Grateful Dead Dave's Picks 2016 Subscription Thread

I'm not casting judgment on Mr Deluxe here or saying he's in this camp...

But we all know, and some have admitted, that they want full shows. If (and that's a qualified if) the same people complain that a given release is "weak" because of the first set/disc whatever cherry picked songs ruin the flow of the show isn't that a bit ridiculous?

I'm just saying I don't put much stock in those opinions. If you want "stronger" releases sometimes you need to acquiesce to a compilation. I certainly could do without another Chuck Berry cover. Ever.

 

Some people avoided the Road Trips series because most of them were compilations. For the very first volume, dead.net also offered a download of the whole show for those interested in having it all. That was a clever way of trying to keep everyone satisfied, but for some reason it was never put in practice again (it's worth noting that some Road Trips ended being full shows later in the series).
Personally, I'm interested in both kind of releases.

 

Amen.

 

You can put stock in whatever you want. As far as my opinion is concerned believe it if you need it; you know the rest.

As my GD collection has grown my view of this has changed. Likewise as my available listening time dwindles, I am more focused on the second sets. I am not a politician. I get to change my mind.

 

I put #11 up there near the top of this series. Its a '72 thing!

 

That's one that I will give another spin very soon. 11 and 12 both.

 

It's nice to see the full show vs. comp argument rear its alligator jaws and incite something close to sniping and a bit of defensiveness. I get the sense that I annoy some folks here occasionally, but I always manage to slog on; perhaps because I'm so freaking invested in a small percentage of this band and provide some modicum of analysis and input in exchange for the right for me to wax on opinion wise.

It's about time we actually got sick and tired of being acquiescent, latent hippies and admitted that it's not always the best thing to just get along (I'm half tongue in cheek here, so bear with me). We all have our preferences and we also have predilections toward changing one's own mind depending on context. Our individual opinions are very important, but slinging them against one another here is pretty much fruitless. (And I'm as guilty as anyone here on this topic; I do like to stir the pot every now and again.)

I'm all in favor of comps, but some of those Road Trips comps sucked, plain and simple (Austin, Denver, and IA/KY certainly excluded; they are among the best releases we've seen). That fed the whole show mentality. If you're going to give us crappy comps, we're out. I can't blame them. But look at Dick's 12, 14, and 31; those are damn-near perfect.

We need a mix of both. And, despite the recent claims of releasing "full shows," what we really have is full shows plus, which is fine with me. Dave's 11 has excellent filler from OK City; Dave's 18 and bonus disc has excellent filler from 7/16.

I personally love the Chuck Berry tunes, plus Me and My Uncle, Mexicali, Big River, etc., and could go to my grave without ever hearing another version of Stella Blue. See?

Bass player.

I'm out.

 

Arch has it right. Some shows need to be released in complete form. Others are better suited for a compilation. I enjoy both. Most of the time I listen in chunks. Like disc two of the newly released 7-8-78 today. But I am glad I have the whole show.

 

Talking about compilations, "Stepping Out with the Grateful Dead" might be my favourite Dead release I own

 

I started listening to the Dead in '05 but it never really took off until '13/14. So I wasn't around for the Download or Road trips series.

Road trips seems so uneven, there's good ones and there's not so good ones, comps and complete shows etc. Did they have a plan? I'll bet many members here could curate better compilations than what we got. Did the 80s and 90s shows sell that bad?(only one 80s from DaP)
I remember there being speed and pitch issues with one or two releases. Winterland '78 had potential, I like it but it could've been much better. Saving the 18th for another time?
The volume and numbers things is annoying and confusing. Stick to either one, not both.

The dreadfull cheap looking artwork for the download series didn't help. Was there digital liner notes included? I've only listened on spotify to a few.

The vault releases where good but Dave got a very rocky start with the series. And I agree that his first year of Dave's Picks was a bit lackluster. I do like #3 1971 for the reasons RNE mentioned but Austin '71 (road trips) is better

 

don't forget though dave did about 1/2 of the dicks picks as far as I know unless dick kept a journal that listed his favorite shows or something.

 

The way I see it, I have never had a hard time finding circulating shows in their most available complete form. If the band wants a compilation release when the rest of the show is avail, so be it, I know where to go for it.

I am, however, in the full show camp most of the time, even if it means songs I dont necessarily want included. Id prefer to be the one to decide which songs I want to hear and which I dont. Esp for shows I attended. I saw multiple shows on many tours, paid money to hear songs repeated several times throughout a tour, I have no problem paying for multiple versions of the same song, this is the GD after all. If there is missing or damaged material from the source recordings, and they want to fly in another patch, fine. Jarring patches from other sources are the worst tho, id rather the song be left out if a suitable patch isn't avail. or just splice it to make it quick.

