CD bronzing on the topside only?

Discussion in 'Music Corner' started by Rael, Oct 21, 2017.

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  1. Rael

    Rael Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Location:
    Poland
    Hello

    I recived used Peter Hammill's cd that looks like this



    [​IMG]

    (it is not my cd picture but one taken from Discogs so i guess finding cd without bronzing can be hard if not impossible)

    The bronzing is on the top side only on the edges. Bottom side is clear silver. My question is - did some CDs bronze only n the top side so they still were playable? The cd is almost 20 years old so can i assume that the bronzing will not progress on the bottom side and the cd should be fine?
     
  2. lv70smusic

    lv70smusic Senior Member

    Location:
    San Francisco, CA
    If you are wondering whether this bronzing has already affected the playback and/or data retrieval from this disc because you are thinking about buying it, I would ask the seller in advance whether he has confirmed that the disc still plays and rips without error. In my experience, the bottom side of the discs that bronzed looked fine but there were still errors on playback.
     
  3. Rodney Toady

    Rodney Toady Waste of cyberspace

    Location:
    Finland
    I gather bronzing is only visible on the top side.

    Back in the 90's I had my bronzed SBZ-CD 007 replaced by PDO. I would assume there are other replacement copies out there, too, so it may well be possible to find one that's not bronzed.
     
    Front 242 Addict likes this.
  4. eelkiller

    eelkiller One of the great unwashed

    Location:
    Northern Ontario
    Yeah, Every PDO UK disc I had issues with bronzed on the top only. All but one are still playing fine after all these years but I made back up copies just in case.
     
  5. Rodney Toady

    Rodney Toady Waste of cyberspace

    Location:
    Finland
    Most of mine that showed signs of bronzing eventually developed playback problems.
     
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  6. no.nine

    no.nine (not his real name)

    Location:
    NYC
    As the others have said, a non-bronzed playing side means nothing, because the playing side NEVER bronzes.

    If you've just received this CD, I'd suggest returning it for a refund, as it's defective. I'd also look for another copy pressed by a different manufacturer, if other such pressings exist.

    At the very least, back this copy up if it's not too late. Look for errors and audio interference on the last track, as that's where these problems will first manifest themselves.
     
  7. David G.

    David G. Forum Resident

    Location:
    Austin, TX
    I have that very CD, and I just pulled it off the shelf to look at it, since I haven't played it for years. Mine, too, has turned a very faint shade of bronze on the top side, but it's not nearly as bad as the one pictured. It's a very uniform bronze on the top, not darker toward the edges -- you'd hardly even know it had turned bronze unless you flipped it over and saw that the bottom side was definitely more silver in color than the top side.

    I ripped it into iTunes probably 12-13 years ago, so I have my backup copy there in the event that it no longer plays...
     
  8. Rael

    Rael Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Location:
    Poland
    The seller claimed that it never gave him any problems while playing. I will give it a test. Luckily i found EAC rip anyaway
     
  9. no.nine

    no.nine (not his real name)

    Location:
    NYC
    The seller might be telling the truth, as sometimes it can take a long time for problems to begin. Or maybe the last time he played it was several years ago and it was still OK!! Of course, he could also be lying. You just never know.

    I don't play around with these bronzed CDs. Apparently, some never have playback problems, but many do, so why rely on luck?

    In your case, you're OK now, since you have an EAC rip. But my recommendation is to be wary with bronzed CDs, or for that matter, any U.K. PDO CD. Later ones exist which are not susceptible to bronzing, but you need to know how to identify them to be safe.
     
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  10. Rael

    Rael Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Location:
    Poland
    If it plays well i keep otherwise i will return it. I think even if it plays i will look for a non bronzed copy to replace it eventually. BTW - for what kind of errors should i look while doing the playtest? Skipping, track stoping, not loading track?
     
  11. Rodney Toady

    Rodney Toady Waste of cyberspace

    Location:
    Finland
    In the early stages it may be just singular clicks and pops towards the end of the disc, but as the bronzing progresses, the sonic anomalies become more and more frequent and manifest themselves earlier and earlier in the disc; in the end the music sounds as if completely drowned in static, and eventually the disc doesn't play back at all.
     
  12. ShallowMemory

    ShallowMemory Classical Princess

    Location:
    GB
    Tell me having lost copies to it some of which are hard to find pressed elsewhere. If you order a used disc and comes back like that I'd regard it as defective as 99-1 it will fail.
     
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  13. Holy Diver

    Holy Diver Senior Member

    Location:
    USA
    I hope that's just bad camera lighting. :)
     
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  14. Rael

    Rael Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Location:
    Poland
    sadly not :p
     
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  15. Holy Diver

    Holy Diver Senior Member

    Location:
    USA
    :(
     
  16. Guy E

    Guy E Senior Member

    Location:
    Antalya, Turkey
    The handful of bronzed CD's that I have developed their patina a long time ago, and they still play fine.
     
  17. Rael

    Rael Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Location:
    Poland
    I read such opinions but never found out while some bronzed cds casue playback problem and some not. My logic was: if the patina is on the topside the polycarbonate with the data is untouched and as the reflective layer is still silver it should reflect the laser normally, right?
     
  18. Natvecal.

    Natvecal. JUST A LOW- FI GUY WHO LOVES A GREAT MASTERING

    Location:
    Oceanside,CA.
    yeah this seemed to be ground zero for the "can CDs degrade overtime " Thread (not sure if I got title exact?) Bad formula or such for those CDs and bronzing was (it seemed) widely noted if I got this right?
     
    c-eling likes this.
  19. no.nine

    no.nine (not his real name)

    Location:
    NYC
    There are so many threads that focus on or touch upon this issue that I'm not sure which specific thread you might be thinking of. But yes, the UK PDOs are the most common face of what people think of when they think "CD Rot".

    To be fair, I also want to remind people that their faulty manufacturing process which caused this problem was only in use from about '88 through '92. Also usually lost in the shuffle is that an Italian manufacturer - OPTI.ME.S. - used the same manufacturing process during the same time period, so there are also bronze-prone CDs from them. But naturally, they have a lower profile, with most of their output likely being only for the Italian market.


    The reason for this is that the data is actually closer to the label side than the playing side. For this same reason, a scratch to the label is more likely to cause damage than one on the playing surface.
     
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  20. Dave S

    Dave S Forum Resident

    I think the problem is that it no longer reflects the laser's light, but I could be wrong about this statement.
     
  21. Rael

    Rael Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Location:
    Poland
    I just found another copy listed with different matrix number. It has the "Master by Mayking" one (similar to well known nimbus ones) Am I right that it was made in another presing plant and should be resistant to bronzing?
     
  22. Dave S

    Dave S Forum Resident

    Yes, Mayking releases don't suffer from bronzing. They also don't have sticky top surfaces suffered by early Nimbus releases.
     
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  23. Rael

    Rael Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Location:
    Poland
    I heard about those sticky ones but never stumbled on one. But out of curiosity. the "sticky label" did not affect playback, right?
     
  24. nosliw

    nosliw Delivering parcels throughout Teyvat! Meow~!

    Location:
    Ottawa, ON, Canada
    My CD copy of Hardcore Holocaust II, a Strange Fruit release consisting of John Peel recording sessions of metal/hardcore punk bands, has bronzing on top and it was also manufactured by PDO. I ripped the CD directly to my PC without any problems but I should try playing it back on my CD player if there is any problems.
     
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  25. c-eling

    c-eling They're made of light,We never would have guessed

    No. Just don't wash it or use liquids. You can tell as they have a rubber like feeling to them.
     
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