About those Billy Joel CD remasters...

For years, I advocated those remastered CDs. I bought them when they came out in the 90s. I found nothing wrong with them. They sounded fine. The problem has been that I hadn't been listening carefully enough, nor did I really compare them to the original CDs. For years, and on this forum, I touted their sound and was one of the people who went against the forum wisdom.

Well, a couple of months ago, I finally bought the "52nd Street" remaster for a couple of dollars. (It was never one of my favorite albums.) I had the original CD, so I decided to compare them, since it sounded like something was a bit off. I enjoyed the sound, but it was a bit too consistent between tracks, not how I remembered the vinyl. So, anyway, I realized that a lot of the nuance and detail was totally destroyed by the compression of the remaster, as was the stereo soundstage. A casual listener wouldn't have noticed or cared, but, since i'm an audiophile... Detail and microdynamics are very important to me.

Now, I am going to replace the remasters I bought with the originals. I'm glad I woke up concerning these CDs. I have three albums left to replace with the old and i'm good.

 

I have pretty much everything Billy Joel did on vinyl. I bought the remasters for convenience. I appreciate your review and your diligence. I enjoy Billy's music a great deal. I still love the Nylon Curtain on CD. Actually, as you say, I enjoyed them all and they are still cheap on Amazon.

As much as I respect your opinion on this, I'm thinking I will just stay with the remasters.

 

I think the only remaster I have is "Songs In The Attic". I might have had others at one point (and I definitely had the 4 CD Greatest Hits + box set), but eventually nabbed the originals of the titles I really wanted (Turnstiles, Stranger, 52nd St, Nylon Curtain, Storm Front). I dig 'em.

Someday if I find the original "Songs" for cheap, I'll nab it.

 

If your going with the old US ones Grant
Piano Man has pre-emphasis
My old Glass Houses and Stranger does not
Not sure on the other titles

 

Your discovery doesn't just hold true for the Billy Joel CDs. Anything from the 70's that was recorded on analog tape that has been remastered, is not the way I remember hearing it on vinyl and cassette when it came out. You can't take something that had analog compression applied to it when it was mastered 40 years ago and add digital compression to it after the fact and expect it to sound "right".
I wanna hear this music on CD sound the way I remember it sounding when I was a kid. That's why I seek out the best sounding original non remastered CDs. Younger people are at a disadvantage because they didn't grow up listening to this stuff, and having it fused into their DNA. They don't have the reference point. If detail and microdynamics are importnat to you, then steer clear of anything remastered and begin the journey I did 2 years ago..........................

 

I have a Japan for USA Columbia of Stranger that sounds really nice. The original Columbia of 52 Street is extremely bright, Steve's AF is is the best I've heard. The MFSL of 52 has all the high end sucked out of it.

 

Some of these PE discs may have carried over to the US pressings
Billy Joel - 52nd St. - 35DP 1 (Japan for Japan / Japan for US, crude font matrix)
Billy Joel - The Stranger - 35DP 2 (crude font matrix)
Billy Joel - Glass Houses - 35DP 18 (Japan for Japan / Japan for US)
Billy Joel - Songs In The Attic - 35DP 19
Billy Joel - The Nylon Curtain - 35DP 34 (crude font matrix)
Billy Joel - Piano Man - CDCBS 80719 Japan for Europe with 35DP 109 in the matrix
Billy Joel - Piano Man - CK 32544 Columbia USA "The Nice Price"

 

The original post is contradictory. You advocated the remasters but then didn't listen to the remasters until your recent 52nd street purchase? I can't figure out from context which collection you are praising.

 

That would explain 52nd's unbearable brightness. Plus when the vocals kick in in Big Shot........whoa...in my face.

 

Thing is I'm not sure where the tag is located on that one, foobar has a nice plug in that will add the proper EQ if you are ripping it...

 

Thanks bud, I use Foobar all the time. It never occurred to me to rip 52 to the hardrive and use the IIR filter on the WAV files. I'll give it try and compare it to the AF. I've used it a bunch of times on old Japan pressings with pre-emph and gotten very nice results.

 

Well, I don't need "Piano Man", so I don't have that one.

I can deal with pre-emphasis by simply ripping it with the appropriate software. I don't listen directly to CDs. I have everything ripped.

 

I found it for $2.99 a few hours earlier.

 

Did I say you did?
Other forum-ites may be interested in the older titles so I was providing additional information...

 

Thanks for your post. I don't agree, however. In terms of remasters, Billy Joel's catalog is hardly a poster child for screwing up original albums. Ted Jensen did a good job on most of these and the Greatest Hits CD's are much better in the remastered versions because of the album cuts they use rather than singles, IMHO.

 

My prefered choices for Billy Joel on disk are the current MFSL SACDs, very well done indeed without being loud or agressive.

 

But, you specifically named me in your post, so...

 

The 1998 remasters aren't disasters, really.

But if I were to choose, I'd go with the original discs with the exception of the 1985 Greatest Hits.

 

Forget the thread title, which is ostensibly about Billy Joel teamsters. This thread is apparently all about the OP.

 

How opinions change...the Billy Joel remasters used to be forum favorites.
Billy Joel - The Stranger remaster »

 

That short thread is all over the place. They're great, they're terrible, if you raise the levels to the clipping point then there is massive clipping...

I guess it's safe to say that opinions on Billy Joel remasters are extremely divided.

 

Exactly! I just started to pay more attention to the details. The bit that got me this time, specifically, is the destruction of the stereo image and fine detail on the remasters. I would say that if those two things don't bother you, keep the remasters.

 

Wouldn't that only be an issue if played on a computer?

 

No, it depends on the player itself, For example ,Oppo's won't add the eq if the tag is found in the SUB Q channel, only if it's found in the TOC (Table of Contents)
The Pre-emphasis eq curve can only be applied via analog outs (Player side DAC) on any given player
I've been on the hunt for a descent high end player that will add the proper eq found in both... It's not going very well, Until I do my Onkyo 7030 will suffice

 

I just de-emph with Foobar, than rip to CD. At least I know it's been decoded.