The Black Sabbath album by album thread (1970-2013)

Discussion in 'Music Corner' started by GodShifter, Jul 20, 2013.

  1. old school

    old school Senior Member

    I wonder if that is a real photo from Cal Jam? I don't remember if he played a double bass? My guess he did not can anybody confirm?
     
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  2. Ben Adams

    Ben Adams Forum Resident

    Location:
    Phoenix, AZ, USA
    Here, why don't you see for yourself?

     
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  3. old school

    old school Senior Member

    Well he sure did. It was so hot that day I don't know how I survived I was a young lad of 20 that must of helped. Thank You for the clip Ben.
     
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  4. antonkk

    antonkk Senior Member

    Location:
    moscow
    Wow! That's cool - any ideas where to buy it?
     
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  5. antonkk

    antonkk Senior Member

    Location:
    moscow
    Spot on though I really like Eternal Idol and Tyr covers. The worst are Dehumanizer, Forbidden and The Devil You Know but then Dio really exceeded in choosing cringeworthy facepalm kindergarden album covers - think any of his later day DIO covers!:D

    :laugh::laugh::laugh:
     
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  6. antonkk

    antonkk Senior Member

    Location:
    moscow

    A vert good review though I really like Keep it Warm and find Gillan's vocals on the title track absolutely phenomenal. In fact I think the title track is the most powerful thing they recorded without Ozzy and equals some of the classic line up's finest moments.
     
  7. antonkk

    antonkk Senior Member

    Location:
    moscow
    My favorite post 1978 Sabbath photo

    [​IMG]
     
  8. Trillmeister

    Trillmeister Forum Resident

    Location:
    England
    Outstanding. :edthumbs:
     
  9. Trillmeister

    Trillmeister Forum Resident

    Location:
    England
    As Jason has said, it must be a great thing to recall the experience of this era in action. Someone really needs to work on the celebrated 'Paris show' and put out an official vid.
     
  10. Remurmur

    Remurmur Music is THE BEST! -FZ

    Location:
    Ohio
    Well oh right! Looks like I can finally review a Sabbath album in real time, rather than weeks later as has been my recent pattern. That has been mostly due to an oppressive work schedule the last few weeks, but as I am on vacation this week, I still hope to get caught up with reviews of Sabotage, Technical Ecstasy, and Never say Die. ( if anyone is even still interested at this point).

    Born Again is the first of several Sabbath albums that I did not buy until years after their actual release dates. The only exceptions to this are Past Lives, Live at Hammersmith, Reunion, and 13.

    There were two reasons that I did not pick up Born Again for decades, even though I actually had the opportunity to pick it up early in the game as a cut out. One was that as a die hard Deep Purple Mk II fan, I was well aware of Ian Gillan’s vocal style. When I heard that Ian had replaced Dio , I just could not see him, or hear him as a member of Black Sabbath. A great vocalist to be sure, but IMO totally unsuited for member ship in our beloved Sabs.

    The second reason was the now famous “sludge of sound” which it seemed that everyone who had heard the album was especially obsessed over. It sounds horrible. It’s so muddy. Etc ...etc .
    So, this one went unpurchased and unheard for a long time, even after I had finally picked up on some equally neglected Sabbath albums like 7th Star and Eternal Idol.

    But about a year or so ago, I read an online review of the Castle Deluxe version of Born Again where the reviewer raved about the cleaned up sound, citing it as a huge improvement. I punched it up on Amazon and as fate would have it, they were running a sale where I could pick up the 2 CD set for just a hair over $20.

    Now, when it comes to music, I sometimes get myself in trouble by being seduced by a “too good to turn down “sale price and then later regretting my decision as I have now ended up with a real clunker in the old collection where I would have been far better served by a full priced purchase of something a bit more worthy.

    So, how do I feel about this one?

    Let’s start with the sound. If this is a cleaned up version of the original LP and I assume, original CD release, then I have to wonder what the hell it sounded like originally. To me, there are no highs here at all except for the occasional hint of cymbals and the typically great Iommi solos that mange to fight their way through by sheer force of will. Everything else is covered in a sonic mud of bass that rather effectively holds to music to the floor like a novice Freshman High School wrestler being pinned to the mat by the returning Senior state champion. You can really hear it on the lead off track Trashed. The music never has a chance to sit up and breathe properly, even though you can hear that there is actually some really cool stuff there.

