That article is completely off base when it says that the masterfonics versions sound better than the original pressings. Not even close.
Indeed, it does appear it was released on 8-track tape, and so too the previous album, under the catalog name IA8S-5 (the previous album being under IA8S-1). Real shame this wasn't released on reel-to-reel, however... So, does anyone really know what kind of multitracks Easter Everywhere (or the previous album) was actually recorded on? The recording engineer listed for Easter Everywhere is "Frank Davis", and for Psychedelic Sounds it's "Bob Sullivan". Anyone know if anyone from Summit Sound's still around, with knowledge of the recording equipment used back then?
As an addendum to the previous post: Just for fun, I've done some digging up of the "Easter Everywhere 8-track" dealio, and I've uncovered some interesting photos. Here's a screen-shot I've come across, of one of the 8-track tapes for sale on eBay, the date it's ending being on April 12, 2013: A picture of the actual 8-track itself from the auction: And straight from the Texas Psychedelic Blog, from 2007, comes pictures of the supposed "8-track master" itself: http://www.texaspsychedelicrock.com/2007/05/roky-robbers-roost-comes-up-short.html As far as I know, these are the only photos of the supposed "8-track master" of EE lying around. If anyone's got more info on the 8-track master (or any other copy tapes lying around), or has pics of the 8-track's BOX, please feel free to share it here.
One more thing... for the previous album, I've found a low-res picture of the 8-track for that, catalog IA8S-1 as said above. Though I wish there existed a bigger picture, it's decent, and all we've got for now (oh how I wish IA had released these two albums on open reel!):
"Epitaph For A Legend" Has been released twice on ceedee; by "Collectibles [1993] & International [the aforementioned 20-10]. Either one better than the other? BIG thanks. me worstest 'Vators' releases are: Comp "The Best Of... Manicure Your Mind" M.I.L. Multimedia – ESP3034 1998 & box set "The Psychedelic World Of The 13th Floor Elevators" Charly Records – SNAJ 709 CD 2002. [not saying they are the worst/just the worst i've come across/or bad enough too remember anyway/i do like the "Live In San Francisco, 1966" disc tho from the box/considering... ] Super glad i didn't invest/spend $$$ on "Sign Of The 3 Eyed Men"... cept maybe only too re-sell it!
It was also released on the Sunspots label as well. Can't say which is the best, though, as I haven't had the opportunity to compare them all.
Bumping with some more information on the "8-track" story I've found, courtesy of some of our fellow forum members here: Anyone who reads this, please feel free to add more to the recording info if you know anything about the sessions and equipment used..
I seem to recall a pic of the guy who has them, sitting outside on the ground and holding the EE tapes up. I don't have the pic or know where to find it, though.
I remember this picture as well, but it's been awhile since I've seen it myself. Edit - Here it is (down near the bottom of the page): http://psychedelicbaby.blogspot.com/2012/12/mike-jensen-shares-his-memories-of-roky.html Note - The story about the tape being found in a garage sale is apparently bogus, as it was later stated that the tapes supposedly came directly from Walt Andrus himself (but then again, who really knows just what to believe (or not to believe) anymore about any of this mess).
Thanks for the link, JFS3. Here's the photo if anyone's curious: ("Easter Everywhere and Mike": With the Easter Everywhere reels, Washington State, photo by Olivia Jensen) There's a lot of interesting info in that interview, more importantly containing information about the types of recording equipment used: We talked about “Psychedelic Sounds” and he said he didn’t like those recording sessions. He said it was rushed at a 4 track studio in Dallas and only 3 of the tracks were working and a microphone kept cutting out. He said it took about 9 hours to record. He said they kept telling him every song was “just a practice” and that all the recordings were supposed to be “practice runs. OK, play another... OK play another" Roky told me he thought all the takes were just practice, not final takes. The band was deceived by their label. I have some unreleased tracks from those sessions and sure enough there are microphones shorting out left and right. Is anyone aware that you have these outtakes from “Psychedelic Sounds?” Well I not only have outtakes but I have an International Artist reference tape. This is a copy direct from the 4 track sub master reel, unmixed with all of the flubs and chatter. The condition is poor, as the technology at the time was bad. But, it is not beyond saving and it is fascinating to listen to the Elevators working up the songs that became Psychedelic Sounds. Bits of this tape were lifted and spliced together in the "Box Set" release. But, the parts they lifted are several generations from my first gen tape and, it shows. Have you or anyone listened to those tapes to know exactly what’s on them? This is complex, as I have more tapes in my possession than the Psych Sounds Reference tape. Over the years, people have asked me to drop by or, give accounts of my time with Roky. It is not a subject I have always been forthcoming about; I am a private person. When