Fifty year old phono cartridges

Discussion in 'Audio Hardware' started by 62vauxhall, Oct 3, 2017.

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  1. stereoguy

    stereoguy Its Gotta Be True Stereo!

    Location:
    NYC
    Thats a good question. Actually, I was thinking , do you know how to test the cart with a multimeter? I have one at work.

    If I test resistance across the left channel and Left ground, what should i see?
     
  2. PhxJohn

    PhxJohn Forum Resident

    Location:
    Phoenix, AZ
    I think you should get it verified that it is the cartridge and attempt to get your money back. I have read that Ebay always favors the buyer. Worth a shot. You bought a stereo cartridge and that is what you should have received. You bought it to enjoy it not to be disappointed with it.
     
  3. PhxJohn

    PhxJohn Forum Resident

    Location:
    Phoenix, AZ
    Honestly I do not know. Hopefully someone else can help here.
     
  4. stereoguy

    stereoguy Its Gotta Be True Stereo!

    Location:
    NYC

    Well, Ive had it for too long now, i think. Not really fair to the seller, he likely is not an expert on stereophonic sound. He may have tested it in a turntable and he got clear sound.
     
  5. PhxJohn

    PhxJohn Forum Resident

    Location:
    Phoenix, AZ
    Up to you of course. I just think it stinks.
     
  6. stereoguy

    stereoguy Its Gotta Be True Stereo!

    Location:
    NYC

    Well, You know what.....when I think of people I know who have real problems...this is really nothing.
     
  7. PhxJohn

    PhxJohn Forum Resident

    Location:
    Phoenix, AZ
    It was money out the window when i bought that EV 2750D stylus for $142.50. I will buy a fresher EVG or Pfans aftermarket rather than being silly enough to expect a 50 year old stylus to have a good suspension. The suspensions, like me, are dried up.
     
  8. stereoguy

    stereoguy Its Gotta Be True Stereo!

    Location:
    NYC

    LOL!!!!! I'm right there with ya John............getting old stinks.
     
  9. PhxJohn

    PhxJohn Forum Resident

    Location:
    Phoenix, AZ
    We'll build a time machine and go back to 1967 and go to a stereo store and you can buy a new one for $10. Yeah, that's what we'll do.
     
  10. Needmore Wax

    Needmore Wax Well-Known Member

    Location:
    Indy
    Hi everyone.. I wanted to relay this experiment of mine with reviving old suspensions of Shure cartridge styli, ones that were found to be marginally responsive when I obtained them. One was a Shure VN45HE that was limp - I coaxed it back to life with a very tiny drop of a rubber renewer for electronics (that has the orange solvent ingredient). Worked into the shank and with gentle massage of the cantilever that was bent upwards, I restored a vintage V-15Type IV to proper working condition -- with a diamond still perfect intact. It came out real nice. Along with the cart, I sold it to a happy fellow-enthusiast. I also managed to restore a VN35E with the V-15 Type III I scored from Japan (on a steal low bid auction). It also had a worn rubber suspension, but the cantilever was still straight and the diamond still perfect. (It was one of those cool white nude diamonds Shure had used.) Aside from a good cleaning, I instilled a tiny drop of TCE I have left (which is LAST 2 Preservative). Working that into the rubber for an evening I finally freed it up and it was then as supple as a NOS example I have. That was also sold as a complete V15-3 set after several days of listening tests. After these restorations, the rare styli were saved. My point being: don't give up hope, try to coax the suspension back to life, you have nothing to lose. I enjoy fixing these wonderful electromechanical marvels, I hope to have passed some good advice along by sharing this. Thanks for reading.
     
    PhxJohn likes this.
  11. stereoguy

    stereoguy Its Gotta Be True Stereo!

    Location:
    NYC
    ok...Final Update:

    Just to be 100% sure, I installed the VR-1000 in my Rega P1.

    In the Rega headshell, I attached things as follows:

    White wire to the Left channel of the VR-1000
    Blue Wire to the Left Ground of the VR-1000
    Red wire to the Right channel of the VR-1000
    Green wire to the Right ground of the VR-1000

    While I get sound from both channels, one channel is loud and vibrant, but the other is half the volume (or less) and is muffled.

    So, my conclusion is, the cart is bad.

    Back to the Shure M91Ed in both tables!
     
  12. PhxJohn

    PhxJohn Forum Resident

    Location:
    Phoenix, AZ
    Try one last thing....a fresh stylus. I had one that I was testing and the left channel kept going out. The cantilever was skewed too far. It is normal for the cantilevers to be skewed a bit, but too far and the one channel will die. One last hope.
     
