Woody Allen: Film by Film Thread

Discussion in 'Visual Arts' started by RayS, Aug 29, 2015.

  1. RayS

    RayS A Little Bit Older and a Little Bit Slower Thread Starter

    Location:
    Out of My Element
    Welcome, feel free to go back and comment on any of the films we've already passed. In the completist realm, I recently gave a try to Woody's readings of his books, and must say they left me rather flat. I never would have guessed that >I< am funnier reading them in my head than Woody is reading them out loud. :)
     
  2. Richard--W

    Richard--W Forum Resident

    Thanks.

    Once, when I was in law school, I handed a copy of Side Effects to the professor. On the back cover was a portrait of Woody. "Read 'My Speech to the Graduates," I said, knowing he'd appreciate it. A few of the students sitting around me oohed and aahed, thinking I must be Woody. "We didn't know you wrote books," one girl said. Of course, that was a long time ago, and nobody would confuse me for Woody today.
     
  3. I don't really follow his stuff anymore and not for any specific reason.

    But boy, Annie Hall, Manhattan, Crimes and Misdemeanors, Hannah and Her Sisters, Zelig....I love 'em all.

    I also love September but am forever disappointed that we will never see the original version he filmed with (some) different actors.
    A deluxe blu-ray that includes both versions would be incredible!
     
  4. Victor/Victrola

    Victor/Victrola Makng shure its write

    I was a huge fan of Woody's early films like Bananas (7/10), Take the Money and Run (7/10), Sleeper (8/10), Love and Death (8/10) and Everything You Wanted To Know About Sex (6/10). Then I thought his career took a real turn for the better with The Front (9/10). Here's a movie that dealt with a serious subject but with humor. I know Woody only acted in it, but it sure feels like an Allen script. It would fit the subject matter if Woody had used Walter Bernstein as a front for the screenplay. Play It Again, Sam (9/10) is brilliant, probably the best movie up to this point. I saw it before I saw Casablanca. When I finally got around to Casablanca, I watched PIA,S as the second feature. Even better that way!

    (For the completists, I didn't like What's New Pussycat? (3/10) or Casino Royale (2/10) at all. What's Up Tiger Lily? (6/10) was funny and weird, but the premise was too tedious for a full-length film. I've never seen Don't Drink The Water.)

    Then there's Annie Hall (10/10). One of his all-time best and a real surprise out of left field. For the first time, Woody is "serious" film maker. Yeah, it's a comedy, but Annie Hall is on a totally different level that anything he did up to that point. It's his first movie that had widespread appeal beyond those that enjoy irreverent humor. Love And Death almost gets there, but still has a touch of the slapstick that ran through his earlier films. Annie definitely has some physical humor in it (the lobster scene will forever be one of Woody's career highlights) but the relationships between the characters is what drives the film.

    I did not see Interiors (9/10) until many years after it was released, during a period when I was trying to watch every Woody Allen movie I could get my hands on (I did the same with Hitchcock). I knew it was a drama, but I was not prepared for just how powerful it was going to be. I recall having to rewatch the movie immediately a second time to get everything that happened and from the fact that I was stunned at how dramatic the movie was. I think it's his best drama. This film made me appreciate the brilliance of Diane Keaton's acting range.

    Then there's the amazing run of stunningly good movies that will put Woody in the book of America's greatest film makers of all time:

    Manhattan - 9/10 - A loving tribute to NYC. The movie looks gorgeous, and the story line is not unfamiliar territory for Allen, but it seems totally fresh and new here. Everyone praises Mariel Hemingway's performance in this movie, but I think the real five-star role here goes to Meryl Streep. She's perfect as a lesbian coming out of a straight marriage. One of Allen's best films.

    Stardust Memories - 6/10 - How can Woody deny this is about himself? Dealing with the fans who refused to take him seriously and wanted more of the early silly stuff? The movie isn't perfect, and is not one I'd want to watch a dozen times, but it is classic Woody Allen.

    A Midsummer Night's Sex Comedy - ?? - I have to admit, I haven't seen this one.

