New Grateful Dead July 1978 box set*

Ryan Adams on Marc Maron's WTF podcast
WTF with Marc Maron Podcast: Episode 785 - Ryan Adams
The last 5-10 mins is a stunningly beautiful discussion about The Grateful Dead.

 

First of all, you have not asserted any legal precedent on the issue; I do not recall ever seeing a legal holding asserting that the owner of physical music product has to turn over all dubs and uploads before reselling. As far as morality goes, as a consumer, if I want to dub copies of my music and/or upload files, I have no issue keeping those dubs or files if I later sell the physical product (although to be transparent, I have never actually done it, but hypothetically speaking, I don't see an issue with it). And what about music consumers who sell part of a physical music set (sometimes they sell a book, a Blu-ray, or a vinyl pressing from a box set, but keep other components of it), where do they fall on your morality and legal spectrum? Isn't the good faith, bona fide purchaser of the resold item entitled to all aspects of the original product? The bottom line, is that I don't think there is an obvious standard that people should adhere to on this issue.

Now back on topic, how do you feel about the Red Rocks shows? They seem to have received the most fanfare, but I think the St. Paul and Omaha shows may be better.

 

that last Red Rocks show is hard to beat. i like the St. Paul show a lot and it could be the favorite if it had that fantastic Wharf Rat that 7/8 has. 7/7 has that Black Peter right in the middle of the second set that i just can't understand. total buzzkill.

I like Omaha better than St. Paul but i'll give the edge to 7/8 Red Rocks.

 

I simply don't see it like that. If you sell it, you're selling all of it and surrendering your licence/hold/title of it. I don't think that digital technology should permit someone to circumvent ownership, just because it's harder to enforce. Anyway, I'll drop it. Nevermind.

 

So, the physical product is still available?

 

Looks like it. While it puts in perspective how certain periods are more desirable than others, it is a bit surprising that the '78 set never sold out.

 

i was thinking about buying this (i jumped on the new May 77 box), but what kept me away... too much Bobby slide (that, i can't get out of my head) and Jer sounds a little ragged in voice, I don't know...
i do like some of the college tour off of the archive, but i just passed, i tried to convince myself, and was close

 

Interestingly it was advertised as a real deal, contrary to the earlier May 1977 (allegedly) "gap-filler" boxset (now sold out).

Not sure whether I will ever need so many mid-1978 shows, but truth to be told I am still not acquainted with this year...

 

I love 1978 at least the first half of it.
Things go south a bit later on in the year.

 

To these ears, the July '78 shows from this box from this box set have a similar vibe and approach to '77.

 

My take is that it's because '77, and to a lesser extent, '78 have an aura about them based on casual fans voting for many '77-'78 tracks as right up there among their best. Partly because they are among the most accessible from a mainstream perspective and partly because once 1,000 fans vote for a favorite, another 1,000 fans check out that favorite and vote for it without checking out the other ~several hundred (in many cases) versions. Grateful Dead requires some homework; well, not if one is a lemming, of course.

Now I'll grant you that '77-'78 is fantastic for first set material such as Peggy-O, Jack-A-Roe, The Music Never Stopped, Lazy Lightning--> Supplication, etc. That's why I pre-ordered the most recent May '77 box. But if I never hear another China White-infused Estimated--> Eyes or an infernal Scarlet--> Fire in my remaining days, I will be quite content.

I realize that I'm mixing '77 and '78, and while that may seem a minor indiscretion to a casual fan, '77 and '78 could not be more different when considered on the whole. But this is the internet and I try to occasionally water-down my opinions so the casual fan (who typically objects to any negative discussion of '77 as if I were a philistine) can sort of hang in there and realize that 1972-1974 is so good, but it requires a bit of work, y'know?

