A question for audiophiles: Who makes the best PAF style humbuckers?

Discussion in 'Audio Hardware' started by dead of night, Apr 11, 2015.

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  1. innocent_bystander

    innocent_bystander Forum Resident

    Location:
    Anaheim, CA
    you can also check out suhr's new hum bucker pickup the thorn bucker designed by pete thorn.

     
  2. innocent_bystander

    innocent_bystander Forum Resident

    Location:
    Anaheim, CA
    Here's another clip...

     
  3. chervokas

    chervokas Senior Member

    You can pot 'em if you want to. They're gonna sound a lot warmer. Great if you want to sound like Jim Hall, essential if you're playing with lots of gain or even lots of volume perhaps. But they lose that clangy, microphonic crispness, which is something I love in an electric guitar sometimes (one reason I love bright, spanky Teles, it's desireable noise), and if you play like I do w/ a bunch of single gain stage blackface Fender amps and the like, and pure nickel wound strings that don't excite the pickups so much, especially at studio not stage volumes (but even today w/ the relatively low stage volumes you can use if you choose), the lack of potting can be fine (interestingly I do pot my Tele bridge pickups). Like I said, it's a very personal choice based on the guitar, the amps, the strings, the style of play. For me, I'm almost always looking for less gain, less hot pickups, less ferrous strings and more useful range out of a guitar's tone control than I think some players, particularly heavy-distortion rock players, are often looking for. In the sixties and seventies when everyone was running super loud Marshall stacks, I would think potting would have been required.

    You can get inductance spec from some manufacturers and/or resonant peak frequency specs, like Duncan, Lollar, it'll tell you a lot more about the relatively brightness vs. warmth than DCR will. But if everyone's basically using #42 enamel coated wire, replica bobbins, AlNiCo 2 magnets, and relatively think nickel plated covers the DCR will give you another point of comparison at least at the extremes -- some of these things are wound pretty hot these days.
     
  4. Cymbaline

    Cymbaline Shiny Dog

    Location:
    Buda, TX
    This isn't really an "audiophile" question. Guitar pickups and amps are about as non-audiophile as you can get. They only generate a narrow range of frequencies.

    It depends on what kind of sound you're going for, what guitar you have, and what amp you have.

    But there have been some good suggestions here: Gibson, Seymour Duncan, DiMarzio, and a ton of others. They're all good.
     
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  5. whaiyun

    whaiyun Forum Resident

    Location:
    Windsor/Detroit
    Voodoos have been highly praised. Low wind, A5 magnets, lightly potted for the best of both worlds. I guess it depends what music you play. A lot of this PAF hype is to get single coil tones with the benefits of a humbucker. Sort of in between the two styles.

    I'm a single coil guy so I can't help you more than that. Sorry. Usually the higher the waitlist and higher the resale (used) price, the better they are. (huge generalization).

    I use Ron Ellis 50/60s in my strat and it's a year+ wait list and payment up front. Best pickups I've ever had (fralins, lollars, fender CS, etc) Made my GAS itch go away. Permanently.
    I read he was making humbuckers recently. Might wanna check that out.
     
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  6. JBryan

    JBryan Forum Resident

    Location:
    St Louis
    I haven't played through them all but my preference leans toward the Voodoo with the '57 Classic being a good alternative (less$). I'm not a fan of the Seymour Duncan version and the Wolftone only sounds right when played loud.

    As others have mentioned, its hard to pinpoint the 'sound' of the authentic PAF so finding your favorite is like throwing darts at a moving target. Amongst the other folks' reasons, I have Gibsons built a year or so apart with PAF's that sound very different and I attribute some of it to environment. Back when I meticulously cleaned and restored my guitars, I'd clean everything right down to the solder joints. Some guitars (and amps) were literally encased in a thick layer of tar from too many nights in bars and smoke-filled basements or garages. Some particularly 'smokey' guitars would sound quite different after a thorough cleaning - and not always for the better. Its amazing how smoke can find its way into every crevice and nook in the electronics and the time and effort to get it out is almost as painful as the rags soaked in dark brown tar are disgusting... :hurl:
     
  7. Tullman

    Tullman Senior Member

    Location:
    Boston MA
  8. kt66brooklyn

    kt66brooklyn Senior Member

    Location:
    brooklyn, ny
    I like the work of the previously mentioned Jason Lollar. Generally, ALNICO magnets are a must and loose, somewhat sloppy winding of very fine gauge wire is a requirement. Avoid potting if you can.
     
  9. GuildX700

    GuildX700 Forum Resident

    Location:
    USA
    And with every pickup/guitar combo there is a synergy or lack thereof, to speak nothing of the amplifier interface and it's affects.

    In the end it's an endless combination and once in a great while you hit the jackpot.
     
  10. Steve@39

    Steve@39 Forum Resident

    Location:
    Australia
    Just stumbled across this thread. I always find it amusing to read posts about who makes the best recreation of a thing made in the 1950s. As far as humbucker guitars go, I have to use my experience in 45 years of playing to say that I have played at length Gibson ES335s from the '60/ '61 era and a couple of LP Customs(3 pickups) from that era. The most noticeable thing I and guitar friends remember back then was the big fat clear sound from those guitars- and it was mostly clean playing, generally only distorted by having amps turned up loud. :)
    I have had many ES335s/ 345s from the mid 60s to the mid 2000s, and none have had that sound I remembered from the old Gibsons, the sound had become woodier, less articulate on the highs, and generally dull like a blanket was over the amplifiers. I had been looking over the last year or so for a recent 335 to modify in the hope of finding the right repro pickups etc to get that old sound, but in the process I stumbled across a '84 335 Dot in great condition, and that guitar captured the sound I had in my head, and was closer to the old sound than any other I had played, to the point where I had to immediately buy that guitar. It has the PAF stickers on the pickup rings, so I believe it has Shaw designed pickups. I would say that whoever can build a pickup like that, will have captured the sound of the old Gibson humbuckers. Happy playing.:cool:
     
  11. GuildX700

    GuildX700 Forum Resident

    Location:
    USA
    Original PAF's varied wildly in their sound due the the uneven windings. And they also age, so what original PAF sound are we even targeting?

