Sinatra / Capitol Sound Quality, etc.: "Frank Sinatra Sings for Only the Lonely" (1958)

Discussion in 'Music Corner' started by MLutthans, Feb 20, 2010.

  1. teag

    teag Forum Resident

    Location:
    Colorado
    Yes, I should have mentioned that fact.
     
  2. bferr1

    bferr1 Forum Resident

    Location:
    MA
    I somehow ended up two copies-- an opened one that my toddler (at the time) got a hold of and proceeded to smear mashed bananas on the jacket, and a replacement copy that I never cracked open. At the time, I was pretty upset about the bananas, but I wouldn't have bought the second copy otherwise!
     
  3. teag

    teag Forum Resident

    Location:
    Colorado
    The LP is for sale at Music Direct for $70. Thats a steal if the CD is $170 on Ebay.
     
  4. mick_sh

    mick_sh Hackney diamond

    Location:
    Madrid, Spain
    Good price considering it's (was?) OOP but Music Direct shouldn't sell their own editions for more than twice the original list price. Sad.
     
    Last edited: Nov 17, 2015
    DmitriKaramazov likes this.
  5. Ben Richards

    Ben Richards Forum Resident

    Just a question : why MFSL is not able to reissue FSFOTL Gold Cd ?
     
  6. Bob F

    Bob F Senior Member

    Location:
    Massachusetts USA
    It was a limited edition (although in this case, not numbered). Does MFSL ever do reissues? Isn't it always the case with MoFi that "you snooze, you lose"?
     
    Bob Belvedere likes this.
  7. Ben Richards

    Ben Richards Forum Resident

    It looks that there is no other way than to pay a big price to buy a MFSL Gold Edition CD of "Sings For Only The Lonely".
    Recently, i found a website where it was available for 30 euros (!). Ask them if the album was in stock. No answer. Two weeks later, the item was deleted of their listing.
     
    DmitriKaramazov likes this.
  8. Bob F

    Bob F Senior Member

    Location:
    Massachusetts USA
    It was available for a good long time. When I bought my copy from —> Amazon, in November 2008 (after Music Direct delayed my original pre-order), the price I paid was $31.49 with free shipping. (The price from MFSL and Music Direct was $29.99, but their shipping charges made Amazon the better deal.) It's a shame it's out of print and difficult to find for a reasonable price, but that's the nature of the music business in general and MoFi in particular.
     
    DmitriKaramazov likes this.
  9. I paid about £70 ($105!!) plus shipping for my sealed copy of the MFSL release earlier this year. At the time it was the cheapest copy available anywhere including Discogs, Amazon, Ebay and a few other online outlets I inquired with. In the UK these MFSL releases normally work out to be the same price in Sterling as they were originally priced in Dollars so we have to take it on the chin. It hurt but it was definitely worth it.
     
  10. Ben Richards

    Ben Richards Forum Resident

    I start listening Sinatra a year ago. My first Sinatra "experience" was "L.A. Is My Lady" album. Not the best for sure, but i was curious about Sinatra/Q.Jones cooperation. Then i bought a "Live In Tokyo" CD (68' if i remember well) for 5 quids. I should not even mention it, seriously.
    I like very much "Watertown" concept album, also "Where are you ?". "In The Wee Small Hours" is nice but i expected something more, above all after reading reviews.
    Really, the best thing i've listened in my life is FSFOTL album. Sinatra, Riddle, Miller, Sims etc. : they managed to capture sadness, depression and heartbreak into some tracks. Terrific.
     
    SteveM, RogerB, Turmatic and 3 others like this.
  11. MLutthans

    MLutthans That's my spaghetti, Chewbacca! Staff Thread Starter

    Same deal here, also from the Grammy Museum display:
    SinatraGoodby1.jpg
    Above is the 3-track session tape box for the song "Goodbye" (spelled differently on the box, by the way). Looks like (toward the upper right) there was a test run-through, followed by 11 takes. Only take 5 (running 5:55) and take 11 (5:42) were complete, with take 11 used for the LP.

    Note the sketch of the stereo mic setup:
    SinatraGoodby2Map.jpg
    So....as we've been suggesting for some time..... two U47 omnis and a vocal mic!

    The orchestra layout is, left to right: bass (rear), strings, woodwinds, rhythm (section), trumpet (rear), trombone (middle), percussion (front).

    Also, there has been some uncertainty as to who engineered the stereo recording, and it appears, at least for this track, that it was Rex Uptegraft:
    SinatraGoodby3.jpg

    Who is Walters (below)?
    SinatraGoodby4Walters.jpg

    Interesting, too, to note that the spine lists this as "SX 19420."
    SinatraGoodby5SX.jpg
    I assume that was Capitol's cutesy shorthand for "Essex," no? Any idea what ED was all about? (No Cialis jokes, please.)

    There you go.....probably my favorite Capitol stereo recording of the whole bunch, so I'll say, "Thank you, Rex Uptegraft" for doing such a tasteful job on the stereo recording. Too bad that great, original stereo mix is never going to see the light of day again, and never appears in the CD era (aside from one track on one compilation).
     
  12. jtaylor

    jtaylor Senior Member

    Location:
    RVA
    I don't think "doozy"does that justice!
     
    DmitriKaramazov and MLutthans like this.
  13. Simon A

    Simon A Arrr!

    Thank you so much for sharing all of this with us Matt!

