Petition launched to reintroduce Technics turntables (Update: The SL-1200 is Back!)*

When using the 92 degree optimal VTA, it's supposed to be an angle that traced though the center of the diamond to the point, not the edge of it. From that pic, it looks like it's much more than 92 degrees.

 

That's what I mean as tricky. Apparently, the Gyger S stylus is cut differently and the 92 degree rule is not applicable. It is obvious from the picture, that to achieve the 92 degree angle to go through the center of the stylus is impossible. It would have to be lowered by about 20 degrees. Clearly wouldn't work. Even if it did, it would be grossly out of whack with the 24degree VTA recommended in the Goldring installation manual.

Correction: The other cartridge I use is Dynavector 20X2L, not what I mistyped above.

 

Spindle isn't shorter. The GAE mat is thinner because of the platter brass weight. So, brass weight + thin mat = fat mat, height wise speaking.

 

While this makes some sense and would explain why no fat mat is included, it does not square with the relative height of the platter and the tonearm. On the old 1200, the minimum cartridge height accommodated with the fat mat is circa 14mm. On the GAE, with the brass weight + thin mat, the minimum cartridge height is still 17mm. So it seems on the GAE the platter is mounted lower and with the brass weight it comes to the same height relative to the tonearm as the old 1200 platter did without the brass weight, but the GAE spindle does not stick out as much.

 

"On-the-fly" when you're playing a thrift store Mitch Miller album, otherwise: Beware.

 

Holy cow. You get my award for Precision Set-Up King. Wow. I just put on my readers, squint, twist, and call it a day.

 

What is required to do this^^^ ?

 

Discussion here: How's my stylus look? (Digital USB microscope pic) »

 

Update on my SL-1200GAE experiences:

I had a call from my dealer to say the replacement headshell had arrived, went to pick it up, and <sigh> it turned out to be a standard, old-style headshell from the previous model. I might just as well have picked one up from a local DJ shop since they cost very little. What I don't know is: did they send me an old-style headshell because they don’t yet have spare parts for the new deck or because they’ve already recognised that the new-style headshell is defective and aren’t supplying it any more? In any event, the old-style headshell is better than the new one because it doesn’t have that very insecure set screw connecting the shell to the barrel connector. However, it does still have that rotational free play which I don’t like since you can accidentally change your azimuth without realising it. I don’t know whether any other make of headshell would fix this.

Moving on, the thing I most wanted to test and measure was the arm height (VTA). My cartridge is an Audio-Technica AT33PTG/II which has a height of 16mm. That’s 1mm less than the minimum height for the GAE, according to the user manual:



However, it is possible to turn the arm height control ring a little below zero and so you would expect to be only a fraction of a millimetre out when using this cartridge.

In reality, the following pictures show that the manual is wrong. In the first picture, you can see that I’ve placed a bubble level along the top of the arm and, using the cue lever, I’ve carefully lowered the arm to the point where the arm is exactly level and parallel with the record surface. (Before you ask, yes, the turntable itself has been very carefully and accurately levelled and everything has been set up in accordance with the manual.)





In the next picture, with the arm still in this exactly level position, I’ve gone round to the front of the arm and taken a picture of the gap between the needle and a standard-weight LP on the platter (with supplied mat, of course). The gap is obviously not less than 1mm and is in fact well in excess of that. I measured it by placing a pad of sticky notes under the needle and tearing notes off the pad until I was left with a depth that just filled the gap, and I then measured the thickness of the pad with a micrometer screw gauge. The gap turned out to be 3.5mm.



So to be realistic, allowing just a tiny margin for error, you would need to find a way of adding at least 4mm of padding if you wanted to use a 16mm cartridge with this turntable – more if you wanted to search for the sweet spot or if you like your VTA in a slightly tail-down position, with the arm sloping downwards a little from cartridge to pivot. The options would either be an unusually thick headshell spacer or an additional mat at least 4mm think - but bear in mind that there’s only 5mm left on the spindle before it tapers, as I showed in an earlier picture.

Something else to consider with a mat solution is that the platter is actually very finely balanced – every platter is custom-balanced at the factory to make it perfect - so the more weight you add in mats, the more you risk upsetting that very fine balance that you paid for.

