Cables, cables, cables...any tips? In the market (maybe)

Discussion in 'Audio Hardware' started by rob303, Oct 22, 2014.

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  1. rob303

    rob303 Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Location:
    Denver, CO
    So the expensive HiFi boutique cables are "voiced" and the well-constructed mass-produced varieties (Belden, Mogami, Canare) are basically neutral?
     
  2. gloomrider

    gloomrider Well-Known Member

    Location:
    Hollywood, CA, USA
    Other posters point out that "neutral" behavior is really dependent on the gear at each end. This is why most recommend trying different cables to see what works and what does not.
     
    rob303 likes this.
  3. JBryan

    JBryan Forum Resident

    Location:
    St Louis
    Using cables and wires to EQ your system is a temporary fix at best. The problem you're hearing is 2 or more components not working well together so plugging in a silver IC or wire to increase detail and high frequencies or copper to decrease brightness and add warmth is simply masking the problem at hand.

    In a perfect system, the wire's influence on the sound would be more obvious and the difference in wires would be easy to hear and choosing a preference would be much simpler. In fact, if we all had the perfect system, we'd only need one specification of wire and the cable companies would be mostly competing on price alone. Unfortunately, few of us have ever come close to putting together a perfect set up (including the room and power, of course) and thus leave the door open for a myriad of cable and wire choices which in turn, makes the search and decision that much more difficult.

    The best tip is to understand your system from the power coming from your outlets to the sound waves reflecting off the walls, ceilings and floors. Some folks start with the speakers, others, the sources - regardless, each choice will to a great extent, dictate the parameters for the next pice of gear in the chain. After you've put together the most synergistic system that appeals to your tastes and budget, then the process of choosing ICs, wires and power chords will become much simpler and straight-forward. Short of that, expect a much more 'hit and miss' approach that will take much more time and most likely end up with much less satisfying results.

    Barring any of the above advise, I'd suggest that you listen to some IC's and wires from Blue Jeans, Grover, Cardas and JPS. That way, you'll have a pretty good idea of what's out there at various price points and you can decide what works for you. If you haven't, check out The Cable Company (http://www.thecableco.com) as they have a good trial offer. Have fun!
     
    mreeter, Dave, Upinsmoke and 2 others like this.
  4. jupiterboy

    jupiterboy Forum Residue

    Location:
    Buffalo, NY
    Nope. Canare slurs the transients, but has good detail in the mids, IN MY SYSTEM.
     
    rob303 likes this.
  5. rob303

    rob303 Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Location:
    Denver, CO
    My BJ LC-1s are so shielded they don't bend! Why no shielding for Kimber?! Seems counter to the intended goal. I live in the middle of Denver metro, pop. 2.6 million. I'm 99% analog, so I'd think shielding is necessary.

    Anyone have experience with Shunyata ICs or SCs? Those guys seem on top of things.
     
  6. James_S888

    James_S888 Forum Resident

    I have Shunyata Interconnects between phono preamp and amp.
    Works very well. Neutral I think.
    The rest is all Cardas. I will at some point try Cardas between the phono and the amp.

    The Cardas speaker cables are the best I've had in my system so far. I had transparent reference previously.
     
    rob303 and Long Live Analog like this.
  7. octaneTom

    octaneTom Man of Leisure

    Well, that'd be easy enough to prove - just measure the end signal with cable A vs. cable B and see if there is a difference in the waveform.
     
  8. Long Live Analog

    Long Live Analog Forum Resident

    Location:
    West Tn. Mid South
    Rob, I'm not sure why Kimber designs their cables this way. I remember reading an article about Ray Kimber explaining their design and technique. Interesting in the construction of the cables, might find something about the design on YouTube or call them....Shunyata is top shelf design, good juju happening there I also like Cardas....
     
    rob303 likes this.
  9. ssmith3046

    ssmith3046 Forum Resident

    Location:
    Arizona desert
    Love my Morrow interconnects and speaker cables.
     
    deniall and rob303 like this.
  10. brooklyn

    brooklyn I'm all ears

    Location:
    Oklahoma
    Cables should be neutral but that’s usually not the case. I have heard differences in cables in my system
    but these differences are usually negotiable. Would I spend big money on exotic cables? No…
     
    Wngnt90 and rob303 like this.
  11. Wngnt90

    Wngnt90 Forum Resident

    Good answer!
     
