Harbeth P3ESR vs Spendor S3/5R2

I KNEW IT. I KNEW YOU GOT THAT CRAP FROM ALAN.

Did he also tell you to put your speakers on plant stands from Ikea because 'stands don't matter' and 'all amplifiers sound the same'?

I have a lot of respect for Alan Shaw, he's done a terrific job running Harbeth and he makes great speakers. He's also a bit of a whack-job.

 

I disagree. Small speakers often seem that way, bur it's largely because there is less bass to mask the transients. The C7s just play music better.

 

After forty years of going back and forth on 'small speakers vs big speakers' I wouldn't say one or the other is 'better'.

I'd say some people prefer one over the other. They're both good. Absolutely many people, perhaps a majority, will prefer the C7 to the P3. No one is wrong in what they like.

 

Alan is not the designer, owner, or genius behind a company that makes amps or speaker stands. That is undeniable. He is, however, the designer of the radial cone driver, which is in both speakers under discussion, and clearly he is an expert on (and the genius behind) his own designs. I would also say that "no one is wrong in what he/she likes" is both the truest, and at the same time the most meaningless phrase in any language, ie., a truism, and not helpful when someone asks a for advice.

 

Hey, got a song for ya:

 

I would say the amplifier makes a difference as much if not more than most with Harbeth - working with a wide rang of amps is one thing but sounding the same is not true. The man is pompous rather than a whack job and I doubt he is the 'designer' as he claims rather more conceptualising and marketing man. He is also pro digital and anti vinyl and attempts to prove the latter's inferiority through sound waves - talking of jitter which is a digital rather than analogue measurement.

 

I'll say this for you, you sing

say what you will, he makes great speakers.

 

If I didn't have original Quads I'd seriously consider a pair of SHL5's. They're spectacular speakers.

 

No. Accurate includes scale, timbre and detail. The C7 improves on all of that over the P3. The P3 may be perceived as faster because of the smaller bass driver and sealed cabinet, but with a quality amp and proper setup the C7's will improve on the P3's in nearly every way, IMO.

 

Exactly.

 

I love the SHL5's, but I think the M30.1 outdoes it, despite a bit less sizzle and slam. Never heard a more "in the room" vocal reproducer. It's almost freaky how well it does this. But this is more like do you prefer Romanee-Conti or Lafite....

 

In reading this thread, I thought I recalled Robert E. Green making relevant comments long ago in his TAS review of the Compact 7. So I hopped over to his site, and here it is:

"It is a bit warm in the mid-bass by prevailing audiophile standards. But, in practice, speakers with this kind of warmth are in fact more accurate than leaner ones. Audiophiles have accustomed themselves to the leaned-out sound of speakers that do nothing to defend themselves against the inevitable floor cancellation. Without some deliberate attention to the floor effect, all speakers will exhibit a suck-out, often in the order of 5 dB, in the 100-300 Hz region. This is often described as "precision" or "transparency" or the like. But, of course, it is utterly wrong, and makes music that is accurately recorded sound innervated, lifeless, and lightweight.

"The Compact 7 with proper placement--rather low stands, in most rooms--will produce a smooth, flat response through mid-bass and lower mid-range. This is correct sound, even if some audiophiles will think of it as warm." (Source: TITLE »).
-Bob

 

Well who knows, I've never been to his factory...but you provide absolutely no factual basis for your statement. It is clear to me that Alan is the designer, and a visit to the Harbeth website gives ample evidence to that effect. He discusses every element of his designs, redesigns and listening tests in great detail, and in a highly personal, "first person" narrative. Harbeth is a very small company, and while others surely work with Alan, it's him. If you have actual evidence to the contrary, that is fine -- please present it. Otherwise, as far as I can tell, you are merely speculating, like the Shakespeare deniers.

 

There's only two kinds, good ole biguns and big ole guduns

 

thanks guys
ill probably eventually get the P3 and C7 on the used market to make up my mind and then wait until I have enough money to get shl5+

meanwhile, I must convince my dad so we can do a big shoot out of his speakers: Tannoy Gold, tannoy red, ESL 57, Altec valentia, LS3/5A, JBL lsr 32, roger jr150, technics sb-e200, JBL lancer 44 and all sorts of other vintage speakers he owns right now. Yes, hes a hoarder!

 

Good plan, but you might also add an M30 to the list to try. Even though it's often the least impressive in the showroom A-B tests, many of the dealers, who live with the speakers over time, say its their favorite of all. Quite un-fatiguing and dead on realistic.

 

hi
are you jodet at pinkfish? if so, youve had a insane amount of small speakers!

