How 'Hard Sell' Are The Dealers You've Visited? (and how snobby?)

Just getting a gauge since I have to go visit a bunch of 'em in the not-so-distant future (and I've been away from the scene for 25 years or so).

How are high-end audio dealers these days? (I'm not talking guys who carry 'sorta kinda nice stuff', aka the kind of shop that is largely mass-fi but is together enough to carry maybe a couple of Rega 'tables or something).

Are they traumatized by online competition, to the point where if you don't buy from them right away, they look at you like, "You jackass. I bet you're show-rooming me, aren't you? Waste-of-time little punk." Even though what's really going on is that you're seeing multiple dealers.

Oh, and how's the snobbery level nowadays? Dress nice and look like you're in a particular income bracket or you won't be taken seriously? Might not even get to hear equipment?

I have tons of discretionary income to spend, yet am very much a jeans-and-T-shirt kind of guy, and have a breezy, informal manner to boot (i.e. not self-important/stuffy, which seems to signal '$$$' to some ppl). So, it's a concern.

What's the general atmosphere out there like nowadays? And would you say it's changed in recent years (internet!), or is about the same as its ever been?
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Mine sucks.

Pushy, arrogant, my gear all sucks, his is better.

I stifled him w my measley little sunfire 600 and his McIntosh/krell stuff.

Blew him away. He won't admit his inferiority , that my little sunfire bested his monos.
So be it.

Hail Robert Carver!!!!

 

I love Hanson's Audio in Dayton... awesome group of folk... can't say enough good things about those guys. Very helpful... albeit somewhat biased (e.g. Clearaudio- which they do carry vs VPI- which they don't carry) but I believe it comes from a good place. Never tried to hard sell me anything, either.

 

The two high end stores I've frequented in the La Jolla area are totally low key, no pressure, no attitude.

So if you're fishing for snobs, none here.

 

It's still a little bit of everything you've mentioned, also depending on demographic. More competition definitely put them on better behaviour. The smarter outlets terminated their brick and mortar location and work out of a residence by appointment only. That gives them the ability to qualify you better before you set step on their turf and possibly waste their time, At the same time avoiding the looks and alternate attitude that could potentially hurt their reputation of word gets out. The world never changed there's just as many tire kickers as ever. I could sympathize with their approach, whatever their business template is.

 

The folks at the store near me are more condescending than snobby, though I've made some purchases from them. There is an old line Mid-Fi store I've been to that does a good business, whose owners are very down to earth and helpful. Not worth the OP boarding a plane to fly cross country for, however.

 

I suggest your attitude will determine more than what others think a certain store may be.
Yes, there are snobby, terrible salesmen in the high end audio game.
Usually though I find them as involved as you want them to be.
Ask intelligent questions and you will get intelligent answers. Ask inane questions and you will soon be left standing alone.
They all have a favorite. They all have a product to push this month. They all have a bottom line to meet.

As long as you understand this you may be able to go shopping with great success.

Be honest, be open, don't waste their time and don't be the annoying know it all who ends up telling them how to do their job.
If the guy sucks move on and forget about that particular guy, not the whole store.
If the guy is great remember this and continue doing business with them.

 

Very well said!!

 

Ironically, the delear near me who sells the most expensive and esoteric stuff is the least pushy, easiest to converse with, and most honest, also has great taste in gear.

The other two seem to be having an identity crises regarding their target market. One dealer has McIntosh and Revel Salons in a room next to a bunch of mid-level car audio stuff.

In all, I've had mixed experiences with local and out of state dealers, but I prefer the attitudes of the midwest guys. I suspect it's because they sell less volume and have greater need for my humble business.

 

My closest dealer is KT88 on these boards. Bill likes what he sells, but I have no problem with that. No pressure at all, and is pretty much the same guy in person as on the boards. He knows his products and loves and sells vinyl. Bought my P3 and Dyna 202xh from Bill and would love to drop a little cash with him for a Rogue CMII, but that will have to wait. I also like Audio Advice in Charlotte. Walked in wearing a t-shirt and shorts and was treated very well. They have more extreme high end stuff than Bill, but they told me they sell more Planar 1 tables than the rest of the stuff combined. Bought my Sutherland KCvibe from them. If I ever win Powerball or MegaMillions, I will visit them as soon as I get my money. Martin Logan 15A, Audio Research REF electronics and a VPI Titan. I'm too old to dream of hot blondes, so this is about my best option.

