Should I get a SACD/DVD-A player?

Discussion in 'Audio Hardware' started by williaty, Jul 22, 2014.

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  1. williaty

    williaty Forum Resident Thread Starter

    I currently have a very good CD player and a very good DAC. Every once in a while, I wonder about getting a basic universal disc player to pick up SACD and DVD-A playback and then using it solely as a transport with my existing DAC. However, even basic universal players aren't cheap. The cheapest I can find is the Oppo BD-103, which is $500. That's a pretty steep price tag for two formats that are basically dead already.

    What's got me thinking about this is that I occasionally bump into a SACD when I'm out shopping for used CDs. Reading about some of the high-quality remasters made lately, it seems like a lot of them went to SACD and the CDs are tough to find (and therefore expensive) if they were made at all. I'd kind of like to have access to some of the better remastering work that's been done over the last 10 years and that seems to require SACD playback.

    Here's the counterpoint: I don't believe SACD is capable of sounding any better to human ears than CD. This is NOT something I want to discuss in this thread as no good will come of it. If you disagree, leave it alone. You guys just need to know where I'm coming from to give relevant advice. I'm an objectivist and a rationalist. I simply do not believe the woo and non-science that people can hear the difference between properly-done Redbook and SACD/DVD-A/high-res download. So, to me, the ONLY reason to go to another shiny silver disc format is if it gets me access to a catalog of good work that I can't get on CD.


    So what do you guys think? Is there enough music that's available ONLY on SACD/DVD-A (especially 20th century instrumental work [Glass, Pärt, etc] and remasters of rock music), or only available affordably on SACD/DVD-A to justify spending $500 on a universal disc player?


    Edited to add: Two channel only, music only
     
    Last edited: Jul 22, 2014
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  2. TarnishedEars

    TarnishedEars Forum Resident

    Location:
    The Seattle area
    SACD is not a dead format. AF, AP, Mofi and Universal-Japan have been releasing ever increasing numbers of new SACDs over the past 3+ years or so. Just peruse the new releases SA-CD.net to see some of the recent releases. Although admittedly, finding new music on this format is not common anymore. It's now mostly an audiophile niche format, much like Vinyl has become over the past 2 decades.

    DVD-A is basically dead though. But BlueRay Audio is not, and the Oppos will play those disks too.

    But since you've already made-up your mind, (apparently without listening) that there is no difference at all between the various formats, I really don't understand why you would then be considering throwing-away your money your hard-earned money on this format.
     
    Frans likes this.
  3. Gary

    Gary Nauga Gort! Staff

    Location:
    Toronto
    Because he said:
    I tend to agree. If something is released on SACD the mastering is usually (always?) quite good. They know their target market are folks who have stand alone stereo systems and could cost in the thousands. Sometimes 10s of thousands. So something compressed and really, really loud would sound horrible on one of these systems, but just fine on a shelf system, laptop, boom box, cheaper computer speakers, etc. There's always exceptions, of course. :)
     
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  4. KeithH

    KeithH Success With Honor...then and now

    Location:
    Beaver Stadium
    I say definitely go for SACD. If you find a player in your budget that has DVD-Audio, that's a bonus, but I don't feel that DVD-Audio is essential. Few titles are coming out on DVD-Audio these days, and many older titles that are out of print are pricey now. SACD, however, is going strong.

    You mentioned $500. I don't think you will find much new at that price point. The cheapest Oppo player, which adds Blu-Ray, may be an option. Otherwise, used Denon DVD-Video/DVD-Audio/SACD players are a bargain.
     
    Galley likes this.
  5. triple

    triple Senior Member

    Location:
    Zagreb, Croatia
    CD's are hard to find? AFAIK all SACD reissues are hybrids. Like TarnishedEars above, I don't get it either.
     
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  6. I bought a Harman/Kardon H/K DVD-47 used for $50 as I wanted an inexpensive player that could handle SACD (it also plays DVD-A/MP3/ WMA).
     
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  7. testikoff

    testikoff Seasoned n00b

    Not so with Universal's SHM-SACDs. Those are single-layer SACD-only discs.
     
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  8. Brother_Rael

    Brother_Rael Senior Member

    If it was me is get a good starter model that was a big bucks player a few years ago. Denon DVD-3930 would be worth checking out. That also did HDCD. Cambridge BD650 too. Both will come in under your budget. The Denon significantly so as is the older player. I'd be my pick too.
     
    RonW likes this.
  9. tootull

    tootull Looking through a glass onion

    Location:
    Canada
    Should I get a SACD/DVD-A player?
    Yes! SACD for sure. SACD sounds the most welcoming to me, a favourite format. I use DVD-A mostly for surround sound.
     
  10. Echo

    Echo Forum Resident

    I was for long in the same position as the OP. Most SACD's are indeed hybrid, but there are enough exceptions. In the last three years you have also SHM-SACDs of Universal Japan which are not hybrid, but the most recent ones have also the same mastered versions at SHM-cd (platinum or non-platinum), so you don't really need a SACD player for listening great recordings.

    Still I bought a new SACD player besides my fabulous cd player (see my personal info). My reason was using the SACD player as a kind of spare playback system. The fact I'm able now to play also SACDs is for me just a win-win situation. Is the SACD format better? Maybe a bit, but that was not for me the most important.
     
  11. JMCIII

    JMCIII Music lover first, audiophile second.



    Look, you want to try high-res on the cheap? Look for a Pioneer DV-79AVVi on the used market. They go for around $150 and smoke some newer models that cost far more. I did, and I'm very glad someone pointed this model out to me. SACD/DVD-A/ and even decent CD (though you already have that covered). Just my two cents of course, but it's a great way to get into high-res for little initial outlay - and may solve your problem permanently.
     