    Jerryb likes this.
  12. Upinsmoke

    Upinsmoke Well-Known Member

    Location:
    SE PA
    Very well put. I believe it also comes down to price point on the cabling being trialed in any given system. Given some of the outrageous prices being asked for some cabling (eg. speaker cable for $7000 that nets you a 10' run) wouldn't that money be better sourced to upgrading speakers, sources, amps, etc. where there can be a drastic change in the reproduction of sounds. If any fine tuning is going to be done by a non neutral cable (speaker or IC) I'd want to be damm sure that the rest of the system is up to snuff.

    I believe it's highly dependent on having the right level of equipment too where you could hear the subtle difference. Also as we age there's variances in our hearing. So a 20 year old may be content with one sound and a 50-70 with the associated loss of hearing may hear it differently and adjust to their own personal taste.
     
    bluesky and rob303 like this.
  13. Wngnt90

    Wngnt90 Forum Resident

    I'm too darn busy listening to my favorite music on my favorite gear to jump in to the endless search for better sounding cables. IMO IC's and speaker cable/wire should have no "sound". I use what makes sense and follows the proven rules of moving electrons around in a circuit.
     
    timind and formu_la like this.
  14. Jim in Houston

    Jim in Houston The Godfather of Alt-Country & Punk

    Location:
    Houston, TX, USA
    Why is the assumption that the inexpensive cable is the neutral one?
     
    F1nut and gloomrider like this.
  15. bluesky

    bluesky Senior Member

    Location:
    south florida, usa
    Happiness is finding your perfect cables.

    Then... you can just forget about the cables. Forever.

    :)
     
  16. samurai

    samurai Step right up! See the glory, of the royal scam.

    Location:
    MINNESOTA
    My suggestion, narrow the number of cables you are interested in testing and then contact The Cable Company.
    They have a extensive lending library through which you can try many different cables.
    No matter what anyone says you can only judge cables in your own system.
     
  17. tim185

    tim185 Forum Resident

    Location:
    Australia
    concur!!
     
  18. LeeS

    LeeS Music Fan

    Location:
    Atlanta
    In my experience, the better cables are actually neutral and add as little of their own sonic signature to the sound as possible. There are certainly some cables that sound warm or at the other end of the spectrum a bit overly detailed. However the very best cables just let more of the music through so you get resolution and musicality without the unnecessary and often complicating "EQ".

    But there are other important factors to get right for the very best results including: power conditioning, room acoustics, speaker placement, isolation, etc.

    So many things add up to creating the best possible playback. And the more resolving your system becomes, the more you hear more of what the smaller tweaks can do.
     
    Tommyboy and Lonson like this.
  19. samurai

    samurai Step right up! See the glory, of the royal scam.

    Location:
    MINNESOTA
    IMO: There are reasonably priced cables that are excellent.
    You do not have to go the mega-buck route (unless you want to).
     
    Lonson and jupiterboy like this.
  20. Steve Hoffman

    Steve Hoffman Your host Your Host

    Buy used. Audiophiles trade their cables in like Hugh Hefner trades in women.

    You can find expensive cables from 2003 selling for a few bucks. Just make sure that you like the sound first.
     
  21. samurai

    samurai Step right up! See the glory, of the royal scam.

    Location:
    MINNESOTA
    Good advice Steve.
     
  22. tubesandvinyl

    tubesandvinyl Forum Resident

    Steve,

    How do we acquire Hef's trade ins? ;)
     
    Brother_Rael and samurai like this.
  23. jupiterboy

    jupiterboy Forum Residue

    Location:
    Buffalo, NY
    Don't spend your money on stereo stuff, spend it on women.
     
    Joey_Corleone likes this.
  24. Robin L

    Robin L Musical Omnivore

    Location:
    Fresno, California
    My experience is that more dielectric materials in interconnect result in the highs being rolled off. I've got a meter length of old Monster Cable that stuffed with dielectric, makes for a good low-pass filter.
     
  25. beowulf

    beowulf Forum Resident

    Location:
    Chula Vista, CA
    The Cable Company has a lending library that (for a deposit) allows you to try a few different cables to find synergy. I have tried a few different types and found that I really like the sound of UP-OCC (Ohno Continuous Cast) type cables made of copper, silver or a combination of OCC alloys. I have ZenWave Audio speaker and interconnect cables which uses these types of mettalurgies. You can go from reasonably priced to crazy expensive. DaveC113 (a forum member) is the ZenWave owner and often times you can borrow some cables to see if they work with your system before you buy.
     
    rob303 likes this.
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