 

Dedicated Audio, which has a prominent online presence, is also my local dealer that I have purchased the most gear from. Dan Harmon, the owner is fantastic to deal with. I'm treated well when I visit the showroom, allowed some privacy & freedom to demo equipment at leisure, and offered pretty good deals when I'm ready to purchase. All-around, top notch service.

 

I've done business with several dealers in Portland: Stereotypes, Echo Audio, Chelsea AV, Fred's Sound of Music. Each one has been helpful, has arranged demos, even has delivered heavy gear for purchase or demo. I think it helped that I wasn't in a rush, and I tried to adapt to each dealership's style. One of those places has a very friendly, energetic, enthusiastic salesman (who is really great at his job). Another is the polar opposite -- sometimes it seems hard to get anyone to say hello. But they've all done a great job when I asked them to.

What no dealer can (or should) do is tell you what you like or what your audio priorities are; and they usually can't make a large speaker work in a small room. Also, don't expect to take home expensive gear for audition without laying down a credit card for a deposit, maybe for the full amount. It might happen once they know you, but no one wants to get left holding the bag. Finally, if a dealership does go to the mat for you, don't expect more than 10%-12% discount. They can't keep supporting you if you don't support them.

P.S. No one at any of the above has ever given me a hard sell.

 

None in my experience. Then again, in your area, who knows? Best get booking up!

 

I am the exclusive dealer for Audio Note (UK) and Music First Audio (also UK) for Los Angeles and Orange counties, California. I should be pretty snobby, right? But I am not at all. I enjoy playing music and sharing a good listen so much, that I forget to "sell". Is there anyone here that can vouch for me, in this regard?

I figure, that if I can put together demo systems that truly make "magic", and play great music of all varieties, people will ask me to let them buy something. Of course I will, particularly if you promise to invite me over, and play magical music for me at your house someday. Maybe I can encourage you to experiment with speaker location and cartridge VTA, with my ears helping you listen for the differences.

 

Years ago I had a very unpleasant experience when looking for speakers. I went into a shop that I thought had very good listening areas of various sizes and was met at the door by one of the employees who was stepping outside smoke a cigarette with his colleagues. IIRC, This shop was also the dealer for Dali, had a massive display of high end speakers and a dedicated room for B&O equipment.

"You can get inside, just looking is free" is what I heard. I was too stunned to reply that with an outside temperature hovering around 32-34C there was no chance of me going out in anything but shorts, T and sandals. This guy obviously expected smartly dressed customers and didn't let courtesy stop him from expressing his views. I was basically ignored and left alone by the staff so I wisely decided to take my business elsewhere.

Which brought me to the dealer for Cambridge Audio, who's located about 1Km from where I live. They listened to what I wanted, explained why some of the things I had in mind were not recommended and didn't try to push their brand too hard. I ended up buying from them quite a lot, including a Cambridge Audio DVD player which I didn't really need.

 

Maybe it depends on where you live. I've been to most of the high end retailers in my state and in Massachusetts. While my experiences with them varied, it had nothing to do with their respective attitudes. I've never run into a salesperson who was pushy or snobby.

 

Seems like that's too often the case - rude or indifferent behavior from staff at one place drives one to the competition. I wonder how many ppl wind up with the dealers they do because of that, lol. But, sorry you had to encounter that.

'Back in the day' as a young audiophile, I definitely ran into the 'he probably doesn't have money, ignore him' thing more than once. But I never really dealt with a truly rude guy except one time... it was over at the old Audible Difference store in Palo Alto, CA.

And, it was kinda my fault. I started talking to an old guy there (might've been the owner, might've been a senior employee, don't recall) who I knew from other ppl's stories was a jerk. His nickname, in fact, was The Audible Indifference™, lol.

Long story short, he walked away from me in mid-sentence. I'm sure I looked too young, not enough money, etc. etc. Ah well.

Nowadays if that happened, I'd probably just say, "Hey cupcake, you do know I could drop $50K on a system here without breaking a sweat, right? But if that's how you act, who needs ya? Buh-bye."

I mean, seriously? Who needs to re-enact the clothes-shopping scene from Pretty Woman? Yeesh.

