Yeah, I get what your saying about production.I think it's that Michael Elvis Baskette who produces. He did the Mammoth releases. I enjoy Slash as a player, but I think the song writing with MK could be stronger. To me most of the material is nothing to memorable and really do not revisit. Probably did side tracking this thread, but it would have been interesting to hear MK in the rehearsals with Jason, JPJ and Page. I tried to revisit that one a few months back, it was just kinda ok. Maybe I should try and give it some more time.
Slash's tone and lead tone are spot on for this. Really digging Brian's vocal delivery. You never hear him sing like that . He could be I to something. When I first heard the song, did not know it was BJ on vocals, I thought it kinda sounded like a Tom Jones delivery .
Thanks for posting. Everytime after reading Gorman's book and thinking about the BC/Page release,I always get this cringe/sick feeling in my stomach when he recounts Jimmy approaching Rich about doing something original, and per Steve ,RR kinda shuts it down.
I really don't understand why people are so down on Rich about the Jimmy Page thing. The Black Crowes were/are (generally speaking) his baby in terms of songwriting, why would he want another, more established songwriter around, it would completely undermine him & the band's original material? I'm a huge fan of both The Crowes and Zeppelin but find that whole project a bit odd to be honest, it just seemed like a very weird thing for a band to do & FWIW, I don't think Chris suits the Zeppelin stuff at all. I've heard the LP but never bothered to buy it.
I think you're in the minority there, regarding Chris and his compatibility with Zeppelin material. I thought it worked extremely well, and that feeling seems to be shared by many! As for why people are down on Rich for the Jimmy Page thing...I mean...you just don't turn down an offer like that. His disinterest in it, quite frankly, seems insane to me.
I've explained why I think he would have rejected it. I think him/them agreeing to do it in the first place was the strange thing to do, not the eventual rejection. They basically became a glorified Zeppelin tribute band for a period of time. It just seems bizarre to me when they were so good themselves. The Chris singing Robert Plant stuff is completely subjective though, I'm ok with being in the minority there.
I don't think they needed to have Page do an entire album with them - but Rich should've at least had him help produce a song or two, and/or play co-guitar on a song - wouldn't really need more input from him than that, and they could still say they had Page on the album. Just kinda dumb to not at least have him help with the bare minimum.
Cinderella definitely looked the part. Never dug his voice. The only band (besides Guns) I listen to still from that era is Tesla.
It wasn't like Page was asking them to do a whole album, just work together on a song idea or two. I don't see any harm in that, if you don't like the song or two you do or don't feel it fits your album then throw it on a b-side or release an EP. The hard part is I think touring with Page helped the Black Crowes a lot after By Your Side didn't take off like they wanted. I think that collaboration reminded a lot of people that the Crowes were still around and still a top level band.
Agreed, and I suspect that Rich probably felt a little bit of resentment that it took something like that collaboration to get their band back into the spotlight. There had been a big push with By Your Side -- new label, lots of "return to form" chatter in the press releases...and ultimately the album didn't return them to the top of the charts. I'm sure he didn't want to be seen as a band who used Page as a crutch...but what a feather in their cap it would have been, to be able to plug the next album with "Jimmy Page wrote and played stuff with us on this".
Chris was also none too complimentary about Zeppelin’s music himself subsequently. Can’t remember his exact comments but it was fairly snide (of course, they’re not the first band he’s fired unprovoked shots at), but I mean, it’s odd that he and Rich did the whole thing, and were then so publicly lukewarm about it.
I guess we really don't know for sure what happened there, but it was just Steve's recollection from his book that I am leaning on. Sorry, was not trying to be down, just did not get it. I just thought ,what an opportunity to do something with a legend. Just a one off ,few songs, collaboration, or whatever ,why not? They were almost out the door on that era in a few more years .
Yeah, he was dismissive of Robert's lyrics - "What was Robert singing about?" or something like that - which was a head-scratcher, considering most of the Zep material CR sang was the bluesier/roots stuff.
yes found the quote: The shows were a bit chaotic, and Robinson was vocal about some of his displeasure in 2002. “I didn’t really have that much fun doing it,” Robinson told Classic Rock. “It was alright, and Jimmy’s a phenomenal guitarist, but to me it was just a job. I’m not a big fan of Robert Plant’s lyrics or his singing, so that part of it was a little boring for me.”
