Life without tone controls ... it sucks!

Discussion in 'Audio Hardware' started by albertoderoma, Mar 19, 2011.

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  1. SandAndGlass

    SandAndGlass Twilight Forum Resident

    It is, I have a 500C that has been restored professionally. I don't yet have a wood case for mine, but plan on getting a nice case for it. there is a company who makes new cases for vintage Fisher products, McIntosh, etc...

    Due to their complexity, I don't recommend them to everyone. If you don't need a vintage tuner or phono preamp, most would be better off with a Fisher or Scott integrated amplifier from the early 60's.

    Cost is less to buy, less to restore, less expensive on tubes, which are inexpensive. These integrated's can be bought and professionally restored for $800-$1,000, for everything.
     
  2. needlestein

    needlestein GrooveTickler

    Location:
    New England
    I don't have tone controls and I don't miss them. But if someone else wants them and likes them, hey, whatever floats your boat, I say. I had tone controls and *gasp* an equalizer when I had a solid state system. I thought it helped a great deal. But when I went to tubes, I hooked up the equalizer and the sound went so flat that I immediately unhooked it and never looked back. Could be that there are tube amps with great tone controls that don't ruin the signal, but none of my tube amps have tone controls and, frankly, they don't need them.
     
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  3. Manimal

    Manimal Forum Resident

    Location:
    Southern US
    I don't know what is is with tone controls and some people, maybe they feel their boutique audiophile electronics are somehow diminished by the possibility that they are somehow less than perfect as they are in their pure perfect form. Me i'm cranking that bass:)
     
  4. Heavy Music

    Heavy Music Forum Resident

    I tried the flat "No Tone Controls" setup years ago. What happened in my case anyway, I found myself mostly listening to the more newer/recent released records that sounded good as they needed no tonal adjustments (at least to my ears). So I was not to interested in a lot of my older records, that in my opinion, needed some tone adjustment and I couldn't, because there was no controls on my pre-amp . So, out with the new, and back to the old and have not missed it since.
     
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  5. Manimal

    Manimal Forum Resident

    Location:
    Southern US
    Well said!
     
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  6. Robert M.

    Robert M. Forum Resident

    I used to frequently tweak the sound with bass and treble controls, but when I upgraded my sources and amplification, the quality and loudness of the bass improved dramatically, and the treble lost its glare, with a much less fatiguing sound for almost all recordings. (Thanks to Jon at Ultra Fidelis).

    However, every once in awhile I wish I could take some of the frost off the top of a hot recording, or give a slight bump at the bottom when it was rolled off for whatever reason.

    If I could find a preamp that could do that without mucking up the soundstage and midrange bloom, I'd buy in. My guess is that even with bypass circuitry, there's still some degradation of the signal/sound, and/or it's cost prohibitive to do so without compromise.

    Hope this helps,

    Robert Martellaro
     
    Heavy Music likes this.
  7. hesson11

    hesson11 Forum Resident

    Unless, of course, it's your recordings and not your system that need tone controls. If you love classical music and listen to performances that go back almost to the dawn of recording itself, tone controls can be very helpful. It would be awfully tough to get Toscanini or Furtwangler back in front of the microphones to re-record their work.
    -Bob
     
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  8. BrokenByAudio

    BrokenByAudio Forum Resident

    Wait, we STILL have people saying tone controls are some sort of evil...???? Really people??
     
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  9. stonecold

    stonecold Forum Resident

    Led Zeppelin IV Canadian reissue vinyl from the late 70s...tone controls are your friend. Actually I don't think anything could really help that mess.
     
  10. DaleClark

    DaleClark Forum Resident

    Location:
    Columbus, Ohio
    I imagine there are people listening to music saying..".this sounds too boomy or too bright"......"BUT, I'm suppose to like it how it sounds...so..it sounds great ...but I really know it sounds like crap"

    LOL...god forbid a set of BOSE headphones sound nice
     
  11. Heckto35

    Heckto35 Forum Resident

    You're joking right? That's the biggest load of bullsh*t there is.
     
  12. tim185

    tim185 Forum Resident

    Location:
    Australia
    Well, yes and not really.
    If your room is treated, you shouldnt need them.
    Otherwise, you may well prefer to have that control.
     
    bru87tr likes this.
  13. BrokenByAudio

    BrokenByAudio Forum Resident

    First of all, most rooms are not perfect, and even if it was.... Secondly, every system has different sonic character that may or may not deal with any given recording in a way that is optimal to the listener. Third, the mix of any given recording is whatever the engineer wanted it to be so if you prefer great amounts of bass or less shimmer up to, whatever, how are you going to make changes to please your ears more if you don't have some way to manipulate frequencies?

