Streamers: Which one or none?

No, I know you guys are doing sophisticated high end stuff. Far, far too many variables for most folks. Getting a bunch of pieces of software to work together
and all the optimizing and tweaking is for the masochists among us.

 

Wellllll... If you spend time over at computeraudiophile.com, you know that some of what you are saying isn't altogether correct. Some of those expensive tweaked computers sound really good and are on par with the dedicated audio streamers. BUT the benefit to bother ratio is such that many of us audiophiles just won't bother with it. The hobby is audio not computers. IMHO computer audiophiles have two hobbies that seamlessly (more or less) blend the computer hobby with the audio hobby.

 

Linn Akurate DSM. You won't go wrong with one of these (you could pick up one second hand).

 

Hi Mike. I have had several streamers (by which I mean stream renderers), and I also have a computer-based system connected by USB. I think you are precisely correct, all the streamer does is remove the computer from the music room. For me, that makes a big psychological difference, but I can't say if it will for you. I detest having a computer -- with all the attendant fussing -- in the music room.

Streamers I have owned are the PS Audio PWD II with Bridge, Simaudio MiND, Auralic Aries, and (on order after trial) Classé CP-800. That is not to say those are the best; they are what I have tried.

You need to accept some fiddling if you go with DLNA/UPnP audio (the main non-Apple streaming protocol). It is a complex arrangement, requiring music storage, a DLNA server program, a DLNA control point app, and a DLNA renderer. Supposedly, all models should work together, but sometimes, they there can be hiccups. Fortunately, compatibility seems to be getting better.

Some renderers STILL don't support gapless playback. You may not think you need that, but if you listen to music, you do. Watch out for it!

I could go on for a long time, but I think I've touched the main points. If you have any questions I might be able to help with, please ask.

 

Excellent post and advice.

I will add that Roon is now a player, which can replace DLNA/UPnP. I tried it and I was impressed, but in the end it was not for me because it seemed to take over my music collection with its overlaid metadata. Call me old fashioned but I still much prefer folder view. Also, the price was hard to stomach, when MiniMserver and Linn Kazoo are free.

 

None.

I went the whole nine yards, ripped everything to disc, got a streamer, had a network in the house.

After 2-3 years I got tired of the whole thing and just got a nice disc player. Bought some nice cabinets to put my cd's in.

I like going over and picking out my music, putting the disc in the player.

I gave computer music a good long try and it's just not for me.

 

What you left out, is that excludes the entire world of HD downloads. Which means you do NOT get the best digital versions of the Beatles, Doors, Eagles, Black Sabbath, John Coltrane, Miles Davis, Bruce Springsteen, Grateful Dead etc.

Although I guess you could burn those to DVD-A if you had a universal player.

 

OK, some advantages of ripping your music collection.

• As @ServingTheMusic says, you can get HR downloads. What might be better about those is, in my opinion, more often better mastering than better resolution. But I do buy a lot of them (the daily 50% off specials, usually) from eClassical.com, and even the 44.1/24 ones sound smoother on average than CDs.
  
• If you have more than one system at home, you can point them all to the same server and have access to your music through all your systems. That can even include a tablet or phone when you're in range. I use my phone to play music from my server when I'm on the exercise bike. We have three systems that draw on our server.
• Cataloging: If you bother getting the metadata right when you rip, you can find anything easily. As a classical music lover, I find it really nice to be able (e.g.) to pick from a list of all the flute concertos I own, or see all the Scarlatti recordings, or everything played by Vadim Gluzman.
• Playing DJ. It's really easy to make a playlist, on the fly, of 20 cuts from 20 different albums, then sit back and enjoy the music. Try THAT when using physical CDs.
  
• Storage. I really love that when I buy recordings now, I don't have to find a place for the CDs.

But you NEED to be sure your music library is BACKED UP.

 

I tried the world of HD downloads.

I think that world is best described by P.T. Barnum.... 'there's a sucker born every minute'.

 

I don't think so. That is a very bleak overview. The Springsteen, Eagles, Dead, Chapin, Zep, Cream,etc
and whole 24/192 Blue Note remasters eat the CDs for lunch. Not even close.

How about this: Can you name a few of the titles you purchased that were disappointing, and your digital set up?

 

Many of the items you list - except for the Blue Note stuff - were a disappointment on the three systems I have here. Especially the Led Zep and Springsteen. Compressed and harsh come to mind. Will take Steve's DCC of Hotel Cali any day over any so called "HD" version.

The Grateful Dead was well done.

My issue with all "HD" downloads is threefold:

1. Provenance - rarely do we ever know what the source of any of this stuff is.

2. The human ear simply cannot hear anything beyond about 18k. No download I have ever examined has any audio information higher than 22-24K so if one is handing over gobs of cash on 24/96 or god forbid 24/192 - you had better read the Barnum quote again. Ain't nothing but the truth.