Im surprised that you say here that youd take P3esr over spendor as ive read from Jodet at pinkfish that he prefer Spendor S3/5R2 over P3ESR. Have you changed your opinion eventually?

Is the new falcons still your favorite over P3esr and kef ls50?

One last question, would you pick SHL5 over Falcons?

 

Yes, an insane amount - been doing this since 1978.

S3/5R2 vs P3ESR - the Spendors are five hundred bucks cheaper, so if money is a concern there's that. In a very small room with classical music the Spendors have a really nice image. But in a larger room with a variety of music I'd probably take the Harbeths.

I'm thinking a room big enough for the SHL5's would not be ideal for the Falcons - two completely different kinds of speakers. If I had a big room I'd consider the SHL5's, they're a favorite of mine (but I only heard them once).

Another 'all rounder' I really like is the Ascend Acoustics Sierra 2 with that amazing RAAL ribbon tweeter. Factory direct only $1500 and amazing for the price. They don't do exactly what the Falcons do, but they have more bass and play louder. If you like vocals and classical guitar, piano, etc, Falcons are amazing. If you like a little electronica with your classical maybe the Sierra 2's would be a better 'all rounder'.

 

Hi ls35a! I'm new to this forum but i would like to ask you few questions about the differences between the Ascend Sierra 2 and the Harbeth P3ESR.

I've bought 2 weeks ago the Ascend Sierra 2 after have read many rave comments about them everywhere. I think they are really good speakers but maybe my expectation were too high and for the moment i'm not totally in love with them. I bought the Sierras for upgrade my cheap active JBL LSR 305 on my desk system, but there are few things i still prefer on the JBL over the Sierra: better punch at low volume and fuller and richer voices. The Sierra are a lot more transparent, refined, more extended in the higher freqs, more real and less forward than the JBL, but the voices are leaner and someway distant. This with the speaker seated on my desk at low volumes, i don't have tried them in different scenarios.

For the same price of the Sierra 2 i could find some used Harbeth P3ESR. I would like to know for you if you can briefly describe the difference with the Sierra.
I'm really interested to know which one sound better at low / very low volume and if the P3ESR have the same amount of bass/punch of the Sierra in this situation or less. I'm sure the Sierra will go lower and with more punch at high volume but is not my situation. Also i Would like to know which one is warmer and more forgiving with bad recordings. I listen mainly folk, classic rock (60's and 70's), vocal jazz, blues.

I would really appreciate if you can give me your opinion or thoughts about these speakers!

P.s. for now i tried the Sierra with an old Sony ES receiver (in direct mode), i should try them soon with a Pass Aleph 30, i'm sure the sound will improve a lot.
P.p.s I don't know why but i'm not interested to try the Kef LS-50, there is something that keep me away to them.

 

I prefer the Proac Tablette 10 to both the P3ESR and the Sierra.

 

I never heard the Tablette, just Proac towers. What do you prefer on the Tablette over the others?
Do you think i could enjoy more the P3ESR over the Sierra 2 if i search a warmer and more forgiving sound? How is the bass of the P3ESR respect the Sierra at low volume?
Thanks

 

Here it is: When comparing speakers this good and so similar to each other you've absolutely got to hear them yourself. No way you can make sense of guy A saying 'The Harbeth is better than the Spendor' while guy B says 'the Spendor is better than the Harbeth'.

These are all good. And they're all so similar that some people will prefer one over the other. And it's really hard to say which one you'll prefer.

I prefer the Sierra over the Harbeth. But in some (smaller) rooms with only some kinds of music I might prefer the Harbeth over the Sierra.

They're all good.

 

Yes, i'm agree with you. It's really matter of personal tastes and kind of music a person is used to listen. I was just curios about the reproduction differences between them for frequencies and timbre just for try to have an idea of the sound of the Harbeth that i never listen. I listen a couple of time the Kef LS3/5A Raymond Cooke and i really liked them but was more than 4 years ago and not in my system.

 

So, I had the opportunity to try the Proac Tablette Anniversary and the PS

I had an opportunity to do an in home demo of the Proac Tablette Anniversary and the P3esr. Had both in home at the same time.

Paired to my MF A5 Int Amp the better match was the P3esr (published freq curves show a slight hi end roll off). Better overall tonal balance when driven by SS - imo.

The Proac Tablette Anniversary showed a tilt towards bright and detailed - too much for my tastes. And I own B&W CDM 1NTs and I *like* detail/air/sparkle.

The thing is, I also had the opportunity to try out a Synthesis tube integrated with the same speakers in home, and when the Proacs were paired to the tube integrated - that became the better match. The P3esr's with tubes was too much smoothness/warmness/softness for my tastes.

It's all about preferences and pairings.

 

but is the proac tablette anniversary the new tablette 10?