people have pressured me for interviews or to talk about my time with Roky I've always said no, you don’t cash in on knowing someone but, I think we’ve seen a lot of that in the Elevator’s world the past few years. In 2003 I was working in Tucson. An old friend was very insistent on me coming over to meet some people about "Roky". I put it off but finally one night I went over to my friends house. I was greeted by a group of people with something to show me. Sitting in front of me was a crate of tapes and an ancient Ampex 8 track reel to reel tape machine. These people said that they had gone to a yard sale in New Mexico and bought the tapes and machine for about $75. I asked them if they had listened to them and they said yes, on one of the tapes they heard Roky talk for a moment and then one of the songs from “Easter Everywhere.” When they heard that, they rewound the tape and discovered that they had destroyed the part they had listened to. They said they no longer wanted to be in possession of the tapes, so I got the tapes and they kept the 8 track machine. I took photos of the machine and although I can’t be absolutely sure, the machine was exactly like the one that was used at Andrus Studios where The Elevators recorded. There are photos from Andrus Studios on line. This machine matched, right down to the track selector box made out of wood! Over the years I have tried to get the tapes legitimately released. At one point a few years ago I got in touch with Roky’s management and offered to drop by a show in Portland, Oregon and hand them over to Roky, but they told me “no thanks.” I have no idea what their reasons were. I’ve tried selling them, giving them away, but nothing has been done. My idea was that the management people take the tapes and pay to dump them, then they get their copy and I get mine. I get to do what I want with my copy which is to put them out for free so people can hear them. The Management company can mix them and do whatever they want with their copy. They turned me down flat. During the sessions to transfer the Andrus tapes for the box set they invited me to the studio to donate my “Easter Everywhere” tapes. One of the main participants offered to pay my air fare! He said he was listening to "Never Another takes 1 through 10! Get Here!" Since I had to work, I said I would mail them the IA cassettes and they could dump them and mail them back to me. But I said I wouldn’t mail them “Easter Everywhere” because I wouldn’t let the reels out of my sight. The offer of the cassettes was refused. The reels are in limbo, in my storage unit where they will remain. Are they stored somewhere climate controlled? Yes they are. They are stored in Washington state. You know the tapes are from “Easter Everywhere.” Do you know what’s on the tapes? No, I only heard the snippets that the guy dumped. Those tapes absolutely cannot be put on a machine. They are much too fragile. One of the reels is only about one fourth full, I suspect it is something that was being mixed. The other reel is full and has a relatively long leader on it. The tapes were in bad shape when I got them. The first thirty seconds of the full reel is completely destroyed because they tried to play the tape. The rest of the tape is there. I actually have not laid eyes upon them for three years. What are all of the recordings of Roky that are in your possession as of now, just to give readers an idea of the treasure trove that you are in possession of? I’ve got those two reels from “Easter Everywhere,” I have an IA cassette that was sent home with the band from “Psychedelic Sounds.” It’s the outtakes, the chatter, the breakdowns, a lot of outtakes, in fact there’s a snippet of a song on there that I don’t even recognize. I have a cassette from IA of a radio show that has been out there for quite some time. I have The Elevators demo that they recorded for Gordon Bynum and that’s been out in bits and pieces over the years too. I have the outtakes from the recording sessions in 1984 from Roky’s EP. Somewhere, I have more alternate mixes from Easter, including a copy of Levitation missing some of Roky's vocals in Mono. Most of the vocals are there but, some are just completely missing. ... One thing I was wondering Mike do you have photographs to document your musical endeavors? Yes, an old girlfriend has most of them and I’ve asked her to share them but she refuses. She also has other 13th Floor Elevators tapes that belong to me that she refuses to share. She absolutely refuses to cooperate. I've tried to no avail. So, from the interview, this is what I've gleamed from it: It's apparently the first 30 seconds of the EE "8-track" that's destroyed The EE "8-track" is no longer in Texas, but located in Washington State "Psychedelic Sounds" was recorded on 4-track, but only 3 tracks were usable (that might explain why some of the original stereo mixes, NOT the Masterphonic botch-ups, sound quite atypical, with the backing track in mono and Roky's voice or the jug isolated on either stereo channel) Not in the interview, but I'm guessing by the time of EE the studio must have acquired a panning console, due to the use of panning on some songs, notably "Levitation" One wonders what else is stored on that guy's reels of tape. Does anyone have any period photos of the recording studio(s) that the 13th Floor Elevators used for their first 2 albums?