I don't fully buy Gorman's version of events re the Jimmy Page/Rich Robinson thing. A friend of mine used to co-own a major live music production business from the mid-80's through 00's and he worked with TBC a lot in the 90's. He's been out of that business for over 15 yrs now but he knows people directly involved with that Crowes/Page tour. According to them there were two main issues that led to cutting the tour short: (1) Page's manager approached TBC's manager, Pete Angelus, mid-tour and started demanding Jimmy get a higher percentage of the tour's gross, and (2) the Robinson brothers were getting increasingly agitated that Page wasn't interested in playing guitar on Crowes songs - only Zeppelin songs. Apparently, all too often, Page wasn't actually even playing guitar on the Crowes songs but rather was sorta faking it through. The Robinson brothers started feeling they were being used simply to promote Jimmy/Zeppelin. This is what he was told by those involved in the tour production. Just passing this on. Regardless, Page has been friendly with Rich and Chris for years now - which contradicts the picture Gorman paints in his book about Page's feelings on Rich & Chris. Page has visited Rich backstage after shows, and is seen smiling, very friendly taking photos with him. All of that is documented and a bunch of photos came to light after Gorman's book came out. To my knowledge Gorman has never addressed that. The other thing is this: I find it hard to believe that Page got furious and left the tour simply because Chris & Rich weren't interested in writing songs with him. Now I could certainly see Page asking them if they were interested in co-writing an album's worth of songs. But how could Page get so bent-out-of-shape by them declining the offer??? They were supposed to just agree to this??? They had agreed to tour with Jimmy - not write an album of new songs with him. That's a whole 'nother thing. They obviously had their own songwriting thing going and their own album deal.
Reading some of these latest posts, I guess they put their distain of Zep aside. Or maybe they learned and played it knowing what a big fan Howard is, as Chris says, "this one's for you",
Now that makes sense. I thought at the very moment it happened that the cancellation was not truly due to a back injury. I was actually a little surprised to read in Gorman’s book that the injury was legit. And I totally understand Page asking for more money - he was the reason most of the fans filling up those amphitheaters were there - but it’s also not cool to make a demand like that in the middle of the tour. And I also understand the Crowes getting irritated at being just Jimmy Page’s backing band. I don’t think Gorman made up the whole story, I’m sure it’s based upon fact, but likely the significance was exaggerated. Maybe intentionally to sell books, or maybe because that really was his honest interpretation of what Jimmy told him. As far as Page’s offer to Rich, Rich could have always co- written a couple of songs with him, and then not included them on the next Crowes album (which would have been released after the tour was over and he wouldn’t have to see Jimmy) with the excuse that they didn’t fit creatively, or included them as bonus tracks on the Greek album. And there’s really no reason to not have Jimmy Page play a solo or two on a BC studio album - especially when the then-current BC lead guitarist was largely being treated as a second-class citizen.
Then why did you do it if you didn’t respect it? I would have asked him this question if he really said it. Incredibly talented man but a bit of an ****.
This all sounds plausible and reasonable, but this story is missing the catalyst for the tour to be cancelled. Surely the Crowes didn't kick Jimmy out and end the tour because he wasn't giving his all to their tunes. Agree, Jimmy speaks very highly of The Black Crowes lately.
The Crowes didn't end the tour, Jimmy did. He had a bad back at the time, but I'm guessing everything else outside of his back adding up and any tension that was there over wanting to work together once the tour was over was enough for the back to be hurting just enough to call it off.
You don’t think they knew there was a chance they would be perceived as Jimmy’s back up band? He had top billing and he’s the guy from Led Zeppelin. They used him as much as anyone thinks he used them.
Chris sings flat throughout the album, that’s for sure. But, apparently, it’s nobody’s fault but Plant’s that Chris got himself into that situation. They should’ve dropped Chris for that collaboration and found someone who could do the songs justice because the band was hot.
