Yes!? NO! - The all purpose Yes arguing and complaining thread

No prob. No way I'm wading through 43 pages to find it though...

 

OK fair enough. I can relate to that.

I am a hard core Yes fan. I have seen every tour since 1978. Many tours I have seen multiple times. They are still playing great songs and Chris Squire and Steve Howe are still playing their parts very well. And one never knows if any current tour will be the last tour. I like seeing my musical heroes play live in person. I even like seeing Alan White even though he is a shell of the musician he used to be. He's still Alan White. I don't like Davison's voice but he can actually sing the songs so he is not much of a distraction and he comes off as a good guy and a real yesman at heart. I am quite dissatisfied with Downes. I think he lacks that chops to be playing the music they are playing on stage. But I'm not going to let that one big problem ruin the whole thing for me. OTOH I'm not going to pretend it isn't a problem or rationalize the guy's obvious lack of ability.

 

an alan white solo today? haha, he can't do enough to hide from the spotlight with his old man performance

 

Stray observations:

- Bruford wrote the main theme to AYAI.
- Wakeman saw a crack on the wall, not in the egg. The egg analogy was used to describe how he and Jon were both moving towards GFTO along different paths. TFTO being the middle of the egg, when they were farthest apart musically. I know large stretches of "YesYears" by heart, and I have no life.

Complaints (this is the place for them, after all):

I just watched the San Jose webcast, and would like to moan about the following things:

This was probably the worst Siberian Khatru I've ever seen (and known), and they've rarely gone beyond "acceptable" performances of this lately. In fact, the whole CTTE album is pretty terrible. The title track is probably the one song I wish they'd retired altogether after SLO. The webcast version wasn't the worst I've heard, though. GD seems to have found a way around the technical challenges. AYAI could've been a decent enough version, if only Geoff's keyboards cut through more on the big orchestral sections (the "main theme" I refer to above). This has annoyed me greatly on recent tours, and I can't understand why they don't bring him up in the mix for these passages. It's the big money shot of the song, and it's supposed to be grand and overwhelming and majestic, and all I hear is Chris and Alan marking time while someone fiddles with a Casio backstage...

I hope they drop CTTE from the complete album rotation.

Fragile is a lot better, certainly more interesting. Pretty solid Roundabout, and South Side was actually kinda great. The "miniatures" are amusing, but uninvolving, and the karaoke aspect doesn't help. C&B is basically GF playing along to a pre-recorded track, and not always in synch. WHH and The Fish also rely heavily on canned vocals and instruments, and I wonder if there isn't possibly a metronome or some such helping them out on 5% (which admittedly is over before you have time to give a damn). The main group tracks are competently handled, though. Even HOTS, which has been the victim of many trainwrecks, came off pretty well. Steve pulls off a good MFAD, too. At the end of the day, though, the "complete album" conceit seems a bit pointless with this one. A regular setlist featuring Roundabout, SSOTS, LDR/Fish and HOTS would've gone over just as well, and made room for one more substantial track (how about something from Tormato or Drama?).

The new tracks were also pretty good, considering. Steve almost derailed Believe Again, but they pulled it back on track. Unlike many others, I find The Game to be one of the weakest tracks on (the IMO highly mediocre) H&E, but at least it's simple enough for them to recreate live without losing whatever energy there is in it to begin with. And it's fun to see Alan's "third arm" pop out from nowhere to whack a cymbal.

ISAGP is lacklustre. OOALH is the closer, and Steve has now deigned to replicate Rabin's effect-laden sound for the solo, even if he stays firmly in his comfort zone otherwise. I would probably be outside the venue at this point, I'm sad to say.

 

OK fair enough. I can relate to that.

 

I agree, but you missed the point.
YES had a fan base well before Roundabout. And they had their original lineup. I am certain there are many who, upon hearing Roundabout for the first time, or even heard The Yes Album or Fragile, likely bulked because their favorite Yes members had bailed.

