     
  21. P2CH

    P2CH Well-Known Member

    Yeah, just having it on the same line will basically give the same protection. At least in terms of the MOV shorting out on a surge and taking down the power.

    The power conditioners usually utilize an isolation type of transformer for a 1:1 AC output. If this coil isn't capable of handling the load of your system, like power amps, it is going to lag causing your system to starve for power.
     
  22. LouReed9

    LouReed9 Village Idiot

    Location:
    Philly Burbs
    OK. What's a choke?
     
  23. hifisoup

    hifisoup @hearmoremusic on Instagram

    Location:
    USA
    Be careful, Noel Lee & Monster Cable may sue you if you utter their name(s). Hmm, they might sue if we just type their name... :eek:

    I will never, ever, ever buy a MC product.

    Now, please return to your Beatles Remasters thread. ;)
     
  24. P2CH

    P2CH Well-Known Member

    A choke is a coil of wire formed around an iron core. Like a transformer but instead of having a primary and secondary coil, it has just the one winding. The voltage gets filtered by the induction of the magnetisim within the iron core.

    It smoothes out the ripples like a capacitor.

    Old radio sets used this method by utilizing the choke coil as the speaker magnetic force and it also served as a filter choke for the DC power supply.

    It was called a field magnet.
     
  25. Paul K

    Paul K Senior Member

    Location:
    Toronto, Canada
    So my sending my system through an APC UPS is a bad idea guys?

    What am I doing wrong?
     
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