A Momentary Lapse of Reason Pink Floyd

Not to argue, but in counterpoint to your statement, let's look at Pigs on the Wing, Pt. 1:

If you didn’t care what happened to me
And I didn’t care for you
We would zig zag our way through the boredom and pain
Occasionally glancing up through the rain
Wondering which of the buggers to blame
And watching for pigs on the wing

The lyrics are very obvious. Insightful is a matter of opinion and to each his own about how a song hits you and to what extent you feel the sentiments carry the weight of strong, meaningful observation. I feel both songs have this element. Just as Dylan's Masters of War could be characterized by the same 'limatations' you cite. As far as 'heavy-handed', well, that's the point in my view. Again, we could go 'round and 'round with this. I just feel that your comment carries an expectation that seems to color your view. It's not that I want to change your view, really. I just want to point out that your description doesn't contradict what I believe are exactly the song's strengths.

Also, The Wall had hardly anything 'new' to say. Rogers just extended old content into operatic proportions. I don't have a problem with that.

 

The obvious thing about the lyrics to Dogs of War is that they were trying to imitate the style and concerns of a departed member. That departed member used the term 'forgery' and I cannot think of a more apt description myself. The lack of sincerity in the whole project is what has always put me off - you can almost hear the various ‘members’ sitting round a table discussing previous Floyd albums and discussing which prominent elements to chuck into the mix. 'Rog used to bang on about war - lets chuck a couple of songs in about that. No one will notice.' As I said before, you can dislike The Final Cut but one thing you can say if there no doubting its sincerity. It was made out of pure passion to the extent whereby its author cared little as to whether it was liked or not. AMLOR is the exact opposite - a passionless, obvious attempt to crowd please and all the worse for it.

We would zig zag our way through the boredom and pain - those lyrics alone knock all the contrived nonsense on AMLOR into a cocked hat.

 

We all have our dark sides, to say the least
And dealing in death is the nature of the beast.

Rogers was gone. Period. You can get stuck on that fact, but the rest moved on - not at equal paces. Gilmour had his s#it together and that's why Floyd continued. You don't have to like it. But acting like you know anything about how the album was conceived or written without some reportable record of the time is just conceit. Just admit you don't like it. Why assume anything?

 

Admit I don't like it?? I think I made that very clear in my previous post! And no, they had not moved on, that's the whole point. Had they actually moved on and tried to craft something new I would have had more time for the project. They didn't, they tried to repeat previous formulas, just without the bloke whose brain was behind most of those. I do not need to have been in the room when it was created, the proof is very blatantly there on the finished record they they ended up releasing.

I'm not sure why you included those lyrics but 'We all have our dark sides, to say the least' is a laughably bad lyric....

 

I’m not a Pink Floyd aficionado, but I thought it was a very fine effort, especially considering that Roger Waters wasn’t on it, and I really enjoyed the concert I went to that supported Momentary Lapse Of Reason.

 

Some of this just comes down to personal style. I don't like being preached at usually, even when I agree with the underlying message: War is awful, I've got it. What I like about "Pigs On A Wing" is way that is serves to ground the larger album's political musings in very simple human terms, while suggesting something more ominous looming overhead. And yes, "zig zag our way through the boredom and pain" is a great turn of phrase.

 

I've always loved this album. I think many are quick to dismiss it because of Waters' absence.

It's obviously not as good as the four consecutive heavy hitters from 1973-1980, but I'd say it's better than the soundtrack albums and Umagumma, and comparable to some of the middle tier albums.

 

To some degree I really can enjoy the fact that this band was moving into a different direction. Rogers lyrics are surely one of the finest in the business and I adore The Final Cut exactly for that reason but on the other hand his lyrics got so dominant that the music bgan to suffer. This album brought back those more musical aspects of the band which was even more evidend on the following one having Rick back on track again. As for the lyrics I think that Gilmour has indeed some critical points of views by himselve and we don't need to assume that they just wanted to fill a gap, just because it has some lines against war, social ignorance and environmental distruction.

 

I have to agree. It's pretty clear when you study the genesis of this album that it was originally supposed to be a Gilmour solo album that was later retrofitted as Pink Floyd because it would shift more units, from the Hipgnosis by the numbers artwork to the atmospheric sound affects. Gilmour brought Mason and Wright on board later to help add some legitimacy but they contributed very little to the final recordings. I can accept The Division Bell as the genuine article, which evolved more naturally, but Momentary Lapse seems more self consciously contrived.

 

Thanks for your measured contribution. I, too, don't like to be preached at usually. We could start a whole thread on great, preachy songs however. It's not an unusual feature in folk and gospel. FOR ME, this song brings it with the power of rock righteousness. I'm not about others having to bow down to my pov. So, we can agree or disagree to varying degrees. I'm for keeping it lighthearted in discussion.

 

Why the cryptic references using "departed member", "member",and "author"? Why not just say Roger and whoever else you seem to know how they constructed these songs?