 

Jazz is a genr of music that originated in African-American communities during the late 19th and early 20th century. Jazz emerged in many parts of the United States of independent popular musical styles; linked by the common bonds of European American and African-American musical parentage with a performance orientation

American, sure, but originating from African-American communities.

 

I am not sure, but jazz and blues are heavily related, I guess. Their roots are the same anyway, methinks.

 

As I stated upthread, jazz and country come from the blues. Lots of misconceptions exist -- this is only one of the reasons why jazz is misunderstood and cast aside. As an American, all I can say that it's quite ironic that my nation would claim it as its own, only to ignore it.

 

The roots of Jazz are multi faceted and multi cultural. It did not soley originate from African American communities. Yes a lot of it is derived from gospel and blues which in and of itself is American due to many western influences not purely African. But Jazz also has major roots in very non African western brass bands and Creole culture which again is far from purely African. So ultimately much like America itself Jazz represents a melting pot of cultural influences and is ultimately an American invention not an African one. and that IS why, unlike many pure African musical traditions jazz actually does share a lot of common language with western classical music which was the original point being argued.

 

Jazz did not come from the blues. Show me one traditional blues act that was an all brass band. Most early jazz bands were purely brass bands! Country certainly did not come from the blues. Country has much much more ties to Irish and English folk music along with some French folk music. The fiddle playing Hillbillies in Appalachia were not playing the blues. They were playing western folk music Yes, the blues had an impact on Jazz and even on country but that is hardly the primary root of either jazz or country.

 

Please stop. You are not doing yourself any favors.

 

Do you have anything of substance to say on the subject?

For your education on early jazz here is a nice article with some great sound clips. http://www.redhotjazz.com/jazz1917.html
You might note that they are either all brass or brass and percussion. these bands clearly are not blues bands. There is actually very little if any blues influence on much of this music.

 

I already did, and you made sure to have it deleted yesterday. Again, please stop, and stick to areas of music you know something about.

 

You think cheap insults directed at fellow forum members is the same thing a substantial point about music? OK......

But hey, please feel free to share your vast knowledge of Jazz and it's origins. Please show how jazz is a direct derivative of blues. I have already given you some relevant info to start with on early jazz bands. Please show how their music is purely blues based. I await your highly knowledgeable response. I'm sure we will all be so much better educated on the roots of jazz.

 

Ummm... W.C. Handy?

 

Do not think that being a member here since 2002 is something to be worn as a badge of honor. I already said what I have to say, but you're intent on disagreeing with me for whatever reason. When I start seeing you post in some jazz threads then I'll know you actually listen to stuff you're spouting off about aimlessly, like the guy above who thinks that the slaves were Bach aficionados. Just let it go.

 

Only reason is because you are getting it wrong. But hey, if you think credibility is born from posting in jazz threads.....You could actually take a look at all the relevant info I linked for your benefit. I didn't see anyone in this thread claiming slaves were Bach aficionados. I saw someone claim, correctly, that jazz and western classical music share a lot of common musical language. It's really not that hard to research the roots of jazz and the roots of country and see that jazz has roots in western music as well as blues and that country has a clear lineage derived from European folk music.

But anyway, sorry about talking so much about music. Apparently you really want that to stop for some reason.

 

What about them?

 

Was he looking for the Water Closet?

 

Rrrright... I have to assume somebody's trying to be funny here and failing... Orchestra? Brass? Blues? Jazz? You've got it:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/W._C._Handy

 

It was probably a fail before I posted it, but considering all the winning jokes I post, some of them have to fall flat and fail.

 

I didn't mean you, I only saw your post after I replied...

 

I think the definitions below give a pretty accurate picture, although I have also read some (slightly) dissenting opinions on the origins of jazz and country.

[1] http://teacher.scholastic.com/activities/bhistory/history_of_jazz.htm
[2] http://www.scaruffi.com/history/country.html

As for the jazz here is a basic list of its ingredients:

http://www.jazzinamerica.org/lessonplan/5/1/249

 

Patrick Moraz was pretty jazzy.


We are heading toward part two of this thread aren't we?