3. And the core fact - it's simply not HD - taking some dusty ass master tape from 1973 and transferring it to digital at 24/192 does not suddenly make it a 24/192 recording. It's the same as taking a 128khz MP3 and converting it to a 16/44 WAV file - it sure looks cool in print as a 16/44.1 recording (marketing wise) - but it's the same old crap padded with a bunch of zeroes.

True HD - can only occur when the multi tracks were actually recorded @ 24/96 (or higher) and mixed at the same.

Most of this stuff is simply OD (Original definition) dressed up in a fancy overcoat for marketing purposes.

VP

 

The Dead and Springsteen remasters have very detailed provenance...so does the Zep stuff. Same with the Eagles.

However, agree, that in general provenance is lacking.

I will take "OD" any day of the week. As a matter of fact, I will take any "dusty ass master tape from 1973" as well over a lossy CD.

 

Just as I will take a first pressing CD any day of the week. That is more resolution than I (or anyone else) can realistically hear anyway. Rock on bro.

VP

 

I've come close to pulling the trigger on the CXN, but I've heard that the controller app is really basic and not particularly great for creating playlists. When I've looked into alternative apps, the conclusion seems to be that the best options are not available on iPhone/iPad. I'm hoping I have that wrong.

 

Very true, simple app for pulling audio files from the network. I use the CXN in combination with Jriver and it's Gizmo android controller

 

what ever device you get other than a apple computer with I Tunes Beware!!!! Not of the sound ,But the fact that a lot of these like the one I just got (Bluesound Node ) store the info on the streamer ,not the songs, and require perfect
metadata care and no extra copies of song titles on Backup drives ,you must start a total clean folder on computer or Drive with art work and Files Tagged property
My giant itunes folders and back ups ,was a lot of work to refine in this way ,not only do you have to go back and add art I tunes even put a Stevie Wonder LP in a file called Compilations

 

It seems so daunting...I just want the hardware to input my external hard drive to an external DAC and have a remote. Right now I'm using a laptop but I'm not very happy with it. Foobar2000 is fine for me but I haven't quite got the controller to work yet. But the computer itself is beginning to be more problems than it's worth.

Looking for gapless playback, toslink, (possibly XLR connectivity), remote with a decent UI (in general I don't create playlists and I have about 2 TB of FLACs). I do NOT want wireless or a DAC if possible. And I don't use streaming services.

I've looked up all the recommendations here and I'm still puzzled about it all. That Linn Akurate DSM looks marvellous, but way outta my price range. Way.

 

Make sure to install Bonjour on the laptop. I use Foobar2000 with the TouchRemote DACP server plugin and Apple's Remote app on my iPhone 6 to control what's playing. It works great. It can seem like a pain at first. I can help you out on setup if you like?

 

Sure. I'll give laptops and the foobar controller another go. My A/V receiver is away being repaired at the moment but as soon as it comes back I'll give your advice a go.

I'm getting a lot of pauses in my music. I thought it was the DAC but I tried without it and they're still there. Is that a foobar thing? Laptop thing? It's not gapless playback issues, just random pauses in any given song at any given time.

 

I had that issue as well. The following helped clear that up:

Configure Advanced settings with the following options:

Full file buffering up to (kB): Highest possible (I entered 99999999999999999999)
WASAPI Hardware buffer in MS – push/event mode: 1/3/6/12/24/32 until stuttering is gone.
High worker process priority: checked
Thread priority: 7
Use MMCSS: checked
MMCSS mode: Audio

This is recommended for Fidelizer users in the setup guide and it cured things. The only issue I have is when streaming high resolution files, they take a little longer to play. You can also use these settings for kernel streaming. There is a Freeware version of Process Lasso that could help with dropouts too. I use it and have noticed that Tidal is a lot less prone to issues with skipping.

 

Does anyone know the output impedance of the digital preamp in the Cambridge CXN? I'm not seeing it anywhere online. I'd like to run it directly into a power amp.

 

Don't have the info, but I run it through a Tisbury Passive Preamp to a Quad909 power amp with no issues.

 

With either my own search skills or Mr. Google having failed me, my ignorant self must stand naked before all of you and ask:

That in hell's kitchen is a RENDERER???

In fact, I wouldn't mind it if someone were able to point me to a good primer on streaming/networking, if there is such a thing. I'm catching on slowly—but a bit TOO slowly. I'm guessing you guys weren't all born knowing this stuff, right?

I thought I was pretty hot stuff getting up to speed on basic computer audio, but now they throw THIS at me! THANKS a million.
-Bob

 

Check out the link. What Is a Media Renderer? »

 

Thanks for that, Paris. To draw an analog-y, it seems a renderer is something like a turntable. It plays what you put on (or in) it. Thank you.
-Bob