 

It's the Floyd lp I listen to when I'm tired of listening to my favorite Floyd lp's

 

Tristero is right.
It's essentially a Gilmour solo album that was conceived for the Pink Floyd brand....
I say brand because the whole intent was to make a Pink Floyd sounding album (Wish You Were Here was the model they used).
Gilmour used outside writers on this project and it was a struggle to come up with lyrical content and compelling themes.
That's why the album seems more of a contrived collection of songs than a genuine cohesive Floyd effort.
If you enjoy the album that's great!
I bought it the day after it was released in great anticipation and was really let down but what I heard.
I certainly didn't hear a Pink Floyd album just as when I bought The Final Cut I didn't hear a Pink Floyd album.
No surprise really because it's a Gilmour project and Gilmour had already shown a lack of compelling musical ideas with his previous solo effort About Face.....Pete Townshend contributing the couple good songs on that album.
Roger wrote The Final Cut and they called it a Pink Floyd album... and that was in my opinion when Pink Floyd ceased to be a band and became a brand.
As always just my opinion, and if you enjoy these albums that's always a good thing.


Gilmour had experimented with songwriters such as Eric Stewart and Roger McGough, but eventually settled on Anthony Moore,[23] who was credited as co-writer of "Learning to Fly" and "On the Turning Away".

 

I can understand some of the harsh to mediocre responses that are generated from AMLOR by Floyd fans, because many consider The Wall to be their last legit album. Key members were missing on The Final Cut, A Momentary Lapse Of Reason, The Division Bell, and The Endless River. I still consider them to be Pink Floyd albums, and an important part of their canon.

 

Despite getting into Pink Floyd in the late 80s, it wasn't until about 7 years ago that I finally bought any of the Post-Waters albums. Even then I never really got into them, however for Christmas I did get MLOR on vinyl and have probably played it more than I have the CD. Really starting to grow on me. Still don't really enjoy the Division Bell though.

 

I would just ask the question - at what point does a band moniker become relatively meaningless other than a trademark or a marketing device?

 

I'm generally frustrated by the lack of good reporting on this album. Would love a good article link. What I hear when I listen to this is the sum being greater than its parts. But I do hear you. And I do accept the sensibility you bring.

Not to respond directly to you, but I've been criticized in other threads for not being critical enough when liking some works others despise or disdain. I've a BA in Lit from a Big 10 Uni in the States. I was an English teacher for 20 years in public schools. I'm now an aspiring writer. AMLOR is not a concept album, but I do find thematic unity in the album. I feel it generally outlines a struggle for positive action and identity against overwhelming forces, both personal and political, that draw people into repetitive states of being or submission to hostile elements of society. As I've said before, it's chief appeal to me as a Floyd work is that it was driven by a real sense of desperation to maintain the band. Yes, it suffers from it's own bit of repeating the past. I don't deny there are formulaic aspects meant to say, "Hey, this is the Floyd you remember!" And I get that it really isn't for many fans. But, it hit me at a time of individual discovery, and like any good piece of art, encapsulated feelings I wasn't totally aware I was having and gave voice to them.

Of course art is personal. That's why the only thing that bugs me is people who talk like they know better about something they had no hand in creating nor predisposition to be open-minded about. Unlike you, who genuinely went in wanting to enjoy it but found you didn't. That's just how art can be. Thanks for the honest appreciation.

 

Not to be conspiratorial but I think the reason we didn't get much in depth reporting on how this album was conceived/made was intentional.
But in the end I have heard many an album cobbled together from disparate sources that still resonated with me.
And I have heard many that collapsed under those circumstances.
Art....no rules.

 

If you really want to raise that issue with this band, how about from Saucerful of Secrets to More? Not that I'm really suggesting that. Just, if you want to pick a point that a name change would have made sense....

I'll buy that theory. I'm not trying to claim the album isn't an attempt to forge ahead with a stumbling leap. Learning to Fly for real.

 

It's a pretty nice album, with some forgettable tracks, but also with a few 'diet' Floyd classics.
Sounds a bit too 'boom boom tchak' nowadays and apparently the coke dealer was never too far away either.
If only they would make that 'kill-the-eighties' remix (with Mason drums instead of drum machines).

 

A very good and reasonable question.

 

I thought they called it "A requiem for the post war dream by Roger Waters — performed by Pink Floyd (David Gilmour, Nick Mason, Roger Waters)". That's what it says on the outer sleeve anyway

Waters knew this lineup of the band was no longer functioning as a creative unit, which is why he left. Gilmour managed to find new creative partners and continue on using the same name, and more power to him

 

Yeah well if you listen to About Face it gives you a strong idea of where Gilmour was as a writer without Waters, although his 1978 solo debut "David Gilmour" is absolutely brilliant.... and I agree with your point that David and Nick were ready to carry on and seemingly had every right to as voted on by the members of PF.
A solid career decision.....

 

Are you a lawyer?

 

Maybe it's sort of like a sports team who has no players from the city they represent yet people of said city cheer them on anyway.