Switching from SS to tube (integrated amp). Will rest of gear thrive or?

Hi-
Newbie to posting in this forum, but have learned so much from reading these boards for years- so thank you all.
I wanted to get some input on a (major to me) setup change-- I just purchased a late 50's/early 60's HH Scott 299a tube integrated amp. To date I've only used solid state.
My question is, will the Scott just nudge it's way into the mix in place of my SS amp and bring some lovely tube warmth? Or will it reveal mismatches in the line, not be as "loud"/ be able to push the speakers well enough? etc etc etc (insert other less than ideal outcomes here...)

Here is my current set up. Idea is to just swamp the amps:
Source: Rega RP6 with Dynavector 20x2 LOW MC cartridge
Integrated amp: Ayre AX-7e (to be swapped out for the Scott 299)
Sutherland Ph3d phonostage (would be rendered useless as Scott has built in PS)
Vienna Acoustic Mozart 2.5 way floor standing- 4ohms

Ayre specs:
Power Output:
60 watts per channel continuous into 8 ohms
120 watts per channel continuous into 4 ohms

Scott 299a specs:
I believe the 299 has an RMS output of 35 watts? 17w per?

So... Will this all play nicely together? Any obvious mismatches in your experiences? Recommendations? Adjustments? Warnings? All is welcome! Thank you in advance...

JD

 

I do not know how 'power hungry' Mozart 2.5s are, but have a sensitivity of 90dB. 17 watts per channel should play reasonably loud enough in an average size listening room. The Scott amplifier must use the 4 ohm outputs on your speakers.

 

Hi,
This not a direct answer to your main question, but a point about your cart and phono stage. I believe you will still need to use the Sutherland as the Scott will most likely not be able to handle a low output mc.

 

I also should mention that the Scott amplifier should be rebuilt as capacitors can fail due to age. You cannot replace the audio coupling caps with just any brand. To get the best sound use Russian K40y-9 capacitors. These are paper in oil type and it is well documented paper in oil produce by far the best sonics compared to other types of capacitors. Then, try different tubes for best sound. If you perform this I assure you the Scott will outperform your SS amp if it does produce enough power output.

 

With regards to LOMC cart, you may also need an SUT to provide enough input gain to the amp. I had to do this with my setup, albeit I don't have same tube preamp.

 

I have my doubts about the speaker amp combo. Sure, the Scott will be able to drive the Mozarts to decent volume, but will there be sufficient control? Probably depends mostly on the impedance curve of the Mozarts. Have you checked this?

Sounds like a bit of a gamble to me.

 

Well it is certainly going to sound different. You might find that you enjoy the midrange region, you might find the warmth and immediacy something you appreciate. However, I suspect the speaker and amp are not going to be an ideal match, as that power output level is not conducive to large dynamic swings with a conventional modern speaker. I know it says 90 dB efficiency, but sometimes those numbers can be a tad optimistic. But hey, nothing ventured, nothing gained. So start down this path, but don't be surprised if this is only a stepping stone.

Also agree that you wont know what this Scott integrated is capable of if it has not been serviced and refreshed.

Regards
Mister Pig

 

Don't ditch the Sutherland, it will be MUCH better than the built in phono stage on the Scott

 

You face two challenges. First, you have a vintage piece so if it hasn't had work done on it, it almost certainly will need work done on it so that it's operating up to spec. Second, tube amps and solid state amps have a very different ability to deliver current into speakers. Tube amps like relatively flat impedance curves, phase angles and relatively higher impedances. You have speakers that dip below 4 ohms through part of the midrange and upper bass while the phase angle turns pretty significantly capacitive I think. That's probably going to demand more current than your 17 wpc at 8 ohms (and something almost certainly less at 4 ohms, even off the 4 ohm taps) is going to be able to deliver. (On top of that Stereophile measure the speakers at around 83 dB efficiency, nothing close to the spec of 90).

Tube amps and speakers require greater care and different considerations when mating with speakers than solid state amps. And the simple fact is that today most speakers are designed without any kind of concern for what would work best with tube amps, especially low powered tube amps.

 

Hmmm, can't really directly compare since the Scott stage won't handle his LOMC cartridge without some help, but if properly restored and preceded by a good SUT, a nice tube-based stage with low feedback and mostly passive EQ between two 12AX7 tubes such as in his Scott 299 will sound very good, and many might like it better than a modern high feedback OPA134 opamp-based preamp such as the Sutherland. But one thing is for sure, they will sound a bit different, and both will likely have their fans


In general though, I'm sure your right, the Sutherland would trounce most integrated amplifier built-in phono stages. And this one may need some TLC (and expertise) to get thee best from it too. But it does look to have lot of potential.

 

Perhaps it could be interesting to keep your main system unchanged, and add the Scott and a pair of efficient/sensitive (vintage) speakers. You could do it in such a way that your sources can be easily connected to both amp/speaker systems. That way you can choose a modern system or a vintage system, depending on the music you are going to play. Could be lots of fun!

 

I'm in agreement that the speakers will be a poor match for the Scott.

 

Vienna Acoustics Mozart loudspeaker Measurements

Stereophile measured a lower sensitivity than the specified 90db, but that was largely due to its unusual crossover suckout. Regardless of what amp you end up using, it appears as though you should try bi-wiring them and inverting the tweeter cables.

 

I would contest this. And friend and I did some extensive listening tests with a bunch of different capacitors a few years ago, and we both came to the conclusion that far and away the closest to PIO caps we could find were polystyrene caps. We did this testing before I recapped my MC225 since I really didn't want to screw-up its sound. But I also didn't want to have to do the job again in 20 years if I installed new PIO caps.

 

Interesting. Thanks! I’m sure I’ll have my hands full trying to figure it all out. Appreciate the reply!

 

Yes! This was my initial thought (I mean hey- more gear and choices?!?! Sign me up!!). Curious how you would recommend having my source (Rega TT) connect to both simultaneously without loss of quality). Haven’t ventured down that path. Would love your feedback. Thank you!

 

Grateful for all of these responses. I’m certainly up for the task of trial and error to find what works best. Also- thought I should add (and should’ve included in original post) that the Scott HAS been serviced with new caps, NOS tubes and a full check up. I’m leaning towards the dual set up of vintage/tube and the SS/modern I currently have. I’ll be sure to post updates as they come. You guys rock. Thank you!

 

Which SUT did you go with? I assume there are different types for each setup that would work more appropriately than others, correct?

 

Parks Audio Budgie CM1254

 

So if it's tuned up and operating up to spec, try it with your speakers. It with "work" in the sense that sound will come out and you might even like it, but my guess is that you'll have some frequency response modification, loss of dynamics, and maybe even increases in distortion, particularly if you're listening to music with a lot of high energy musically information in the upper bass and lower midrange, Bach solo violin sonatas and partitas maybe not so much -- compared so something that can deliver a little more of what those speakers are probably going to demand.

 

Really hard to beat the Ayre AX-7, I've moved to a Unico 90 tube amp for the second system but wish I had the little Ayre back, biggest mistake i've made in some time.

 

Just connect your Sutherland via the Scott's tuner input and continue using it. But if you want to go down the SUT rabbit hole, knock yourself out. The Scott has a nice phono stage and is worth exploring.

 

Yeah the Ayre was killer good and cheaper than your Unico.Both sound great by the way

 

Thank you all for the input and advice! I’m going to hook it up and experiment a bit (with and without the Sutherland etc) and go from there. I may just pick up a pair of Klipsch Heresy’s and go with a tube set up and a SS setup side by side, if all else fails. Hoping the Scott arrives soon!!