I've heard some claim that the Sunspots CD's sound better than their Charly equivalents, but as I haven't compared them myself I personally can't vouch for that. Maybe someone here with some hands on experience can chime in.
BIG thanks too the OP & everyone else here. Just got "Paradise Lost" today... & it's what i wantED the 'Vators' too sound like on ceedee [BIG system has changED tho] for like forever. The 1st cut's source/transfer/mix may not be outstanding... butt it's in mono & a "Sign Of The 3 EyED Men" of better things too come. The 2nd cut "Take 6... YGMM" has just enough echo on the vocal, just enough definition w/the bass w/o being 'boomy', & just enough separation while still being 'garagey' [TM]. The 21st cut "The Spades ~ YGMM" is a "Lavation" comparED too other issues i've heard since picking up a pirate single in the Seventies at a Record Swap Meet in a parking lot in Hayward CA US. [don't care for any of the "live" cuts tho/most likely cause of the sources as opposed too the transfer] i'll defer too other posts here on the SQ of disc two tho. EDitEDbyED: i bought a lot of 'Vators' ceedees a few years ago & now feel pleasED w/this one!
Disc 1 is totally essential and includes some exclusive material/sources. Would've been a dynamite single disc. Disc 2 is just the opposite. Nothing uncommon that can't be found in better quality somewhere else. In fact, part of it is actually the official fake 'Live' album put out by IA. It's tape sourced and possibly the best CD release of the album, but still not too good and the Roky Club needledrop is much better. It's still better than Charly's release in the 4CD Albums Collection set. Surprise, surprise, right? The rest of disc 2 is live on the Sumpin Else TV show and can be found in better quality elsewhere.
Not that I know of, here's what I threw together real quick for sources: tracklist here: http://www.discogs.com/13th-Floor-E...Texas-Rockmusic-Heritage-Vol2/release/2494050 1: Sumpin Else TV performance. Best heard on Psychedelic Microdots CD. 2-3: Unedited alternate mono mixes of the first single. These versions are not found elsewhere that I'm aware of. Charly used needledrops of the single on their 'Headstone' releases. However, their 'Headstone' does feature unedited narrow stereo mixes of these tracks. 4-6, 9-12, 17-18: The "Headstone" sessions. This is the best place to hear these tracks. Charly's 'Headstone' has various tape issues on a number of tracks and overall doesn't sound as good. 7: Unedited version of "Levitation" b-side. From tape. Best source. 8: Unreleased track. It's here in mono, but I'm doubtful it's a unique mono mix and really just a reduction of the common stereo. 13: Alternate stereo mix. This is the only place for this dry stereo mix. The more common stereo version has reverb. 14: Alternate mono single mix from tape source. 15: Alternate mix. This is mono, but it's possibly a reduction of the alternate stereo mix heard on the fake 'Live' album (which is featured in full on disc 2). Both lack the jug. However, this mono version doesn't have the dubbed applause, so it was not sourced from the 'Live' album. It's maybe a different mix altogether. I would need to do further comparing. 16: This is just one channel of the standard stereo mix. Charly actually used it as an alternate stereo mix. It's neither alternate or stereo. 19: Unreleased acetate track. I like it better on Charly's recent CDs and the 'Elevator Tracks' LP. 20-21: The Spades single with Roky. From tape source, rumored to be from the master. Only place to get it from tape source and sounds much better than the vinyl. However, it's missing seconds of the bass intro. 22-25: Sumpin Else TV performance. Best heard on Psychedelic Microdots CD 26-29: Roky solo demos. Professionally recorded acoustic performances. My best guess is early 70s. Exclusive to this CD.