Imho, if the full recording is avail, then release it. If there is material missing, then maybe a compilation would get it out there best. The best of both world with some of the releases: Spring 90 gave us who want full shows access to them, but those who wanted a compilation, well they made one of them avail too"So Glad You Made it.." E72 has seen multiple compilations along with access to the full shows. Cant beat that, everyone is happy.

 

This is where I stand as well generally speaking. Too many releases in the earlier years especially had great stuff left off when the were doing comps. Just a couple examples off the top off my head.

"Loser" from 3/24 was left off Dozin At The Knick". That caused an uproar back when it was released.

Dicks Picks 3 5/22/77 should have been a whole show release no question.

How the big jam from 9/11/74 isn't on Dicks Picks 7 is baffling.

The Fall 77' Road Trips shows (10/11/77, 10/14/77' and 10/16/77) all deserve to be released in full instead of all chopped up.

Cutting up 2/13 and 2/14/70 on Dicks Picks 4 instead of releasing both shows in full is a sin. (I'm sure Dick would've liked to release them both in full but likely wasn't allowed to back then)


I like Dicks Picks 31 a lot as far as comps go but I really think 8/4/74 and 8/5/74 are among the best shows of 1974. It would be nice to have them relaased in full.

I could go on and on..

Again, this is just my opinion, and I know I'm a pretty picky Deadhead. If a great show isn't releaseable in full due to cuts or missing reels or what not I'm ok with comps but if it's all there then give it to me and let* me*decide what I want to listen to.

 

This is a very strong argument for the full show position. I'm fully on board just as long as it doesn't result in "we didn't release that crazy good fragment because the rest of the show is unavailable/has problems" syndrome.

And fishcane, have you misplaced your copy of Zappa's Apostrophe?

 

I have been meaning to chime in on the whole comps issue for some time now and since I agree with this; my knock on comps is that some of the RT especially don't really get me lost in the whole show vibe, the ones you mentioned very much do that, I don't even recognize them as comps, and I would add the epic example for me is DiP 18-- it is just one giant show to me.

The beauty of the GD threads, unlike a few others around these parts, is that nobody tries to convince anyone they are wrong; an opinion might get tested every once in a while but that is about it... I see you've got your list out, say your piece and get out, if you will... just sayin' my piece!

 

Amen, brutha.

 

Dick had lots of listening notes, and he definitely had lists of favorite shows for a number of key years, some of which you can find here:
GD Miscellany »

Dave and Dick overlapped working together, and Dave has stated on a couple of occasions (including DaP 18) that some of his picks are shows that Dick turned him on to.

 

I wasn't trying to snipe. Just pointing out a potential irony. Tone doesn't convey well via text based medium.

And as others have pointed out the benefit of a full show is that I can (and do) choose to skip th songs I don't want to hear. It's nice to have them there if I change my mind.

My point was simply this: IF one wants a full show, AND they complain that a given release isn't good (enough) BECAUSE of a weak set one, for example, THEN that suggests that show may have benefited from some curation. There's an inherent irony there.

I tried to be careful not to point fingers here and frankly I don't remember who is in what camp, nor do I care. D'ruthers are just that. I wasn't trying to spark a debate. Luckily the amount of civility here is far greater than in other corners of the Internet.

There aren't a ton of shows that are "all killer, no filler".

My position is that a given show should be released in the way that makes the most sense for THAT show based on SQ, setlist, etc.

Bass player, too.

 

I play drums, bass and guitar, I'm better than both of you (until some drummer, bassist, guitarist, pianist/trombonist/violinist appears, of course).

 

A comp of a two or three night stand makes sense. There a many examples when we only have one of the nights.

One complete show on 3CDs verses the best of two nights on 3CDs? I'll take the comp every day and twice on sundays

 

Yeah, you're right - and all I really meant was, while we, more than some groups around here, are able to disagree in something of a harmonious way, sometimes we need to make our positions known and that requires "airing things out," and that can get a bit dicey at times. But, it's good to see we can do it and still come back to the table with as much if not more respect for one another than we already had.

Is what I meant.

 

This is one of the friendliest forums I've ever seen. I really mean it.

 

He also gave several interviews to Dupree's Diamond News and other Dead publications where he discussed shows he wanted to release.

 

And to our credit, the GD threads are easily among the friendliest here.

 

Blair’s Golden Road Blog - Sticking Up For Road Trips | Grateful Dead »

The above is a good description and overview of how and why they approached the Road Trips series, which I LOVE, the way they did. More Grateful Dead is more Grateful Dead to me. But I think coming to all these series as a relative new comer has a lot to do with why I like most all of them. It's just more to discover for me. And it's all mastered and packaged with info I didn't already know and pictures and esoterica. But if I was someone who was familiar ahead of time with all these shows and runs via old tapes, I'm sure I could be more skeptical and discerning about what was being released. It's all mana from heaven for us nOObies! Ignorance is indeed bliss in this case! Or I should say, MY case!