    And let’s talk a bit about Ian. His vocal delivery on Born Again was everything that I feared. Now, I say this with total respect as I am a huge Deep Purple fan , but his vocal style just doesn’t suit the material . It simply does not have that much needed hint of ominous rumbling or barely concealed evil intent, or mental anguish that both Ozzy and Dio were able to impart to their respective material. Ian tries to compensate by wailing …and wailing….and wailing… a very effective effect at the start of DP’s Highway Star but here? No. It becomes a bit more tiresome each time it is employed, and eventually evolves just short of Spinal Tap ridiculousness. Very sad to see as we all know Ian is one hell of a great vocalist. But here, the context is all wrong.

    Tony certainly tries hard to compensate. Trashed features some typically stellar guitar work as does Disturbing the Priest, Zero the Hero, and even Digital Bitch (I so want this song to actually be about Sharon!….;) ). In fact, there is plenty of good to great guitar here …when you can actually properly hear it. Same with Geezer. He manages to rise up above the morass here and there with some nice bass riffing, but too often his presence is more felt than heard, and heard in a bad way due to sonic circumstances totally beyond his control. Bill is certainly a welcome return, and sounds good for the most part but he certainly does not swing as much as the old days here and as already stated by Godshifter, (and I agree), curse the rise of the gated 80’s drum sound on a Sabbath record ! Curse it. We hates it forever! (gollum gollum)

    By the way, regarding the instrumentals: I quite like Stonehenge . But The Dark sounds to me like the moaning of a demonically possessed, or maybe just drunk humpback whale . A classic throwway .

    As far as the cover goes. Yes. It is wretched but I can always keep it pointed at the wall while I play the album so what's done is done.

    So. What’s the final verdict from me on Born Again?

    I am glad that I have finally heard it, and glad that I now own it. And not to sound snotty but I am very happy that I did not pay full price for it. Yes, it is a definitely a stumble , but one that still has just enough to recommend it that I do consider it to be a keeper and for me, there is just enough Sabbath here to justify an occasional spin.

    I do find it telling though that by the end of the Born Again tour, Bill was gone (again), Bev Bevan had booked back to the land of ELO, Gillan could not flee fast enough to the shelter of the reformed Deep Purple Mk II, and even Geezer had decided that he had had enough, leaving poor Tony holding the bag and with possession of the Sabbath name which was no doubt a cold comfort indeed as he was now totally without a band and the sole remaining original Sabbath member.

    Which of course will lead us to the next album.

    When Godshifter is ready.
     
  11. Efus

    Efus Senior Member

    Location:
    USA
    Is it just my imagination, or are those 2 double basses different sizes?
    The one on Ward's left looks bigger than the right one.
     
  12. Akhorahil

    Akhorahil Well-Known Member

    Location:
    San Diego, CA
    Well Anton, you aren't going to book a flight to Los Angeles, right? Just google it and you'll find several internet stores that are closer to your home.
     
  13. zen

    zen Senior Member

    Great shot.

    Which reminds me....the deluxe edition of Born Again should have stuck to the (above) photo session.
    But since the bonus disc does include Bev Bevon on drums, I can understand having a LIVE photo or
    two, but it really should have been reserved for the back end of the booklet only. For whatever reason,
    I don't like seeing those promo shots of the live lineup so visible for an album with Bill Ward drumming.

    Rant over. :)
     
  14. Barnabas Collins

    Barnabas Collins Senior Member

    Location:
    NH
    I was listening to the Born Again Unmixed Demos bootleg last night. Does anyone know much about the background on that one? I don't understand the title as the songs sound mixed to me, just mixed differently. The running order is changed and the song "The Fallen" is included. A couple of songs are extended, such as "Stonehenge", which goes on for about 5 minutes. "Trashed" sounds unfinished though as it's missing the final verse and chorus with the last minute or so played as an instrumental. It's an interesting alternative to the album proper if you're a Born Again fan as I am. It's really too bad "The Fallen" wasn't released because it's a pretty killer track, IMO.
     
