Alien : Covenant

Fair enough.

I got to tell you honestly though that "that was a stupid movie" just doesn't tell me anything.

I'm not really clear what laws established in the "Alien" universe that he violated except, perhaps, the gestation and growth of the "Alien". That honestly doesn't bother me all that much. I'd disagree with you that they are poorly thought out per se. There are far more illogical things and violations of rules in many films--including some great ones--that I think we are willing to give a pass for a variety of reasons. The writing in "Prometheus" was sloppy to be sure. Since the last two films were Scott's first return to this universe. I've gotten used to Scott's imperfections in his films--and they all have them from story logic issues to issues with his decisions.

I find them interesting myself. Scott has never been about telling a flawless narrative or continuity all we have to do is look at just about any of his films--including some of his best. The few stories that Scott does without any sort of flaw in the narrative is where he walks into a completed script where he can't mess with it too much. It's jt Scott. Should be do better? Absolutely but, clearly, that doesn't matter to him.

I guess I'm not so critical about that aspect of the films--I looked at the overall impact of the story and, in particular, David's story which interests me. In essence, I look at the introduction of the xenomorph as simple fan service that Scott added in there because fans were upset it wasn't in the "Prometheus". I think it's part of the compromise of the business of making movies. I think those are minor flaws overall.

 

That's precisely why it was done--to get directly to the action. There is so much in the film that possibility wasn't going to be developed the way it should. Were there things that bugged me? Yeah the gestation period. Was it sloppy? Yep. Still enjoyed it and willing to overlook it because the overall impact was pretty good for me. With all the awful things that could have been in that film and has been in some of the sequels, if that's the worst there is, it doesn't bother me. At least there was an attempt to tell an actual story and it didn't focus primarily on the xenomorph. Would it have been better without it? Yep. It was fan service and I suspect he would have preferred to not have it in the film but worked with what he had to do to sell it to fans that complained about no xeno in "Prometheus".

 

Yeah but they do it on Star Trek all the time, too--which is why that was even more funny. That wasn't a comedy. Again, who knows what was cut but I agree a simple throw away line would have been enough to explain it.

We can nitpick movies all day and TV shows as well.

 

So I guess people would rather sit around for 30 mins waiting for the alien to hatch?

 

Were the facehuggers here the same as ones we've seen before, though? I thought it was already pointed out that these creatures were different as they had combined with the native population. Doesn't David even make a point of saying something about the creature being so adaptable? Maybe the generation of Xeno's on this planet born from the pathogen infecting the creatures are able to gestate much quicker.

 

It was as any 2nd film in a trilogy would be.
Elements of the first whilst ground setting for the next.
I just expected David would set course for Earth (and not the original destination of the Covenant) due to his attitude to his human creators.
If the next takes place between the first 2?......is this gonna be 4 films?

 

Spoiler

Indeed and that may be the unexplained explanation for this because clearly some of the Engineers either survived or showed up later to become lab fodder for David. I suspect though that the mother of these face huggers was supposed to be Shaw based n what we see and know (when David put her in cyrosleep in the bit that played online as a preface to this film). We honestly won't know until the next film but it would make sense that David combined the DNA with a number of Engineers and even Shaw as he created the creature and, since we know from previous films, that the Xenomorph takes on characteristics of whatever animal it gestated it, that could play a role as well. Again, the rules are being rewritten to a degree because they never established any long term rules for the films. I know, at one point, Scott worked with Cameron on some of this as well ages ago but don't know if this had been incorporated into the current universe. To your point all of these objections about inconsistency could very well be answered if we are patient. There are some things than can be inferred from the film as well. [/spoilers]

 

Yeah my thoughts exactly. There are some compromises because of the amount of plot elements that Scott was juggling and the length of the movie, again, this could easily be explained just because we don't get an explanation doesn't mean it doesn't exist outside of the film. I can understand hey someone might not like it but let's be clear that this isn't all inclusive in terms of information.

 

Of course, unless it actually did take 30 minutes in the movie, then people would be complaining that it took too long for the alien to hatch.

 

Spoiler

Despite its faults, Prometheus was refreshing with the new direction that it took and I found the Engineers fascinating (and they are absent from Covenant dammit!). I did like the way David was handled in the new movie - his relation to his "father" and how that affected his future behaviour - the whole Shelly "Frankenstein or The Modern Prometheus" idea.
I was disappointed that Covenant repeats so many scenes that we have already had before. I think it was a script mistake to have taken the xenomorph onto the ship at the end because the only was to dispose of one is to send it into the vacuum of space (if you shoot it, it'll melt a big hole in the ship). A desperate escape from the planet, combating aliens, would have been better.

 

don't remember nobody complaining about the original alien

 

I am only referring to Covenant, not the original.

 

Of course, because they weren't trying to find fault with it by comparing it to something that came before.

 

Unfortunately that's been done to a degree with some of the other films as well. I thought the entire purpose of that sequence was also to echo what happened with "Alien", Ash and the end of the film. It didn't bother me that it echoed those elements as well as plenty of films do that and it wasn't handled quite the same. I'm looking forward to the next film to see what prompted David to do what he did on the Engineer's settlement and Shaw's fate. I suspect that we will see them interact WITH the Engineers and that David found humanity's god wanting...

 

I can't agree with you about the repeats. They came across more as a pathetic attempt to satisfy the "fans of the old movies". It's an insult to the intelligence and expectations of those fans.
As for seeing what happened between the two planets, I can't see them devoting an entire film to it. Unless of course we imagine a scenario where David and Shaw come into contact with the engineers on a planet which isn't the one we see in Covenant - a whole adventure there, in which they eventually escape and destroy the Engineers that they encounter. Thus giving David his real motivations for the horrors ahead. However I think that would even more disenchant the punters who were disappointed by the first two prequels.

 

I really enjoyed it.

 

Spoiler

One of my favorite comedic science fiction lines of all time is in Flesh Gordan when they step out of the space ship, take a deep breath and say "Good, there's air on this planet!". So many movies these days I repeat that line and A:C was one of them.

 

I enjoyed Covenant. I thought it was entertaining and it kept my attention for two hours.

 

Didn't insult me or the other people we went with as a fan of the original movie, I thought it was fine. I mean, really, how many conclusions that are going to blow away your audience in terms of scope can you do?

They wanted a big close out. If it hadn't already been done, you could call it foreshadowing of things to come.

As far as the story for David and Shaw, you'll have to take that up with Ridley because he was interviewed and stated as such.

I think that Scott compromised here with this story combining elements of both to hopefully draw them in.

 

I also enjoyed it. I find a lot of the nitpicking to be silly.

 

Well they aren't absent they just get courtesy screen time because of what David does.

 

Actually someone I know watched the original "Alien" because he hadn't seen it in years and he complained about how slow the original "Alien" was especially compared to more "modern" films. I chuckled and just reminded him he is part of the impatient generation.

 

I saw this last night. I liked it, but it wasn't as good as Prometheus.

Spoiler

My one big criticism would be that I wished they would have spent more time with the Neomorph instead of quickly moving on to the Xenomorph.

 

Yes, I think they did that as part of the fan service based n complaints about the first film. AC wasn't as audacious or ambitious but it was, overall, less problematic with less gaps in the script IMHO. That type of stuff occurs when you have too many rewrites and changes piecing together a script from previous drafts.

 

It is too bad that fan complaining is resulting in a much less interesting story.