    Zelig - 10/10 - My favorite Woody Allen movie. It's the perfect blend of comedy, drama and sentimentality. It's almost devastating when Zelig reveals to his therapist the reason for his chameleon-like behavior. I think this and Take The Money And Run make a good double feature and display the ultimate in mockumentary screenwriting. One is just silly entertainment, the other is a powerful statement on trying to be worthy, and the dangers of altering someone's personality through therapy. It's kind of like A Clockwork Orange but without the violence. Zelig is the one Woody Allen movie that I think everyone should see, too bad it is relatively unknown.

    Broadway Danny Rose - 7/10 - This movie got a lot of great reviews, but I thought it could be better. But then, anything following Zelig was going to be a bit of a letdown. I think it feels rushed, and Woody doesn't really fit his character.

    The Purple Rose of Cairo - 10/10 - I love this movie, it's probably #4 on my list of WA films. It's not a big film, just a very sweet love story which touches on some serious subjects like depression, loneliness and mental illness. Lots of people praise Mia's performance in this film, and she IS good, but for my money, Jeff Daniels hands in the performance of his career. This really feels like one of those fantasy pictures of the 40's.

    Hannah And Her Sisters - 10/10 - the movie we are currently discussing. I'll reiterate that the film is brilliant, and with today being Thanksgiving, totally appropriate for viewing.

    There, I'm all caught up! LOL.
     
  5. Richard--W

    Richard--W Forum Resident

    I certainly agree with you about Zelig. It's Woody's Citizen Kane. The premise that a man is like a chameleon who subconciously changes his emotional and psychological makeup and physicality to be accepted and to fit in with those around him is so new and off-the-wall it could only have come from Woody himself. I wonder how he got the idea. The premise results in some amazing and hilariously funny visual gags, like Woody turning black, turning fat, growing taller in front of our eyes. When Zelig came out the character made me think of what I'd been reading about Bob Dylan. There were a few books about Dylan and lots of intense of word-of-mouth, but little to no publicity. He was inaccessible, but everyone in the New York area was talking about his extreme changes in physicality and personality. I wonder if Woody got the idea from that. Anyhow, Woody's and Gordon Willis' work on this film is remarkable. Even though it has only a small following, Zelig is remarkable achievement and truly great cinema.
     
    Peace N. Love likes this.
  6. Richard--W

    Richard--W Forum Resident

    Has anyone seen the remake of The Sunshine Boys (1995) with Woody and Peter Falk? Woody as hired actor instead of writer or director. I missed this cable film when it came out. I had forgotten all about it, but I just bought the DVD. The reviews were less than complimentary, as I recall. I wonder what everyone thinks of it.
     
  7. RayS

    RayS A Little Bit Older and a Little Bit Slower Thread Starter

    Location:
    Out of My Element
    I believe his inspiration for Zelig was an extension of the question "If there is a god, how could he allow Nazism to happen?" Woody already answered that question for himself (simple, there is no god), so the next question was how could otherwise decent people allow Nazism to happen in their country? Leonard Zelig is a seemingly decent man who is so desperate to assimilate that he'll agree with whatever social pressure is around him - he'll become anything, including a Nazi, to fit in.
     
  8. RayS

    RayS A Little Bit Older and a Little Bit Slower Thread Starter

    Location:
    Out of My Element
    I've seen it. I reserve the right to comment on it until we get to it in a mere 9 years. :)
     
  9. Peace N. Love

    Peace N. Love Forum Resident

    I don't want to get too political or anything but, of late, whenever I see a news story of some horrific multiple murder, attack, etc, etc, I think of Frederick's speech from Hannah (below). To me this speech is quintessential Woody - simultaneously funny, tragic, flippant, pessimistic and profound. And von Sydow's delivery is just incredible.

    "You missed a very dull TV show on Auschwitz. More gruesome film clips, and more puzzled intellectuals declaring their mystification over the systematic murder of millions. The reason they can never answer the question "How could it possibly happen?" is that it's the wrong question. Given what people are, the question is "Why doesn't it happen more often?"
     
  10. Richard--W

    Richard--W Forum Resident

    Woody addresses the holocaust in many different ways in his films, and that monologue is one of his most eloquent.


    I'm sure you are right insofar as the overriding purpose of the film, but dramatically other things are going on as well.

    I don't agree with Woody that there is no god, by the way. But intellectually Zelig towers over most movies. It is his one film that puts him on the same level with Ingmar Bergman.
     