  13. stereoguy

    stereoguy Its Gotta Be True Stereo!

    Location:
    NYC
    John, this is the second stylus. The original did the same thing, now I'm using the NOS Walco.
    But maybe I will try that.
     
  14. PhxJohn

    PhxJohn Forum Resident

    Location:
    Phoenix, AZ
    Try an EVG.
     
  15. PhxJohn

    PhxJohn Forum Resident

    Location:
    Phoenix, AZ
    VTF 3 grams please.
     
  16. PhxJohn

    PhxJohn Forum Resident

    Location:
    Phoenix, AZ
    On my 3 Rega tonearms, the antiskate was too strong when set to match the VTF. Try 0-50%. If the stylus is pulled away from a pole piece, it will not work well. These are shots in the dark. I want the VR 1000 to work properly for you.
     
  17. stereoguy

    stereoguy Its Gotta Be True Stereo!

    Location:
    NYC
    Ok...Not So Final Update:

    Remember when I said "My Conclusion...the Cart is bad"?
    Not so Fast, Winston!

    I tried Johns suggestion, and replaced the WALCO stylus with the first EVG I bought.

    1) The Good News: NOW I hear the correct stereo separation...so the cart isnt bad after all!!!!!! Yea for me!! Turns out the Walco was defective
    (thats $13 down the drain)
    2) The Bad News: With the first EVG, the sound has too much distortion. Also, the shank is very flat and perpendicular to the plastic, so its VERY close to the record. I fear the record will bump up against it. Trouble is, the other 3 I bought look just like it. I wont know if there is distortion on those unless I open the up and try them.
    John......would it be ok to slip a thin piece of metal underneath and try to bend it forward.....or is that a Bozo No No?

    So, then I took the original stylus, cleaned the tip with a magic eraser and gave that a try......BINGO.....no distortion, correct stereo seperation. But its an old stylus and I wouldnt use it on any "good" records. Good to eval with tho.

    I used an old copy of "The Turtles" Golden Hits as an eval because the songs have that Wide 60s Stereo Seperation.
    One thing I can hear right away....the VR-1000 really excels in detail retrieving.....I hear things in the mix of "Happy Together" that I never heard before, and I've heard that freaking song 1000 times.

    So I guess.....I have to try each EVG until I find one that has no distortion?
     
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  18. PhxJohn

    PhxJohn Forum Resident

    Location:
    Phoenix, AZ
    Mike, Congrats !!!! You are getting there !!!! Don't bend a stylus. I did that as a kid and it engraved a whistling sound into the record. LOL. I will PM you now.
     
  19. PhxJohn

    PhxJohn Forum Resident

    Location:
    Phoenix, AZ
    The cantilever will not bump the record. Looking at the cantilevers(shanks) on the GE VR stereo cartridges it looks like the tip will be the last thing to touch the record but it works fine. We are all just used to 15 and 20 degree angled long cantilevers.
     
  20. stereoguy

    stereoguy Its Gotta Be True Stereo!

    Location:
    NYC
    Ok, cool. But the distortion on the first EVG right out of the box worries me.
     
  21. PhxJohn

    PhxJohn Forum Resident

    Location:
    Phoenix, AZ
    Me too. (Because I may have a box of duds). Probably a hardened suspension. I experienced that with one of the 0.5 mils. It was the only one of 4 0.5 mils that would track at all but it was very distorted. The other three....the suspensions were so hard, they just skated.
     
  22. JohnO

    JohnO Senior Member

    Location:
    Washington, DC
    Does this help?
    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
     
  23. stereoguy

    stereoguy Its Gotta Be True Stereo!

    Location:
    NYC
    Johno: That is FABULOUS, thanks for posting that.
     
    PhxJohn likes this.
  24. stereoguy

    stereoguy Its Gotta Be True Stereo!

    Location:
    NYC
    LOL...Next update:

    I installed EVG stylus #2. NG. There is still distortion, not as much as with EVG #1, but still enough to ruin the listening experience.

    I played the wide stereo version of "You Baby" by The Turtles and the distortion was there. Just to be sure, I put back the original one that came with the cart and played the track again...no distortion and a good, clean playback.
    So....0 for 2. I've got a bad feeling about the other 2 as well.
     
  25. PhxJohn

    PhxJohn Forum Resident

    Location:
    Phoenix, AZ
    You're not making my day. LOL. What VTF are you using ?
     
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