    Was the Reel To Reel made from the original Stereo mix or was it a unique mix as some of the other Capitol reels of the time?
     
    McLover, DLant and MLutthans like this.
  14. MLutthans

    MLutthans That's my spaghetti, Chewbacca! Staff Thread Starter

    Both the 7.5 IPS and the later 3.75 IPS commercial reels used the original mix, but they are hissy as heck, especially the 3.75 IPS version.
     
    mikrt17, DLant and Simon A like this.
  15. MLutthans

    MLutthans That's my spaghetti, Chewbacca! Staff Thread Starter

    By the way, the physical separation of "bass" and "rhythm" confuses me. I would think that the upright bass would be over with the rhythm section. Might "bass" refer to bass drum? But wouldn't that be in the percussion section listed at far right? (My guess is that "percussion" could be stuff like the vibes used on It's a Lonesome Old Town from the same session.) In the end, we'll likely never know.
     
    DLant and Bob Belvedere like this.
  16. jtaylor

    jtaylor Senior Member

    Location:
    RVA
    I'm thinking this is probably Curly Walter(s).

    According to the linked Billboard article from May 1960, Walter was recently promoted to A & R producer after a stint as associate producer, which began in February 1959. Prior to being named A & R producer, Walter co-produced several albums with Dave Cavanaugh, who as we all know produced Only the Lonely. Previous positions with Capitol included assistant studio manager, tape editor, and assistant to Francis Scott, A & R administration director.
     
    Last edited: Nov 20, 2015
  17. MLutthans

    MLutthans That's my spaghetti, Chewbacca! Staff Thread Starter

    Wow....that's new name on me! Thanks, @jtaylor ! So, is this, perhaps, a situation like the 1968 Beatles stuff where certain sessions were credited on the paperwork to Chris Thomas as producer (essentially in George Martin's absence), but George Martin was still credited as the album's producer upon release? Sounds like it. (I'm not saying that Dave Cavanaugh did not guide the album overall; just that he was, perhaps, not actually on-site in the "producer's chair" for this session, realizing, too, that Sinatra was largely self-producing, regardless of who was in the chair.)
     
    Bob Belvedere, Simon A and jtaylor like this.
  18. jtaylor

    jtaylor Senior Member

    Location:
    RVA
    My interpretation, Matt, was that Walter perhaps "produced" or oversaw what was going on upstairs, but wasn't the main producer downstairs in the studio/mono booth. I know Cavanaugh was around and active for at least one of the sessions: he can be heard from the booth on the aborted "Lush Life" attempt from May. But that doesn't mean, obviously, that he was there and producing a month later.
     
    MMM, Bob Belvedere and Simon A like this.
  19. MLutthans

    MLutthans That's my spaghetti, Chewbacca! Staff Thread Starter

    That's a definite possibility. I know that somewhere either here or on my old webpage for this album comments were made about how Capitol's first stereo Sinatra project, Where Are You?, got technically screwed up, and the second stereo Sinatra project, Come Fly with Me, got technically screwed up, but this third album finally came off in stereo without a hitch. I wouldn't be surprised if they had an extra, competent set of eyes and ears working to ensure that nothing got messed up again on a major project by one of their marquee artists.
     
    Bob Belvedere, AJH and Simon A like this.
  20. Ben Richards

    Ben Richards Forum Resident

    Dilemna : The Capitol Years (21 cd) for 250 euros or FSFOTL gold album for 110 euros on ebay.
    Is the 21-cd set so bad to deserve that price ?
     
    Last edited: Nov 25, 2015
  21. mick_sh

    mick_sh Hackney diamond

    Location:
    Madrid, Spain
    How about $70 (65€) + shipping from USA for the Gold CD? Seller accepts best offer and shipping to Europe shouldn't be expensive since this is a low weight item.

    http://www.discogs.com/sell/item/270085698
     
  22. MLutthans

    MLutthans That's my spaghetti, Chewbacca! Staff Thread Starter

    The 21-CD set is excellent (not perfect -- no "complete Capitol" Sinatra set is) and definitely worth owning.
     
    frankfan1, Simon A and Bob F like this.
  23. Ben Richards

    Ben Richards Forum Resident

    Finally bought the 21-CD set (like new) and the guy offered me Sinatra In Hollywood box too : all for less than 250 dollars. Amazing.
    I just need some time to listen all of this. Perfect when you're alone during year's end celebrations ! :D
     
    RogerB, Bob F and Bob Belvedere like this.
  24. MMM

    MMM Forum Hall Of Fame

    Location:
    Lodi, New Jersey
    Rex was a 2nd engineer at Capitol. This credit also confirms the practice here of using an otherwise 2nd engineer to supervise (for lack of a better term) the separate 3-track recording in their early stereo era, and not put a John Kraus or Hugh Davies up there. I'd say, unless other evidence proves contrary, the main engineer (Val Valentin, in this case) was still the person in charge of choosing mics/placement, etc. for this recording, and the second (Rex, here) carried out what the main engineer wanted. The separate producer credit throws in a bit of a question mark, but even then I'm guessing his (Curly's) role is more to function as Dave's ears up there, help follow a score, mirror any overlapping work, etc.
     
  25. jtsjc1

    jtsjc1 Forum Resident

    Location:
    helmetta, nj usa
    Boy would I like to hear Take 5 from the tape Matt posted pics of!
     
    MLutthans likes this.

Share This Page

molar-endocrine