 

I can appreciate your position on the matter, but I do not agree with it. And while I may not be a Grateful Dead expert, I am certainly not a casual fan either. I have more than my fair share of 1972-1974 recordings via Dick's Picks, Road Trips, Dave's Picks, various Europe '72 releases, and mainstream titles, and agree that it is a prime GD era. Even so, I still hold 1977 in very high regard, and it is not primarily because it is more accessible, or that I am a "casual" fan. I like the musical approach and evolution of the band's sound. If one likes 1977, they should not automatically be considered less sophisticated. Some of us like what we like, regardless of popular opinion. Personally, I think there are brilliant moments from various GD eras, including both 1977 and 1978, a period you seem to dismiss as being overrated, perhaps based on a perception that it doesn't require the same amount of work to "get" as the 1972-1974 era. As far as the July 1978 recordings go, I was a bit surprised at how much I enjoyed them because I did not have the highest expectations going in. Additionally, I don't think my viewpoint that there are similarities between 1977 and the 1978 shows in question is meritless; yes, the two years are quite different in some ways, but there is also a sense of uniformity or familiarity between the two, at least with certain material. Of course, because I don't possess 500+ shows and cannot differentiate between all the intricate nuances, perhaps I am simply a GD novice. If that is the case, ignorance is bliss.

 

Hey man, you may not agree with it, but I was not directing my post to you; I was directing my post to those who casually come in here and get butt hurt because someone suggests that '77 is the ultimate, blah, blah and blah and I then disagree. There is no ultimate. I've found your posts to be very genuine if somewhat infrequent, but frequency isn't a requirement here.

I didn't mean to imply that you are a casual fan. I meant to strongly imply that there are casual fans who come here, after we spend hours and hours dissecting the minituae of '69-'74 Dead and all the concomitant modal craziness and meltdowns and recapitulations, and they go apoplectic because we don't see 1977 as awesome as those neophytes see it.

So yes, I'm a bit narcissitic; I'll grant you that. But I've also put in several thousand of hours listening to this band, so I do have some basis for my position.

Again, I was making a point based on your post, and quoted it for context. I was certainly not responding directly to you, only your point of context.

Sorry for any confusion or annoyance.

 

Well this casual fan is going to put on some sweatpants and my finest loungewear and completely get down to the new box in the most casual way possible when it arrives.

 

Yeah. Its not Ultimate Dead, but in May and June 1977 they were on ****ing fire.

 

I'm kind of tempted to get it in anticipation of the '77 release. It's more than two months to go, after all.

 

I realize I'm editing your quote quite significantly so I apologize in advance. But man I just cannot agree and let that Estimated comment go without a rebuttal. Yes I agree Estimated is overplayed in 77-78, just like Weather Report Suite in 73-74 and Sailor>Saint in 79-80. Bobby did like his new tunes and played them nightly and to death. But getting back to Estimated...the tone, the volume and just down right nastiness, funkiness that Jerry played on those Estimates of that era would never be replicated. IMHO the '79 till the end in '95 versions never came close to reaching the level of 77-78. There are some good ones in those years don't get me wrong, but not at all the same as that era. Maybe you just don't like the song?

 

See, I could listen to WRS jams all day long. I actually like the studio version of Estimated. I guess I don't care for the envelope filter Jerry used so prominently. It affects me much like midi.

 

1977 is the ultimate year. There are other great years, but this is the best single year in the history of the band.

 

Interesting...'73-'74 WRS jams were strong and used as some major launch points to other worlds. Not being a musician I am guessing the filter would be the same affect he uses on Shakedown? Which again would be '78 era so maybe just not your jam (Which brings up another issue for me...why did it take the Dead so long in '78 to perform Shakedown live was it just the fact that it was one of the last songs recorded for that LP?).

I can understand the midi is hit or miss with most heads. I for one liked it. I think for Jerry is was something new and not the same old same old. Loved it in Birdsong, some other songs not so much.

 

Interesting. The MIDI can be hit or miss for me but I LOVE the envelope filter and that funky vibe Jerry throws down with it.

 

I'm a big 1977 fan, but I think their best year was 1972.

 

See, this right here is what people are on about.

I haven't made a formal list, but 1977 is nowhere near the top of my 'best year of the band' list. It might be near the bottom of the top 10.

 

Cant be the ultimate year with no Dark Star, sorry.... Well played and consistent, but with shallow setlist depth and no super deep space travel it cannot be definitive, imho.

1977 isn't even in my top 5, hasn't been for 30 years

 

Only if you leave out 1968-1974. The heroin years do not measure up.

The envelope filter is awesome. So awesome that I felt I needed one, too. Although mine is more functional as a paperweight (out of practice, soon remedied!). I dislike the MIDI altogether.

Bottom of the top 10 sounds about right. 1971, 1970, 1969, 1972, 1974, 1973 are the top 6, and etched in stone.

Perfectly stated.