    In the end we are chasing a Will-o'-the-wisp for the most part.
     
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  12. misterdecibel

    misterdecibel Bulbous Also Tapered

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  13. Bolero

    Bolero Senior Member

    Location:
    North America
    Throbak, Wolfetone, Lollar, JS Moore are my go-to's for PAF style pickups
     
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  14. Atmospheric

    Atmospheric Forum Resident

    Location:
    Eugene
    I just replaced the pickups in my 2003 McCarty Brazillian with Florence Voodoo 60s. I dunno if they are holy grail, but they are a major upgrade from the special edition McCarty PUs that came with the guitar. Nice bark and bite on the bridge PU, neck PU is articulate and warm but not muddy. Don't even get me started about the need to upgrade PUs in a $2,800 signed numbered limited edition guitar. But at least I can play it now without wondering if I should sell it.
     
    Last edited: Jun 29, 2015
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  15. GuildX700

    GuildX700 Forum Resident

    Location:
    USA
    Great thread, someone said this was not the place for this type of info. :unhunh:

    I have to disagree, seems a good deal of us have a handle on topics like this one. :righton:
     
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  16. BlackStrat_Fan

    BlackStrat_Fan That's like your opinion, man!

    Location:
    Woodland Hills, CA
    Lots of info over on the gear page forum, but in my experience Gibson makes pretty good PAF style humbuckers (57 classics). I'm also a fan of Lollars, but I've only used his single coils. Honestly, I like Seymour Duncans. You can spend a lot on boutique type HBs, but I don't think you gain much over what Duncans offer. Another that I've been tempted to try are the Dimarzio 36th Anniversaries.
     
  17. JamieLang

    JamieLang Forum Resident

    Location:
    Nashville, TN
    Duncans have made me never care about boutique humbuckers. Consistent....great tone....

    I mean, I have Fralins and one specific Dimarzio in all my single coil guitars....but, Duncan has always done HBs right, IMO. I've never not gotten great tone from....JBs....59s...I might have Seth Lovers in the Heritage now--I don't remember....but, back in the day there was the Lynch PU....and the Custom Custom....they have lots of solid varieties to match up with the particular guitar.
     
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  18. Eric B.

    Eric B. Active Member

    Location:
    San Diego
    I use the duncan 59 ,, the neck is especially good, for a budget option. Mr hoffman was exactly right the vintage paf sound varied greatly, and there were no neck or bridge specific models. The guitar and potentiometer values, tone caps of various values and types, 50's wiring or modern. How far down the 'rabbit hole' do you want to go? I got my first Humbucker as a teen and it was the start of a life long quest for "TONE" :tiphat:
     
  19. james

    james Summon The Queen

    Location:
    Annapolis
    IMO, PRS pickups have gotten way better since 2003...at least, there are more pickup offerings to my liking. The 57/08 is probably my favorite pickup ever. I also really like the Starla pickups (though they're more Filtertron than PAF).
     
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  20. captwillard

    captwillard Forum Resident

    Location:
    Nashville
    Tone and volume controls are important! Sometimes learning to better use what you already have is the way to go.
     
  21. guitarguy

    guitarguy Tone Meister

    Location:
    Planet Earth
    As others have said, this can be a loaded question. In my experience, no two "original" PAFs sounded exactly the same and varied greatly by year, what kind of guitar they were made for, etc. (Gibson would wind pickups differently for 335s, LPs, etc.) Pickups that sound great in one guitar may sound completely different in another guitar and are further affected by set-up, amps, string type and many other factors.

    To your original question, it sounds like your luthier is offering a choice between either Lollar or Throbak. I would call or email each company and talk to them. Tell them what kind of playing you do, whose sound you admire, your playing style, how your guitars are set up and what you like / don't like about what you currently have. They should be able to guide you. Then roll the dice.

    FWIW - I don't think that the boutique guys are necessarily any better (or worse) than the main stream guys like Duncan or Dimarzio. The boutique guys will likely offer more options and be open to more customization. That said, I have had some great conversations with Larry Dimarzio and Seymour Duncan. They do know their stuff. I've got Dimarzio in one of my strats and they just "worked" better in this guitar for what I was going for and I did try 3 others including some boutique brands prior.
     
  22. Dr Tone

    Dr Tone Forum Resident

    Location:
    Calgary, AB
  23. Sax-son

    Sax-son Forum Resident

    Location:
    Three Rivers, CA
    Lollars, Frailins, and Gibson 57 classics are all superb pickups. However, if you want that PAF sound for a lot less money, try the Stew-Mac "Parson Street" humbuckers. I installed a pair in my Gibson Flying V and they were just what the doctor ordered. I am very happy with them.
     
  24. DaveyF

    DaveyF Forum Resident

    Location:
    La Jolla, Calif
    Question....why would you want a 'Bucker?...when you can use a single coil...which IMHO is far more of a screamer and therefore far more interesting sonically. :D
    But then I'm a Fender guy.:shtiphat:
     
  25. Steve Hoffman

    Steve Hoffman Your host Your Host

    I love Stew-Mac stuff, yes. Their polish is top notch..
     
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