I’m wondering whether to send Technics an email about this because it does appear that manual is factually incorrect and that in fact the turntable can’t be used as intended with a cartridge of less than around 20mm-21mm in height – which, for most people on this forum, is just about all of them!

 

In your sideways photo, the one showing the ~4mm "gap" between cart and mat, the cue arm is raised? Shouldn't it be lowered?

 

Agree with Sam - something is wrong here. My ortofon 2mblack is 18mm and is a perfect fit with the stock tonearm and VTA at "1" as suggested

 

But if he lowered the tonearm then the back end of the arm would be 4mm higher than the front even though that cartridge is only 1mm shorter than what the manual recommends. As far as I can tell, there are just about no cartridges that he could mount in order to get a level tonearm with the stylus in the groove. That tonearm seems to be mounted crazy high relative to the record surface for some reason.

 

Exactly. You use the VTA ring to adjust VTA with the arm lowered. That's the whole point of being able to adjust for different cart heights.

When you turn the ring, the entire arm will raise or lower. He can level the arm again by bringing down the back of the arm. The question is: Is his arm already lowered all the way.

In the old days, just about every damn cart or headshell came with a couple of spacers. I don't know what the fuss is all about. Just use some spacers. Looking at that that photo, those screws are sticking up way too high, anyway. It looks stupid. I've never seen anyone set up a turntable with bare screws sticking up that far out of the headshell.

AND in the bottom photo, the screws are in UPSIDE DOWN.

The nut goes into the slot on the bottom of the cart, not on top of the headshell.

 

if the tonearm is raised, then it is artificially lifted. VTA is adjusted with the tonearm lowered into the record. there's nothing about this GAE system that is different in terms of general operation than a 1200mk2. Has back2vinyl been trying to adjust VTA with the tonearm lifted this entire time?

 

Can you make a video of that play?

 

I hate to say it, but there's something fishy going on here....

He says he leveled the arm (top photo) and then moved around front (bottom photo) to show the gap. Then why is the headshell screw installed two different ways in the two photos? As you can see in the main photo (inset) it is installed correctly with the head of the screw facing upward and in the front facing photo (main photo) it's installed incorrectly with the thread of the screw facing upwards.

These photos were not taken at the same time.

 

Are you looking at those photos on a smartphone? The screws are facing the same direction in both photos. Those are the standard gold-colored AT mounting screws and nuts. The nuts also have slots on them. The nuts are plainly visible in the same spot on both photos on my monitor. The cartridge is installed with the screws going up through the cartridge and the nuts are on top in both instances.

 

It's a conspiracy

 

To me it looks that on both photos screws are upside down.

 

And by using the arm lift he is just trying to show that the parallel position is otherwise unachievable. The ring is at zero already.

 

That's exactly the case. The screws are upside down in both photos. The Audio-Technica nuts have slots on them too so they might look like screw heads on a smartphone or small tablet or something.

 

Lifting the Technics tonearm with the cue lifter doesn't raise the base of the tonearm. It just pivots the tonearm. If the tonearm is parallel with the record surface with the stylus so high above the surface of the record and the tonearm height ring already at "0", the tonearm will be significantly sloped when the stylus is in the groove. I have an SL-1210MK5. I've run these sorts of experiments before.

 

I downloaded them, blew them up and created the composite photo in Photoshop on my mac. Maybe I'm wrong, if I am I apologize, but I sure don't see the threads of that screw sticking up out of the top of that headshell.




JFK! JFK! ROSWELL! ROSWELL!

The thing I really can't believe is that I'm defending the Technics GAE!

Oh wait, I see it. If you turn the photo upside down you can see the screw. Now I get it. My apologies to back2vinyl!

 

Ouch - that is bad - the arm is way too high. I've never had that problem with my Technics - I've always had an abundance of VTA.

And yes everyone - he is using the queue lever to bring the cart up to the proper VTA.

 

The nuts have slots on them. You're looking from above at a slight angle down on the threads with the nut on it. The screw is oriented the same way in the other photo.