What are some competitors to the Oppo 105D?

This should probably be a separate thread since it's becoming a long threadcrap.

http://forums.stevehoffman.tv/threa...ent-need-a-burn-in-period.92735/#post-2040131

http://physics.info/dielectrics/

John K.

 

Hi Monkeyman,

Here's a few one box solution CD/SACD decks around the $3K price point............

http://www.us.marantz.com/us/Produc...d=ReferenceSeries&SubCatId=0&ProductId=SA11S3
Might score a used/demo model of the above for close to $3K

Also..........
http://au.denon.com/au/product/HiFiComponents/SACDCDPlayers/DCD2020AE
and.......
http://usa.yamaha.com/products/audio-visual/hifi-components/cd-players/cd-s2100_g/?mode=model

Lastly........
http://www.teac.com/product/cd-3000/buy_now/
Bit cheaper but might be great for all I know!!


Cheers

 

I own a Ayre C-5xeMP which I love, but the Reference SACD player from Marantz would be a close second. Even the 14! (http://www.us.marantz.com/us/Produc...d=ReferenceSeries&SubCatId=0&ProductId=SA14S1)

 

I did the same comparison since I have an Esoteric sa50 and the OPPO 105 was anemic compared to it. DVD audio and Blu ray video on the Oppo were great though. John M.

 

Nothing changes you just get used to the sound! John M.

 

So, what makes it sound better?

Or to put it a different way, what scientific basis do you use to confirm it sounds better? If you're using only your hearing to decide it sounds better, why do you seem to apply a different standard to the topic of break-in?

And it would help to define terms such as "anemic".

John K.

 

Well...If you could come by I would set them up side by side and let you be the judge. It would likely be a revaltion for you. Anyway...I judge the sound of components by:

1. Lower noise floor, which is in part accomplished with better power supplies/transformers.
2.Timbre. Do the instruments sound more natural?
3. Separation of instruments. Oh, that's a banjo playing in the background, I didn't notice that with the Oppo.
4. Wider/deeper soundstage

 

Getting a little OT guys.

A $5K RRP Esoteric SA-50 is not exactly a "competitor" for an $1.5K OPPO 105D.
I suppose the fact that an Esoteric is even being mentioned augers well for the OPPO though.

Still doesn't help the OP........ unless he can find some extra $ for his budget.

Having said that.......... there are 6 Esoteric Models (including an SA-50) for sale on Ebay in Hong Kong ATM.
ALL from the SAME Seller.

ALL advertised as Brand New and prices range from $3.3K - $4.4K
All listed as 230V though.

If that problem is solvable then here they all are.............enjoy

http://www.ebay.com.au/sch/m.html?_...875595923022&rmvSB=true&_nkw=esoteric&_sop=15

Cheers

 

Totally forgot about Ayre.
Never owned one but I have heard them at one of the Music Matters shows a few years ago.
The only expensive player I would buy even though I would never buy one.
Charles Hanson surely knows his stuff as well as anyone.

One reason I won't buy a $5k or plus player is I think there are far more differences in the source material you're going to play than in a player in this price range.
It's like A/Bing CD vs SACD vs DVD-A vs BD vs downloads of remasters\releases etc., if I don't easily hear a convincing difference for the better I don't care.
I gave up with the exhaustive A/B a long time ago.
Too tiring and pointless in that I don't listen to music that way in my day-to-day habit.
Micro\Nano differences which may only be different and not necessarily better don't matter to me.
I listen to music for enjoyment not as an exercise in analytical concentration.
Speaking only for myself as always.

BTW, my question re:burn-in was mostly sincere with some tongue-in-cheek and not meant as sarcasm.
I hear a difference in my gear after it is warmed up for a short period of time but that's as far as that gone.
It has never been explained to me in a fashion that I found valid or logical.
Not saying that it can't just that I've never seen an article or heard a someone explain it.