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  12. ElvisCaprice

    ElvisCaprice Forum Resident

    Location:
    Jaco, Costa Rica
    Not I, I'm not going the stand alone SACD route. If they can't give us a format that we can manipulate on our PC's, freely and easily, then I'm not going to give them my business. Most stereo SACD masters are available on CD. CD is good enough for me on my Hugo, I can't tell a difference between Hi Res and Redbook/PCM.
    If it can't travel with me on the road via hard drive, then it's not a format for me.
     
    Last edited: Jul 22, 2014
  13. Joey_Corleone

    Joey_Corleone Forum Resident

    Location:
    Rockford, MI

    If your only motivation is to have access to stuff you can't get on CD I would say it is not worth it.
     
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  14. c-eling

    c-eling They're made of light,We never would have guessed

    I agree Joe, quite a few of the new ones coming out of Japan, (sacd) are coming out in RB also and the MFSL/AF are hybrids so if the OP wants the same mastering they are available, most old SACD have a remaster cd counterpart, ie Depeche Mode, Gabriel etc, I personally wouldn't bother givin the OP's wants, I have three sacd players, my main-Oppo, does not get much play these days
     
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  15. tmtomh

    tmtomh Forum Resident

    In my view, this statement is the whole story - you don't need SACD or DVD-A playback. As others have noted, virtually every piece of music, and almost every good mastering, is available in regular redbook CD format.

    It is true that some of the recent Universal SHM-SACDs are not hybrids - they contain no CD layer. And it's also true that there are a few DVD-As out there with unique masterings. But in the larger scheme of things these are a very small number of albums - and again, even if the DVD-A or single-layer SACD in question has a different mastering than the CD, there's no guarantee you would feel it is a better mastering than the CD.

    I say this as someone who does have a universal player (Oppo BDP-105) and who can hear the improvement with SACD over CD. But for your stated needs, I think it would be a waste.
     
  16. thegage

    thegage Forum Currency Nerd

    Don't bother. For many the point of SACD is better sound, not an expanded catalog. Since you've made up your mind, use the money to find more CDs with good mastering.

    John K.
     
  17. oxenholme

    oxenholme Senile member

    Location:
    Knoydart
    The beauty of the Oppo is that it will play pretty well anything. So you can use it as transport for anything you're likely to encounter. However, I'm not sure what inputs you have for your DAC. You might not be able to enjoy the best possible resolution from the Oppo. But a really good DAC most likely makes that academic.

    I have the BDP-105, not the 103. I find its stereo playback remarkably good from any 5" disc or hard drive /USB format including flac and whatever format Itunes download in. I'd love to know of any DAC that can better it, affordable or otherwise!

    But, as has been hinted at already, there isn't a right lot available on SACD, DVD-A and Blu-ray that isn't available on CD.
     
    Frans likes this.
  18. Wildgift

    Wildgift This is the modern world that I've heard about...

    Location:
    Stamford, CT
    Find a used/discount denon dbp-1611. I use it for sacd, dvd-a and bluray. Built solid and sounds great
     
  19. williaty

    williaty Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Thanks for the input guys. Sounds like there's really no reason for me to spend the money on a SACD player. That $500 will buy about 1,000 CDs on the used market around here, so that's the road I'm going to take (slowly, over time, obviously).
     
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  20. manuelgalvezferri

    manuelgalvezferri New Member

    Location:
    miami, fl
    I strongly suggest you to get SACD. Mytek Digital not that long ago came out with a DSD ('Direct Stream Digital' - the underlying technology behind SACD) DAC and I'm also looking at other things converting SACD to hi-rez PCM.
     
  21. bhazen

    bhazen I Am The Walrus

    Location:
    Deepest suburbia
    Do nothing.

    While I don't discount the opinions of SACD enthusiasts (and I own SACD hybrid discs, a SACD/CD deck and a very good DAC), I've come to the conclusion that improvements in DACs (and playback of Redbook through same) have rendered SACD moot. With my setup (Onkyo deck feeding Rega DAC) I can discern no qualitative improvement in sound from CD to SACD. Redbook seems to have been a pretty cannily-designed format after all!
     
  22. williaty

    williaty Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Yeah that's my take on it as well. The math works, the format is sound. It's just taken 30 years to get the playback and recording/mixing/mastering equipment to finally catch up to what the math is capable of reproducing.
     
  23. bhazen

    bhazen I Am The Walrus

    Location:
    Deepest suburbia
    Exactly!

    If you're interested, read an article in the Audio Critic (Peter Aczel) webzine (10/17/07) about a double-blind test between CD and SACD.
     
    Last edited: Jul 22, 2014
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  24. mds

    mds Forum Resident

    Location:
    PA
    The posters question is confusing, as someone mentioned you can play SACDs CDs on a plain jane redbook player. If you do not believe you can hear the SACD difference then just buy the SACD CDs and play it on your existing player, end of story. If you are curious about SACD and want to try it out, you have to pay bigger prices for the player used or new. From what I have seen a lot of SACD CDs are more expensive to boot, its a highend medium and highend has its higher ticket price. Once you have the collection of SACD CDs and the player to play SACD CDs on you will then want to upgrade the rest of your system to really hear and appreciate the difference, so is this just an excuse to go out and upgrade your entire system?
     
  25. pscreed

    pscreed Upstanding Member

    Location:
    Land of the Free
    Sure. Next question?
     
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