    Last edited: Nov 26, 2015
  11. Ghostworld

    Ghostworld Senior Member

    Location:
    US

    I don't know why people always recommend "Wild Strawberries" I think overall it's not Bergman's most impressive film. If you want people to discover Bergman, I think "The Seventh Seal" is more likely to tickle their fancy. I think many will find "Wild Strawberries" a very low key, possibly dull film.
     
  12. alexpop

    alexpop Power pop + other bad habits....

    Anybody rated his films yet ie; 10/10 ?
     
  13. RayS

    RayS A Little Bit Older and a Little Bit Slower Thread Starter

    Location:
    Out of My Element
    I recommended it because I think it is unimpressive and dull.

    Obviously I think it is an exceptional film, and it has a direct influence on one of Allen's films ("Deconstructing Harry") and some influence on another ("Another Woman"). I don't find it dull in the slightest, and while I have no objection at all to recommending "The Seventh Seal", I find "Wild Strawberries" to be a much more accessible film for someone new to Bergman.
     
    Richard--W likes this.
  14. Richard--W

    Richard--W Forum Resident

    Ingmar Bergman is never dull, never unimpressive. He was always inspired and every film he made is utterly fascinating. I'm with Woody on this one.
     
  15. alexpop

    alexpop Power pop + other bad habits....

    Who was Woody's best leading lady?
     
  16. I'd call Purple Rose bittersweet because of the ending.

    I'd give Interiors a 4/10. It's a pretentious movie infused with Bergman's influence without any of his wit or charm.
     
  17. RayS

    RayS A Little Bit Older and a Little Bit Slower Thread Starter

    Location:
    Out of My Element
    1987 - "Radio Days"

     
  18. Victor/Victrola

    Victor/Victrola Makng shure its write

    I have mixed feelings about Radio Days (7/10). It's an extremely charming little film with no expectations of greatness. The attention to detail is impeccable, the costumes, hairstyles and sets are amazingly real to the period, but the melodramatic tone of the movie and acting almost ruin it. I understand the concept for the overacting - radio shows were often very melodramatic - so Joe's recollection of them would certainly be influenced/tainted by it. But after characters that were so real and varied in Hannah And Her Sisters, it's a bit of a step backward for WA to give us such cartoonish and stereotypical people in this film.

    One thing I wish the script had done was to give us a glimpse of what the radio listeners imagined the radio actors looked like versus what they really were (the great illusion of radio). I think WA missed a great opportunity to illustrate the magic of radio by not doing this, particularly in the case of The Masked Avenger. There should be a scene where Joe imagines what the actor who plays The Masked Avenger looks like and then contrast it with who it really was. While it is fun to have Jeff Daniels cast as a tribute to his character in The Purple Rose Of Cairo, I think Jeff would have made a good 'imaginary' Masked Avenger in Joe's mind, while Wallace Shawn was a perfect choice for the real Masked Avenger.

    The snowman/carrot joke is classic though!
     
    mrjinks and RayS like this.
  19. RayS

    RayS A Little Bit Older and a Little Bit Slower Thread Starter

    Location:
    Out of My Element
    I think for the most part Woody's "evolution" ends with "Manhattan", and from there he was/is liable to go in whatever direction his whims take him. So we go from a more sophisticated plot ("Hannah") to a simpler one, and we go from experiencing an accurate unseen "narrator" of a realistic story to a unreliable narrator whose recollections are tinged with nostalgia (and maybe a bit of a faulty memory). I agree with your point regarding the Masked Avenger - an opportunity lost, as you describe it.

    My favorite moment in the film is when our young hero is being chastised by his rabbi ...

    From 11:00 (running at the wrong speed, and horribly cropped, but what can you do?)

     
    sunspot42 and kanakaris like this.
  20. Richard--W

    Richard--W Forum Resident

    Woody's evolution did not stop with Manhattan. Throughout his career he's always tried out different things. He will shift emphasis here and there, but his exploration of human nature continues in significant ways, I find.


    Mae Questel, obviously.
     
    mrjinks likes this.
  21. Captain Groovy

    Captain Groovy Senior Member

    Location:
    Freedonia, USA
    Interesting how one can be a Woody fan and have COMPLETELY opposite opinions about his work. The first few films are all 10/10 to me and take every word you said about Danny Rose, literally everything - including about Woody's performance as the lead character and you get to my 11/10!