  15. Mooger

    Mooger Forum Resident

    Location:
    Newnan, Georgia
  16. zen

    zen Senior Member

    Good god no! :laughup:

    And while you're at it, keep away from the digital...[​IMG] ITCH!!!
     
  17. Barnabas Collins

    Barnabas Collins Senior Member

    Location:
    NH
    :laugh::laugh::laugh:
     
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  18. Remurmur

    Remurmur Music is THE BEST! -FZ

    Location:
    Ohio

    SSSSSHHHHAAAARRRRROOOOONNNNN!!!!!!!

    Good god no is right ...:)
     
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  19. ModernDayWarrior

    ModernDayWarrior Senior Member

    The Fallen was released on thr recent deluxe edition of Born Again.

    There's a story about the demos that it was taken from Bill Wards collection by his ex girlfriend at the time. I don't know how true that is but that was a story when the demos surfaced. Those demos were gold imo when they were released. I'm a big fan of Born Again. The Fallen was a great unreleased track.
     
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  20. Rapid Fire

    Rapid Fire Hyperactive!

    Location:
    Mansfield, TX, USA
    Born Again is a decent album with 2 standout tracks (Trashed and Zero the Hero). Digital Bitch is an alright song but the rest of the tracks are not very good at all. I have to admit when this was released I was hoping for a real good album with my favorite Deep Purple singer Ian Gillan being involved, but I was (and still am) disappointed.
     
  21. Strummergas

    Strummergas Senior Member

    Location:
    Queens, NY
    I have to apologize to "Live Evil" for calling it "S**t Sandwich". I should have saved that phrase for Born Again. This album sucks from top to bottom. Absolutely wretched. Terrible mix with it being all drums and vocals, and when you do hear guitar like on Tony's solos, his tone blows. Aside from that you get Gillan screaming like a little girl every 30 seconds and his lyrics are some of the most lunkheaded I've ever heard. The only thing on this album that's not a total steaming pile is the riff for Zero The Hero, and that isn't even that great. Claus said this album is "heavy metal parody", and I couldn't agree more. It's truly difficult to come to terms with the fact that one of my favorite bands put out a turd like this!

    Say what you want about Dio (and I'm not a huge fan of him myself), but it's truly mind-boggling that anyone can prefer Gillan over him in Black Sabbath. There's no accounting for taste I guess.
     
  22. Big Pasi

    Big Pasi Forum Resident

    Location:
    Vaasa, Finland
    I think Born Again is a great album. Bill Ward's drumming is excellent! (at least compared with Heaven And Hell IMO)

    I like all songs on side one very much, but from the second side I only like the title track. Strangely I have no difficulties with the sound everybody talks about.

    And I would really like to have a complete concert recording from this tour. The one on the deluxe edition is too short. I've heard a live version of Heaven And Hell and besides Gillan's voice cracking a few times it's excellent. Also on the b**tleg the version of Zero The Hero was better than the one on DE.

    Like I wrote earlier I just love the Mob Rules / Live Evil / Born Again-trilogy. That was my introduction to Sabbath and it has kind of stopped there, altough about a year ago I tried to listen to all of their albums but I did not get much out of them - especially the albums after Born Again. Osbourne-era is good, but... I don't know...
     
  23. Strummergas

    Strummergas Senior Member

    Location:
    Queens, NY
    OK, that is one thing I'll concede on for Born Again. It's nice to hear Bill behind the kit again. Vinnie might work better for Ronnie, but Bill works better for Sabbath.
     
  24. Pavol Stromcek

    Pavol Stromcek Senior Member

    Location:
    SF Bay Area
    Wow, Born Again appears to be the most polarizing Sabbath album thus far. I'm still surprised that it provokes such intensely negative reactions.
     
  25. zen

    zen Senior Member

    [​IMG]

    Most of the blame (for the negative reactions) lies with the guy without the mustache in this B&W picture.

    :laugh:
     
    Last edited: Sep 8, 2013

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