    I spent an evening recently with a couple of close friends out east (both of whom show up here at SHTV regularly) and we were listening to some music and I thought the bass was a consistently overdone at one point and asked that it be toned down a bit...only to find out that the integrated amp (Musical Fidelity) didn't have tone controls. Oh...just have to live with it I guess...

    Honestly people...this is about the most absurd argument consistently heard in the audio world and it just does not go away. It makes ZERO sense. My MEN220 has six equalizer presets programmed in (and each can be custom set if so desired)--one of which is neutral-- and I am consistently moving around between those presets depending on the recording, the volume, and my perception to optimize the sound quality of the signal is coming through my speakers. I WANT TO MAKE IT SOUND THE MOST PLEASING TO MY EARS. What is so difficult to understand about this concept?
     
  14. ZenArcher

    ZenArcher Senior Member

    Location:
    Durham, NC
    One thing about computer-based playback is that you can apply tone controls on a track-by-track basis. Your great recordings are untouched, while that French Django Reinhardt CD with all the bass sucked out of it gets a little boost.
     
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  15. GuildX700

    GuildX700 Forum Resident

    Location:
    USA
    My main rig is wired for total bypass with my modded Adcom GFP 565 preamp so there are no tone controls/filters/DC caps available.

    I could use the other outputs on that preamp which add the tone controls and such but I gave up as they did not fix much of what I listen to anyhow. The bypass is so much cleaner sounding overall on all signal sources that it was the logical route to take.

    The only thing I'd probably like is a low filter for some vinyl recordings that seems to have a bass hump rumble, but a low filter would not match that need perfectly anyhow.

    As a kid I had to have bass/treble/loudness, hi/low filter, and even a few big band EQ's and parametrics, at one point I lusted for the oddball midrange control too!

    But the more time that has passed the less true value they've really shown for the bulk of recordings I listen to that need "fixing" anyhow.

    Now days I have no such controls in the signal path in most of my rigs. And that did not start from a purist standpoint but from a standpoint that the controls were not doing what I needed anyhow.

    And now I'm happy as can be with the less is more route.

    I'll try and find recordings/pressings that don't need drastic "fixing" to be listenable as my alternative, as the several listening rigs I have are as sorted out as they ever will be.


    I'll settle for 90% of the listening source as sounding great and muddle through the 10% that don't rather than try and have fixes for that last 10%. Just not worth it.

    To each his own.

    But the chance of anyone properly "fixing" the sonic issues with source material on their own with knobs, buttons, EQ's, digital programs is a random shot ion the dark at best anyhow, for every adjust one makes there is something else sonically one has just threw out of adjustment anyhow.
     
    Kristofa likes this.
  16. Litejazz53

    Litejazz53 Perfect Sound Through Crystal Clear Digital

    Well, this thread can stop right here with BrokenByAudio and ZenArcher, some people post opinions and some people post FACTS, there is really nothing more that needs to be added to these two posts, 100% on target! Yep :righton:
     
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  17. GuildX700

    GuildX700 Forum Resident

    Location:
    USA
    Sure about that are you now??? FACTS? Huh, funny stuff.
     
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  18. Isaac K.

    Isaac K. Forum Resident

    Honestly this thread could have ended a year ago. Every single angle of this conversation has been covered and 39 pages in all that is happening now is people repeating things that have already been posted multiple times over.
     
    Chooke likes this.
  19. Shiver

    Shiver Forum Resident

    Location:
    UK
    I don't miss having tones controls as such, but wouldn't mind a 'soft' button to dampen the treble on a few hot/sibilant recordings... How's that for counter-intuitive thinking :tiphat:
     
    Last edited: May 25, 2017
  20. Litejazz53

    Litejazz53 Perfect Sound Through Crystal Clear Digital

    Absolute FACT, however I have to protect my sources! :uhhuh:
     
  21. GuildX700

    GuildX700 Forum Resident

    Location:
    USA
    Well there you go, folks can dial away on knobs and EQ sliders and push buttons all they want, but NONE of that guarantees any more accurate of audio reproduction of the source material versus none of that stuff in the end. THAT is a FACT.

    I was under the assumption accuracy of playback WAS the goal, EH?
     
  22. GuildX700

    GuildX700 Forum Resident

    Location:
    USA
    Yup. To each his own, just quite trying to push on side onto another.
     
  23. wgb113

    wgb113 Forum Resident

    Location:
    Chester County, PA
    Some people like hearing the varying quality of recordings. Some like to goose the tone controls. Who really cares? Isn't this hobby all about further enjoying the music we love?
     
    dalem5467 likes this.
  24. GuildX700

    GuildX700 Forum Resident

    Location:
    USA
    Yup, dial in all the "correction" you want, or "need".
     
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