Just gonna bump up this thread just to correct something I saw, regarding the French EP... Uh, as someone who has an OK-ish rip of the French EP, I can certainly tell you that those "few extra seconds" are a total fake-up on the set, and the actual track on the French EP does not have that, matching the 45/LP versions. However, what IS different about it (and the French EP in general) is that the mastering is much better, being more "hi-fi" and having a clarity closer to the stereo LP than the "mid-band AM" dullish sound that plagues the mono LP. Behold, the complete tracklist of the French EP and a quick detailed overview of what's ACTUALLY on it... The Thirteenth Floor Elevators – s/t (France - Mono (45 rpm, 7" EP) - Riviera (Barclay) 231 240 Medium) Released: 1966 (exact date/month unknown) Licence International Artists Side A Reverbaration (Doubt) - regular mono LP/45 mix, no difference You're Gonna Miss Me - regular mono LP/45 mix, does not fade out a couple seconds early like the stereo LP Side B Fire Engine - the 45 edit of mono LP version Tried To Hide - now this is interesting: it's the mono LP version with harmonica, and it's got the best sound I've heard of the mono LP version anywhere I know you said somewhere (did you or was I imagining it?) that unlike the other tracks, Charly actually HAS the tape for this apparently. Well, judging from the excellent sound quality of the French EP, if they DO have the tape, then they might have an absolute gem on their hands... which makes me wonder why they butchered it so badly on the box and decided to fake up the ending and stereo of "Reverbaration" while they were at it. I find the use of the 45 edit of "Fire Engine" unfortunate, but the fact that the mono LP of "Tried to Hide" was used is incredible, and so too the SQ of the track vs. the US mono IA LP, given that there's now potentially another tape source for this track version and the other 3 tracks as well (IF Charly actually has the tape for this EP) and considering the actual mono LP master tape is probably sitting crushed underneath a landfill somewhere.
You might be thinking of what I said about the Epitaph tracks. Those sound like they might actually have the master for those. They claim to have the master tape for the French EP and claim that to be the source for their tracks on these releases. But since those tracks sound nothing like the EP, I don't believe they really have the master tape. Either they are not being truthful, are mistaken or this is another case of re-dubbed tapes with added effects and lowered quality. You are right that the French EP sounds quite good, so if Charly does have the actual master tape, they haven't used it yet. My guess is they don't have it. I will go back and check, but I thought for sure that I'd confirmed the actual EP 'Reverberation' did have a longer ending than the single/LP. Also, my recollection was that Reverberation was like the LP version rather than the single which had a touch of extra reverb added to it. I'll have to re-listen to it. I probably have the same rip you do. I only know of one out there.
Ah yea, I believe I have that same exact rip as you, only been available since October 2013 That's what I thought, regarding Charly having the master tape for the EP. I'll admit the chances of them having it are far greater than for the album masters, since the EP was pressed in France by Barclay (same producers of the notorious, superior Are You Experienced pressing) probably from tapes supplied by IA, and Charly and Barclay are both located in Europe after all. But, given the fakeups for Reverbaration, the chances are probably still low. While listening to their "version" of the EP tracks, though, did you remember hearing any vinyl noise like surface noise or rumble or any of the obvious tells? All I heard was an indistinct NR'd mess but maybe you heard something different. Lack of noises might indicate a tape of some sort. I actually haven't checked the other singles yet to see if they match the same sound quality as found on the EP tracks, therefore making it less of a necessity. But to my knowledge, the EP is the only place outside of the mono LP where you can find the mono LP mix of "Tried to Hide", not the earlier-take mono 45 version that's everywhere outside of the LP.
Does anyone know if the Masterfonics vinyl reissue of Easter Everywhere uses the inferior '76 remix (which was also used on the UK Radar reissue...and all subsequent vinyl and CD reissues?) or the original stereo lp mix? Just an FYI, regarding a mono Easter Everywhere, there are 3 different vinyl pressings I have come across: 1) Mono White label promo (crackly vinyl) 2) Mono Stock copy #1, VERY thick and noisy vinyl but not as crackly like the promo. Some of these Mono pressings were issued with stereo labels and jackets ( I have come across several of these mispresses) 3) Mono Stock copy #2, thin very quiet vinyl, beautiful pressing! Similar in quality to an original stereo pressing. I have only ever seen one copy of this particular pressing. It is by far the rarest in my book. Going by the information in the 3 Eyed Men box set. I'm going to assume Rainbo mastered 1) and 2) and Tanner N' Texas mastered 3).
I tried listening for vinyl noises on Charly's "EP" tracks and at times thought I could maybe hear some, but it also could've just been distortion from being a poor copy. It's possible their tracks come from a tape, but it can't be the real master tape and it's even possible they have a tape sourced from vinyl. Their archives are a mess and it seems like anything they find on tape, they release, no matter how useless or worse than previous copies it is. I'll need to check to make sure I'm correct, but I remember the Reverberation/Fire Engine single being the same mixes as the album, but FE is an edit and both songs have had a little extra reverb added. Not much, it doesn't make them sound echoey, just not as dry as the LP versions. Again from memory, the EP has these without that extra reverb, but FE is the single edit. I'll need to check all this tonight to confirm, though. Yes, I believe that's the only other place to find the mono LP "Tried to Hide".
