Dustin Hoffman says the cinema is at it's worst.

Discussion in 'Visual Arts' started by DrewHarris, Jul 6, 2015.

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  1. Deesky

    Deesky Forum Resident

    Dude, I've already refuted your claim about your 'hearing the demise of physical media' for the past 15 years, which you choose to ignore. Peak-disk is already behind us. I'm not going to keep making the same points nor responding to your willful misrepresentation of what I and others have said on the subject. You're welcome to live in your own little bubble, but I'm done.
     
  2. jeatleboe

    jeatleboe Forum Resident

    Location:
    NY
    If you're truly done on this, I'm relieved; because then I can finally be done, too.
    However, this "bubble" you think I'm living in is also occupied by millions or billions of others, judging by the sales figures.
    Rumors of physical media's impending death, as ever, continue to be greatly exaggerated.
     
  3. jeatleboe

    jeatleboe Forum Resident

    Location:
    NY
    I guess not.
    I wonder why?
     
  4. Schoolmaster Bones

    Schoolmaster Bones Poe's Lawyer

    Location:
    ‎The Midwest
    Probably because there's nothing in that statement to disagree with. You could make just about any assertion you wish and tack "some young people" to it and be factually correct.
     
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  5. jeatleboe

    jeatleboe Forum Resident

    Location:
    NY
    I'm asking why there are younger people (in their teens and twenties) who are now interested in collecting vinyl today, at a time when supposedly "the new generations don't even know what a record or CD are"...? And why they are MORE interested in records now than they were before there was downloading. It's the "why now, not then?" factor which shows that some newbies are actually resisting streaming/downloading.
     
  6. Schoolmaster Bones

    Schoolmaster Bones Poe's Lawyer

    Location:
    ‎The Midwest
    I'm not following this. Are you saying there was less interest in physical media before there was streaming/downloading? How is that even possible?

    -and again: nobody's going to challenge a statement you make with the qualifier "some young people" attached to it, as it's essentially meaningless in the context of this discussion.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 3, 2015
  7. jeatleboe

    jeatleboe Forum Resident

    Location:
    NY
    Less interest in vinyl.
     
  8. SoundAdvice

    SoundAdvice Senior Member

    Location:
    Vancouver
    It's insulting to say that those under 30 won't resent the fact that 85% of the AFI top 100 isn't on Netflix. Or stuff like Woody Allen is non-existent. Soon they will figure out the PQ/SQ isn't even close to High Definition.

    With the success of vinyl/steelbooks/slip covers/good bonus material/3rd party movie licensing companies/deluxe editions. Studios know there is money to be made here.

    While CD keeps shrinking, vinyl is a different story. Keep in mind upwards of 60-70% of vinyl sales is NOT tracked by soundscan/billboard and no media outlet has an remotely accurate number of actual sales.
     
  9. Schoolmaster Bones

    Schoolmaster Bones Poe's Lawyer

    Location:
    ‎The Midwest
    I see. So, you're ignoring cassette and CD sales for that same period, for some reason.

    I do agree with you that there wasn't much downloading or streaming going on with "some young people" before either of those things existed.
     
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  10. jeatleboe

    jeatleboe Forum Resident

    Location:
    NY
    How would you account for young people gravitating toward physical vinyl within the last few years -- at the same time that streaming and downloading is so prevalent?
     
  11. Schoolmaster Bones

    Schoolmaster Bones Poe's Lawyer

    Location:
    ‎The Midwest
    You mean "some young people", right?
    Most aren't.

    Did it ever occur to you that they're doing both? (Like most of us here.) What makes you think they're "resisting" other ways of acquiring music?

    Whatever these "some young people" are doing, it doesn't change the fact that most people now, old or young, have moved away from physical media. Whether it's vinyl, DVD, Blu Ray, whatever - it's all rapidly becoming a niche market. Streaming has arrived.
     
  12. jeatleboe

    jeatleboe Forum Resident

    Location:
    NY
    Of course most aren't. But that's not the point; the point was that practically none were into vinyl in the '90s anymore. They stopped making vinyl LPs -- now they're making them again.
    There are youngers buying vinyl now, and vinyl has been growing in the midst of the "downloads/streams takeover"- though admittedly records will always remain a niche market.
    But it still is very curious that NOW, of all times -- when all youngsters are supposedly going over to downloading and streaming, and hate "things" that "clutter up their rooms", and "don't even know what a record is" -- is when some young people have just begun to find vinyl interesting and appealing.

    Seems they like owning physical vinyl. If they didn't, they would just do the inferior downloads thing.
    But yes, I'd bet they have used downloading to first HEAR a song; but these people wish to own a physical copy in the end.