    Jeff
     
  22. RayS

    RayS A Little Bit Older and a Little Bit Slower Thread Starter

    Location:
    Out of My Element
    Perhaps I would have made my point more clearly if I said that there is a linear progression in Woody's film up until "Manhattan". One can see his evolution as a writer and director in terms of adding depth to his comedic characters and adding drama and pathos into the mix. Whatever you'd like to call it, it ends abruptly with "Sex Comedy", which represents a step backwards (or at least away) from more sophisticated storytelling. So there's no longer a linear progression evident - he'll make a heavy drama, a silly comedy, a farce ... whatever he feels like.
     
  23. mrjinks

    mrjinks Optimistically Challenged

    Location:
    Boise, ID.
    Behind a bit on the posts, but I just finished my Thanksgiving (weekend!) viewing of Hannah - wow, what a film, and this isn't even at the top of my list!

    This film is like a rich novel, with deep characters (FIVE internal monologues drive the film! - when does that ever happen?). Driving home the "novel" experience are the "chapter headings" for the various segments - so imaginative! Let's also give a big round of applause to the brash and bold soundtrack choices he made on this. This "soundtrack music" isn't meant to blend in to the background, it strikes you like a rich Cabernet, commanding your attention. The scene where the architect shows his favorite buildings has a dramatic, classical score. The master shot where Eliott kisses Lee (as a subtly romantic, then dramatic Bach score plays) is even better. A couple folks mentioned the "breakup" scene with Barbara Hershey and Max Von Sydow - it's like a 4-5 minute scene with ONE cut. I mentioned it earlier, but those extended (for film) scenes draw you into the action and give the actors a real chance to show their acting chops, instead of the typical 7-second cuts that rule most movies. And this was his FOURTH home run movie in a row (in FOUR YEARS!!!).

    My only gripe - and it's a significant one (for me) - is his character's involvement with Dianne Weist late in the film. I'm pretty sure I debated it with someone (Ray?) earlier on this board, but the search engine couldn't help me find it. I HATE the scene where Woody runs into the record store and says to Dianne Weist, "I don't know if you remember me, but we had the worst night of my life together". She responds that she does remember him. BUT THEY WERE ****ING RELATED!!! I've had people try to tell me that dialogue was "a joke", but I just don't believe it. I think it was lazy writing. It's a HUGE flaw for me. I can't imagine coming up to my ex's sister and saying "I don't know if you remember me...." For a guy that usually buttons every plot point (though sometimes awkwardly), it's a major flaw. Similarly, in the final scene where Woody speaks about how he found it "ironic" that he used to be married to one sister, and now he's married to another, I doubt the sister's father would be quite so amused with said "irony"...

    Regardless, I find Hannah to be a rich, fabulously entertaining film, and perhaps the most re-watchable film in his catalog (for me), although I find a half-dozen or so films to be superior.

    Thanks, @RayS, for holding off this one until T-day! :wave:
     
    Last edited: Nov 30, 2015
    Richard--W likes this.
  24. RayS

    RayS A Little Bit Older and a Little Bit Slower Thread Starter

    Location:
    Out of My Element
    I don't think it was me you were debating with, because I'm on your side. I don't like the happy ending, and I had the same reaction to the meet up scene. The whole "my ex-wife set me up with her sister" notion is far-fetched enough as it is. I do like the subtle (potential) explanation for his later loss of hearing - punk rock (well, punkish rock, anyway). It's nice that Lee apparently finds some real happiness, but surely Hannah will eventually find out about her affair with Elliot some how, right?

    And trust me, I made no effort whatsoever to align this film with its appropriate holiday, it just kind of fell that way.
     
    mrjinks likes this.
  25. Captain Groovy

    Captain Groovy Senior Member

    Location:
    Freedonia, USA
    Just a quick break to honor the man - TURNING 80 YEARS OLD TOMORROW (DEC 1).

    Seems like only yesterday (2002) Woody made a wonderful and rare appearance at the Oscars telling us "his life was 1/3 over" :D

    May he achieve his life-long goal of not dying!



    Jeff
     
    rufus t firefly, RayS and mrjinks like this.

Share This Page

molar-endocrine