 

See post 83 from Tullman for a decent and straight answer.
To get the best from CD/SACDs in part is the transport. Universal players (that play video) use transports in general that have to be beneficial for video. The audio meaning CD/SACD suffers from inferior transports and the cheaper parts that are par for the course in my view. Oppo players which are well made and do their best with audio are not made regardless of the hype for audio. Balanced inputs and outputs are nice but prove nothing if the rest are not up to snuff. I have an old Denon and a Pioneer avi79 that does what the Oppo does and their audio reproduction sounds comparable or better better to ME. Asking a person why it sounds better is looking for trouble, you must decide yourself. If you dont hear a difference good for you.
A SS computer comes the closest in sound quality provided a good DAC is added. To get to the quality sound and features of an Ayre a Cary, Esoteric and the like it will cost. These players cost cause their whole mission is for SOUND and nothing more and are engineered by techs for the most part that love and understand music and its subtleties and hence not many consumers share this love so few are bought and the combination of the two ends up with a higher priced machine and discussions like this.
Robert Harleys book on high end audio and some others explain this much better than I can. Its just a fact that a video based universal machine will not sound as good as an Audio only machine. Im talking about a machine like the ones I mentioned not a 20 dollar wallmart doorstop.

 

Speaking about audio only machines, Marantz SA 14S1 in well in the OPs budget now, brand new.

 

You are correct as an owner of that machine. It was just mentioned cause some cant, dont or are not willing to beleive that great CD sound can be had. The OPPO is a great machine for what it is and your right we do go off course many times, sorry for that. My point is only that if Audio is of primary interest then the high end is in general the way to go. Take care, John M.

 

You mention the importance of the transport re SQ.

I listen to most of my music using a USB stick.

Does that have any bearing on your theory.

100% Agree

 

I use a Cambridge 752BD which is an £800 machine more common in the UK but also an AVI Lab Series CD player from around nine or ten years ago. The AVI is about twice the RRP of the 752 (£1500) but the performance gap is much much closer.

I'm not quite so convinced that John's very well made points necessarily stack up for digital all of the time. For vinyl replay absolutely, digital less so and USB even less which can be a revelation.

 

Yes

 

news to me!

 

I see I was not very clear in my point (I was probably falling prey to a bit of sarcasm myself), so I'll restate it:

Many people talk about how different components sound better, touting things like DACs, or transports, or circuit design, but the way they are making that judgment is not by testing but by listening. I know of no current scientific tests that clearly identify and distinguish differences in Tullman's criteria (e.g. timbre, instrumental separation, soundstage characteristics). Yet, many of the same people who use primarily their ears to judge a component's sound avidly deride those who use their ears to judge whether break in occurs or not. It is a conundrum I can't explain. (By the way, I agree with both T'man and apes' points, and I also hear that break in takes place.)

John K.

 

True. Im on a learning curve as per audio via anything computer. Take care, John M.

 

Your right that Tullmans and my (Apes- John) opinion in this case is absolutely a "Listening" reasoning. I assume we make these technical judgments because the Esoterics, Ayres and the like in general sound superb and we are trying to find a technical reason.
We say it just sounds better. That way of thinking, the Harry Pearson J.Gordon Holt school seems to still pissoff the technophiles here and I cant apologize for my way of thinking about musical quality and reproduction. Yes Im a musician but that does'nt hold much water most of the time.
Like everything else in life we are all trying to find the ultimate answers.
USB sticks are my next indulgence so thats going to be fun.
It really might be you get what you pay for but so many exceptions are out their.

I dont read much vitriol when it comes to Vinyl in discussions like this. We (I) have gone off subject here so I apologize. John M.

 

Funny Im planning on getting an OPPO 105D soon, unless I hear of a new OPPO or something outstanding in the near future. This is for my video based spareroom/bedroom. I should replace my wonderfull Samsung cause its getting long in the tooth at almost 6 1/2 years old. My listening opines on the Oppo 105 came from my good friends setup which includes an Oppo 105D. The Cambridge line are the closest or even better in performance IMHO next to the OPPO as per price/performance ratio. John M.

 

Which of these other decks can play SACD in surround 5.1? Don't most of them have just stereo outs?

 

The Oppos have 7.1 analog outs

 

I understand. I'm Amish, I hate electricity!

 

Then what are you doing here?
Maybe there's a Victrola thread?