Power Conditioners

Hi,

I am new to this forum, so this is partly and intro. I have owned audiophile gear for over 25 years. Early on I met Pierre Sprey of Mapleshade, when he bought a CD player I own (yes, it was awhile ago). I am a professor in Baltimore, Pierre lives and works in a DC suburb, and we interacted some over the years. Mapleshade was born years after we met. I own Quicksilver monoamps, a custom preamp, and a Merdian CD player, and for years that was my system. I was pretty happy with it (and am now looking to sell it), but decided to upgrade recently, and now own a complete Mapleshade system, including an upgraded Scott amp. (Most Mapleshade hardware is upgraded versions of what others manufacture.) The system sounds great, though the age of amp makes me a little nervous. I personally think Mapleshade offers some of the best value in the audiophile world, but you need to be patient (sometimes very, very patient) with delivery times. But I digress.

The Scott amp was my last addition to the system, and initially I was far from satisfied, very quick listener fatigue. Then Pierre told me that LF is typically caused by junk thrown into the electrical system by other electrical components. So I unplugged my cable box, tv, and CD player. The difference was dramatic. I listened for 1 1/2 hours straight and was hungry for more.

The fly in the ointment is that I plan to move from my house to a condo next year. I can't control what others in the building plug into their outlets, so I am wondering about power conditioners. Some are, to say the least, pricey. Can anyone point me to any articles, etc. that will get me up to speed on power conditioners and which are the best (and/or best value)?

 

Wow, nice font you have there! While often considered snake oil on this forum, and a "quick fix" by others, I had a dramatic improvement in consistent sound from my system by installing a power conditioner. While straight into the wall in the earlier hours, most times, results in better sound with my grid, for consistent sound I found after installing a Furman Elite 15 PFi, what I consider the minimum to purchase, I got better dynamics, quicker processing of the sound. It even got the wife's seal of approval as I also plugged the TV into it and she asked me if I had adjusted it as it looked much better. She did not know of my purchase of a conditioner. Furman and Shunyata are where I would send you to look, with price/value as a factor.

 

While the term "pricey" might be relative to the individual I would say take a look at the Shunyata PS8 Power Distributor, Defender power conditioner and Venom3 HC power cable package for what I would consider a reasonably priced solution.

http://www.dedicatedaudio.com/inc/sdetail/2647/37582

 

I use a Consonance D-Linear 15 Ultra Reference power conditioner that I bought through Grant Fidelity. It has not restricted the dynamics of my amps and has resulted in a lowered noise floor. Since all of my sources, preamp and amp are plugged into it, the isolation from each other has made a difference. Though not cheap, it's price/performance ratio is high compared to other comparable power conditioners. I am happy with mine.

http://shop.grantfidelity.com/Consonance-D-Linear-15-Ultra-Reference-Power-Conditioning-System.html

 

I have a modest Monster Power Center that I bought used for $40, and I was stunned by how much of an improvement it made with my Fisher 400. It completely eliminated hum and hiss, and the music became significantly more energetic and 'quick.'

I attribute some of this to old 1961 wiring in my house, so the improvement might not be as significant in a newer home.

 

Thanks for the feedback. I sit far back from my monitor, hence the large font. I could talk myself into $2000 to rid myself of electrical garbage in a condo building.

 

Belkin PF15 or 31 IIRC the model type....superb and reasonably priced

 

I'm a PS Audio fan. Their Ultimate Outlets show up on Audiogon and EBay fairly often for $200 or less.

 

Good PCs can make a very big difference.

 

In a condo you should be looking at a power regenerator, such as the ones from PS Audio.

 

I agree. For me, PS Audio Power Plants represent the best solution.

 

There seems to be about 3 or so prevalent techs that are on the forefront of power conditioning.

(1) Regeneration (such as PS Audio),
(2) Balanced Power (such as Balanced Power Technologies, and
(3) Non-current limiting passive filtration (such as Shunyata).

It also seems like nobody can really say for sure which is best. I would think that some "may" be better in some situations. For instance if I had a dedicated 20 amp line in a home I would probably consider something passive like the Shunyata PS8/Defender Combo or balanced like the Balanced Power Technologies Ultra Isolators. If I lived in an area where my power was really bad I would consider something from PS Audio such as a used P5.