    Well, streaming had already arrived years ago now -- it's not brand new. But it still has not replaced everything like people have been predicting it will, for something like 10 or so years now --- and counting! And as long as there are people in existence -- and some of them are natural born collectors and like tangible product -- there will always be some form of it.
    So there we have different predictions. Let us check back here in 1, 5, 10 years' time -- and see what has happened (0r not).
     
  13. Schoolmaster Bones

    Schoolmaster Bones Poe's Lawyer

    Location:
    ‎The Midwest
    I don't see the current trend reversing - ever.

    You can still buy sheet music, but that doesn't mean that sheet music won over 78s and radio. Progress moves on its own, regardless of how we feel about it.
     
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  14. jeatleboe

    jeatleboe Forum Resident

    Location:
    NY
    Agreed, Sid.
    I'm just reacting the way I am because the implication people make with comments like "Physical Media is On Death Watch" is that physical stuff will ultimately be totally extinct, unattainable, etc... and that people supposedly won't ever want to bother with it anymore. That's never going to happen. It's one thing to predict that physical media will be the lesser; it's another to predict it will be dead.
     
  15. Schoolmaster Bones

    Schoolmaster Bones Poe's Lawyer

    Location:
    ‎The Midwest
    And I agree that there's a small but substantial push-back among fans of music and cinema alike - particularly millenials - regarding the absence of physical media. My son and most of his friends are total music nerds, and cherish their vinyl collections and vintage stereo systems while still keeping one foot firmly planted in modern technology. None of my doing, mind you - they just came to it on their own.

    And I do own sheet music of several Beatles hits from back in the day. It's just cool to look at.
     
  16. Oatsdad

    Oatsdad Oat, Biscuits, Abbie & Mitzi: Best Dogs Ever

    Location:
    Alexandria VA
    Correct. We've had at least one prediction that there would literally be zero physical video releases in the next five years.

    Not a substantial decrease, but absolutely none! :crazy:
     
  17. SoundAdvice

    SoundAdvice Senior Member

    Location:
    Vancouver
    Less than 20% of vinyl sales are tracked by sound scan.

    When Billboard or other media outlets do stories about streaming surpassing physical sales they are using highly flawed figures. Physical still outweighs streaming/downloads contrary to reports.

    I've also heard figures that say only 1/3rd of all download codes that come with Blu/vinyl are actually redeemed.
     
  18. Schoolmaster Bones

    Schoolmaster Bones Poe's Lawyer

    Location:
    ‎The Midwest
    One explanation for that would be that the item was already downloaded by other means - believe me, it happens. I couldn't name the percentage of music downloads that goes unreported, but the figure would have to be very high. Extremely high. Vinyl sales aren't the only statistic here that's being miscounted.

    You can pick apart numbers all you want, but the fact is sales of physical media overall is in free fall.
     
  19. Vincentrifugal

    Vincentrifugal Forum Resident

    He should try buying a ticket and dealing with loud obnoxious people on their phones.
     
  20. PHILLYQ

    PHILLYQ Forum Resident

    Location:
    Brooklyn NY
    Purchased by folks who don't have interest in streaming, which is why they bought physical media in the first place?
     
  21. Scott222C

    Scott222C Loner, Rebel & Family Man

    Location:
    here
    My god, a discussion over religion couldn't be more of a trainwreck ....
     
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  22. jeatleboe

    jeatleboe Forum Resident

    Location:
    NY
    See, this is exactly what I'm referring to. Okay, we all accept that the sales are lessening for physical media overall (even though they're still in the billions). But what is the point in saying it, if not to imply that "physical media is going to be completely gone one day, folks"? Look at the agenda phrases: "Sales are in free fall" .. "Physical Media is on Death Watch".. These comments are laced with a certain disdain for the format, and a kind of glee in awaiting what some are hoping is an imminent obliteration.

    The fact also is, there is still a LOST IN SPACE COMPLETE SERIES Blu-ray with tons of extra coming in a couple of weeks, and I need to scrounge up the $200 for it. Meanwhile, 10 years ago the execs at Fox Video insisted there wasn't enough money to be made to justify new remasters and extensive bonus features , so they were "forced" to put the series out on two-volume DVDs. How can such a huge undertaking be more lucrative in 2015 than it was in 2005 or so?
     
    Last edited: Sep 4, 2015
  23. SoundAdvice

    SoundAdvice Senior Member

    Location:
    Vancouver
    People play movies/music during the day when they aren't near a record player/HD TV. Study show it as value added, plus they can be given to other people.
     
  24. Dennis Metz

    Dennis Metz Born In A Motor City south of Detroit

    Location:
    Fonthill, Ontario
    Me too:cheers:
     
  25. Coricama

    Coricama Classic Rocker

    Location:
    Marietta, GA
    So you've unlocked the mystery of time travel? :laugh:
     
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