These days, I just consider bad behavior from a dealer as them self-selecting themselves out of my potential dealer pool. No bad feelings, just 'thank you' for helping narrow down my list in a hurry..

 

My dealer Audio Video Therapy in NH formerly Ensemble I've been dealing w/for almost 25 years. They moved their store around 5 years ago next to Best Buy. They practically share the same parking lot. Very friendly atmosphere and they will encourage home demos too. This past week I took home a pair of demo Aerial 5T's. They are not going back. Perfect for my room.

 

I stopped in at a local dealer just a few weeks ago as I wanted to see their new location. The guy who showed me around seemed nice enough, but not all that well informed about audio. Maybe he wasn't sure of my intentions and level of knowledge. The place was a mess with stuff stacked everywhere. They do a lot of AudioGon and ebay sales.

Although it's been a while, the other two shops I've visited have been friendly and helpful. One shop let me take a demo pair of Magnepans home for a week long listen. They weren't working for me and I felt guilty returning them. That may be a very good sales tactic.

 

How is that so many run into bad dealerships? Almost all of the places I've been into have been friendly and pleasant. Of course, unless I were serious about making a purchase, I don't make any demands on the staff. If I am there to just browse, I say so, and only "audition" a specific piece of gear when a sales person offers to play gear of my choice.

I have been in enough places and observed enough interactions to concluded that the majority of awkward or unpleasant interactions are such because the customer has instigated trouble. I have seen people interrupt auditions that are already in progress, or make unreasonable demands or get angry when they cannot bargain down the price to what they want, get angry when they come into a dealership and find that the particular model they want to hear is not on the floor (hint, authorized dealerships of particular brands most often don't have the means to carry every model, call first before coming in) and behave defensively when any sort of inquiry is made about the customers existing system or musical taste, etc.

I don't see why visiting an audio dealership is any different from other interactions--one has to behave properly if one expects the same in return.

 

If you feel that you are being ignored because of your dress, there is a guaranteed way to get their attention.

Look for one of their more expensive products. Turntables are great. Go to the unit, and touch it. Take the tonearm off the rest (cue lever up), or play with the counterweight. If there are no turntables, try to look behind an expensive amp or speakers, with the excuse to look at the interconnects or similar. You will have their immediate and undivided attention.

I would like to have a line when they rush up and tell me not to touch like "I feel I've been ignored since I came into the store. I thought this may get me some service, and I have high-end equipment so you don't have to worry about me damaging your stock. I came looking for .... with a $.... budget, but you don't seem interested. I thought you might want to know before I walk out.". Would I use it - probably not, I would be more likely to just walk out.

 

In the almost 40 years I've been in this hobby and buying equipment from local dealers, I must have dealt directly with over 20 shops. (I actually tried to remember them all and count them before I wrote this post). They were located in areas where I either lived for a period of time or had relatives living (Philadelphia region, Houston TX, Central PA, upstate NY and Toronto Canada). In all that time and at all of those dealers, I never once had what I would consider a bad experience nor any horror stories like I read about on forums like this. As a matter of fact, I have even become good friends with many people I have bought equipment from.

I'd say the worst experiences I have had happened only at big box retailers and even then it was mostly just that the people selling knew virtually nothing about their products.

From my observations during many years of hanging out in these shops, the attitude customer comes in with goes a long way to determining the experience they have.

That doesn't mean you have to take any condescending crap if that's what you receive, but I've always gone in with a non confrontational demeanor and have never experienced anything unpleasant in return. I do know how I'd react if I was a salesperson and a customer told me that "I could buy this place 10 times over buddy!". It wouldn't be favorable....

 

It sounds like a lot of people go into a place expecting a fight. If you go in and start a fight, don't whine when you come out the loser.

 

This. I operate with the assumption, in all interpersonal encounters, that I should enact the attitude and behavior that I want to see in others. Everything else to me seems secondary, and the worst that can happen at a business, regardless of whether it's high-end or low-end, is I'll bid them farewell and good day.

 

I can recall my first visit to a high-end store as an adult (19) with an intent to purchase. I was stationed in Wichita Falls, TX in 1974 and we drove down to Dallas to replace my Lloyds stereo. The salesman treated me with respect throughout. We bought a Dual 1215, Pioneer SX525, and a pair of small Altec Capri speakers. Loved that stereo.