 

I know members and Steve himself have spoken very highly of Running Springs Audio power conditioners.

 

I am not a fan of regenerators. I use a Running Springs Maxim in my apartment.

 

Again, thanks for all of the feedback. I had never even heard of a power regenerator until I read F1nut's post. (Is that handle from car racing?) It does seem in principle like a good way to go. I would be grateful for more thoughts on those. Metralia, why aren't you a fan? Also, how hard is it to put a 20 amp line in a condo?

 

I'm a fan of regenerators. I've had a PS Audio P300, then a PS Audio Power Plant Premier, and this week have moved to a PS Audio P5.

 

I have and use Richard Gray's Power Company "600S" model and I notice VERY easily heard differences in my system, when I don't use it!

http://store.acousticsounds.com/d/13066/Richard_Grays_Power_Company-RGPC_600S-Line_Conditioners

By the way, I'm NOT a fan of Pierre at Mapleshade or his way over the top approach and cost of selling his "upgraded" or "modified" equipment. I bought some of it and sent it all back, as it was a LOT of fluff that he charges for, in my opinion!

 

I should add to my edited comment in post #17 above, but one of the things that I bought from Pierre was one of his "modified" SCOTT 299b tube amps. I already owned an original SCOTT 299b and what Pierre did with his "modified" version, was to kill EVERYTHING that made the 299b great to begin with, in my opinion. What he does is disconnect many of the original settings and switches, so they will no longer function, thus completely changing the original quality of the unit. I sent that back to him and ended up sending my original 299b to Craig at NOS Valves in Michigan and he did all that was needed to make my SCOTT 299b great sounding once again!

http://www.nosvalves.com/

 

Interesting, Chris. My experience has been almost the direct opposite of yours. I have been very happy with all of my Mapleshade products. So, obviously, one of us is deaf. The modified Cyrus blew away my Merdian 508, for example. I love my modified Gallos and Gallo himself speaks well of Pierre'ss mods. That said, I never heard the Cyrus or Gallos unmoded. Also, I have only given the Scott amp a serious listen for 1 1/2 hours, and have not a/b'd it with my old amplification system. I'll do that and report back.

 

I would encourage you to try before you buy, whether it is a trial period by an online retailer or a loaner through a dealer. My experience at this point is somewhat dated, but living in a single family dwelling in a semi-rural area, I was able to eliminate all power conditioning on my main system- I do have dedicated lines and have been pretty scrupulous in attending to grounding issues (out of necessity- my speakers, at around 104db efficiency- reveal all kinds of power anomalies, inter-component grounding issues, etc.).
To some extent, I suspect there is a correlation between how well a power conditioner or regenerator works in a given system and how bad the power is to begin with- a regenerator will make a bigger improvement where the power is dirty. I'm not sure how the latest crop of regenerators fare with power amps- the early ones seemed to limit current.
You might also look at isolation transformers, which can be bought as part of finished 'black box' products rather than strapped into the building wiring.
A few years ago, a review was published about Nordost products and in the review, a 'shoot-out' was done among a number of competing products. What was interesting, to me, was not the review, but the anecdotal comments of one dealer who participated in the listening evaluations. The review was published in 6 moons and the comments were made on What'sBestForum. (I'm not offering this as a 'buyer's guide,' but instead to indicate how perceptions differ over what these products bring to the table).
Oh, and welcome to this forum!

 

Any conditioner with decent voltage regulation is a plus.

 

PS Chris, the Scott amp requires a 200 hour break in. Did you give it that? I hated the Gallos out of the box. After about 50 hours, I found them listenable and more and more so as time went on.....

 

I completely agree with Bill. Until you try something in your own listening space, you can't tell if you will like it or not.

 

Excellent advice

 

I've got both a PS Audio Power Plant Premier and a BPT Balanced power conditioner. I'd give the PPP a slight nod if you just want to power front end components, which is how I use it in my audio system. I find that though the PPP can handle the load of a power amp, it does reduce dynamics and "heft" if you will. You can pick them up on A'gon for something around $1k. For my power amp I plug it into a PS Audio Duet. The BPT I use in my video system because it easily handles the load of all components, including a plasma display.

John K.