Phono preamps with 42-43 db gain—please list them out.

Thinking about this, and I figured the larger group would know better than me.

 

42-43 db of gain is pretty common- quite a few I would imagine?

 

That's only about 2-3dB more than a Dyna PAS or Marantz 7.

 

I can do 40 or 44. This is a precision quest.

 

Hagerman Bugle 2 can do it. You might be able to get Jim Hagerman to build it that way or he could leave out the gain resistors and you could install them yourself. Since you're talking precision, left/right channels don't need to be identical either which would allow you to correct for any output imbalance from the phono cartridge. Some people install sockets so that they can make quick changes.

 

Decware Zen Triode ZP3 - 42 dB $1,295.00

Also, Eastern Electric MiniMax is 42 dB as well

 

What's wrong with 40db?
-Bill

 

Seems like, particularly on a record that is mastered softly for max dynamic range, I have to lean on my integrated harder than I would like, but I get a really deep, holographic soundstage and good timbre and nuance. Still, I have to turn it up to get dynamics.

44db is punchy, but it can get a little loud at around ten o'clock, and I sense more dynamic compression. I have to be super careful with the volume to get it right and work in very tiny increments.

I'm settling down with a cart (Denon DL110) and still working with preamp tubes, but I do think a phono pre right at 42-43db might be the charm.

 

I see. I am not sure that a lack of gain is a fault here. In my experience, the lower the gain that you can get away with, the better the overall sound. That is of course a generalization, but I have heard many, many phono preamps. There is nothing wrong with cranking up the volume knob a bit. It typically sounds best on most amps at 12 o'clock to 1 o'clock when they have only a reasonable amount of gain. Also nothing wrong with having to turn up the volume a fair bit more when using the phono input than when using a line level input. That is normal. Modern CD players and many other line level sources today have way hotter outputs than they need into a proper hi-fi amp. My take is: if it sounds good, it is good.
-Bill

 

That almost sounds like you have "too much" gain.

jeff

 

Agree. What I miss is the dynamics when listening at lower volumes.

Just a touch too much.

I can't help but wondering if there is a “just right” between 40 and 44.

One complication with the DL110 is that it is listed as 1.6mV, but you often read 2.2mV as being a more correct number. Add to that all the variance in mastering, and I'm obviously out on a limb a bit.

 

That might have more to do with your amplifier / speaker interface. Lp playback will always be compressed when compared to CD or hi-rez digital playback.
-Bill

 

No doubt. I'm driving 4 Ohm speakers (92 db) with an acoustic suspension element with a tube integrated. Don't listen to much digital to compare. Good transformers, but the amp is lean and so are the speakers. Just working on that perfect balance.

I believe the Graham Slee amps come in about 41db and there is a Rothwell UK phono pre that's 42. Others mentioned. Maybe the Vista could be set up for 42. Maybe the Budgie. Just looking for all the options.

 

how about something like the Schiit sys? Might let you fine tune the gain between the phono pre and preamp?

http://schiit.com/products/sys

 

The Rega Aria and Fono MM both have 41.4 db gain.
-Bill

 

All Blue Circle phono pres offer 42db of gain.

 

I've just ordered a Rothwell Simplex pre which has 42db gain, so hope you're right in thinking that amount of gain will be the "charm" with the DL110.

I'm currently running my DL110 with a Slee gram amp 2 with 39db gain. Sounds good at 10 & 12 o clock, but 11 is the sweet spot for most LPs.

That said, I think much depends on the rest of the system, especially the speakers.

 

The Schiit Mani will do 42dB, 48dB, or 59dB. $129 direct from the manufacturer.

 

Post your impressions if you have a chance.

 

Will do.

Just hope it's an improvement over the Gram amp 2. From what I've read.. it should be more refined, which is what I'm looking for. My main concern is that it may be a little too laid back for pop/rock, which is mostly what I listen to. It should arrive in the next day or two so I'll soon find out...........

 

FWIW, I've been listening with some alternate loadings—2K, 10K, 22K, 32K, 38K. Seems like something in the 2-10K range helps keep the top under control and allows for a bit more gain if you want something a bit more punchy. It also helps with less than stellar pressings.

 

Fixed loading with the Simplex. Here's a detailed rundown including specs.....

Simplex MM phonostage »

I bought a used one for a little over £200.