Amp Decision: Rogue or Yamaha - which amp brings the warmth?*

I’ve narrowed my amp choice to two. Those two are very different amps and olmy one I can audition.

I’m going for a warm sound with speakers that are really warm.

Cast your vote the. Make your case.

 

A few things.

1. If every component is inherently warm, it'll end up sounding like mud. System-matching is important.
2. The Rogue is known for being neutral with only (maybe) slight warmth. That from two long-term owners on this board.
3. The Yamaha costs almost 1K more than the Rogue so not exactly a fair comparison.
4. If you want to use one of them as a foundation for an eventually great system, that's a wise move. If it'll be your sole great piece, it won't make the rest of your system which is more in line with entry-level sound like hi-fi.

Elaborating on point #4, assuming for kicks that this is the sole premium piece you're willing or wanting to spend serious coin on, I'd suggest you instead buy very good components for everything instead. The end result will likely sound better. For instance, instead of buying a $3500 amp, you buy an Outlaw RR2160 which leaves you $1700 to buy a Marantz TT15S1 which comes with a better cart than the 2M Blue (as an example) and you'd have an extra $500 left to put towards speakers, cables, or perhaps towards a higher-end phono preamp... and that's without counting the money you'd get by selling your current gear! Basically, lots of possibilities.

 

I am not currently interested in changing speakers. Period. It’s not up for debate. In the future? Maybe. Right now, I’m upgrading my amplification. Amplification suggestions please.

 

Get the A-S2100.
It is a great amp. Run it balanced. That extra 6db of gain makes a hell of a difference.

 

I think both amps would work in your system. However since you complained about bass weakness I think the Yamaha would provide a bit more grunt to the speakers.

 

If that's all you got from my post, I kindly invite you to carefully reread it.

 

Well, since the Rogue is a tube amp, you could roll the tubes to suit your tastes. I copied this from another forum...


As can be seen in the picture below, the amp has 4 KT120 tubes, 3 12au7 tubes, and 2 12ax7's. FYI, I am only interested in rolling the 12au7's & 12ax7's. I contacted Rogue for suggestions and received a very quick response from Bill (GREAT customer service BTW). He said to begin with the center 12au7 because that is the preamp tube and will have the most impact on the sound. He told me that his advice is simple. If you want more warmth, go with Mullards. If you want more detail, go with Telefunken. If you want something in between, go with RCA Clear Top. BTW, the stock tubes are basic JJ.

 

Read that yes. My local dealer will let me take one home to play with when it shows back up. The Yammy I will not get to demo.

 

Hey Minty, guess you just answered you Q, always get an audition if you can. No one here can tell you how it will sound in your room with your speakers/sources?!? Doh bro!!

Or you can just get crazy like I did and go with what you read in reviews, spend your money sight unseen, hope for the best...wish you luck! I'd go the Yammie route IIWU, always loved that sound they had!!

 

I have a Cronos Mag v1. Love that thing. The phono in sucks but it is a beautiful sounding amp. I have no opinion on the Yamaha (except back in the day I interviewed for a job with their woodwind factory).

 

I haven't heard the 2100, only the 1100, but both it and the Rogue can be considered neutral by my definition. My experience was that the 1100 has a lower noise floor but less of a 3-dimensional sound stage. The Rogue produced a "front row" presentation, while the 1100 has a sort of 5th row sound.

As for bass, I'd say the Rogue has greater upper-bass kick, but the Yamaha reaches a bit deeper.

I recommend auditioning the CMII and if it doesn't work for you, then try the Yamaha.

 

Warmth in an amp is just distortion. Neither of these should have that.

 

With the Rogue, you can just roll the tubes for a warmer sound. And if you change your mind, you can roll them for a more neutral sound. That's one of the nice things tube components give you. Flexibility and customization of sound.

 

Love my CM and it's true that rolling one tube can let you make major or minor changes in its sound. You could switch the center tube every listening session if you wanted the amp to suit particular albums.

 

I have a used CM2. I like it, the guys at rogue are helpful. It's pretty darn quiet and it has enough bass for me.

Before thinking you have to roll stock tubes, give it a few months with the JJ's, they do quite a bit of stuff very well. I like an Amperex in the center 12au7 channel.

There are a lot of comments on various forums saying the 12ax7 change the sound. I believe these are phase inverters. Don't spend money here. I rolled these with some various tubes my grandfather had...(yes tested and paired), they do little to change sound.

The headphone jack is ok. I use a headphone amp.

Your current amp has a DAC. The rogue only accepts RCA....would this create an issue with TV setup (not familiar with yours).

I have a transport/DAC that I run into CD on the rogue, my phono pre feeds another line.

Getting new speakers today....the rogue is enough to move them but sadly I may be needing more amp in the future.

The rogue would probably sound good with your current speakers. As far as tube amps go, it is a bit neutral with more bass than some I have heard.



I would look for a used CM2, maybe spend the other K on some vinyl or a cleaner.

 

Yamaha.

 

That'd be way too much tweaking for my tastes. You'd need to power the amp down, switch the tube(s), power it back up, wait for it to be available for listening again, and then cue the next album.

Nothing will ever be perfect but the very best possible match to most of your music library is the real goal, IMHO.

 

Phase inverters don't change the sound at all. Same with guitar amps. A perfectly good functioning tube will work just fine but it doesn't really matter which one it is as long as it functions properly. If it doesn't function well, it might crackle or hiss abnormally loudly.

So save your money and don't feel the need to buy an NOS tube for that position... assuming it really is a phase inverter.

Which ones?[/QUOTE]

 

I was half joking, just pointing out you could. You wouldn't want to between records but you could day to day if you were going to listen to jazz one night and classical the next and you had tubes you preferred with those genres. Takes about 10 seconds to do.

 

I will make this easy for you. If I read you correctly, you can demo the Rogue, but you cannot demo the Yamaha. Take the Rogue home and give it a try. See how it sounds in your system. You have nothing to lose. If you don't like it, move on to something (Yamaha) else.

 

Yeah, I sure wouldn’t drop $3000 on something I couldn’t listen to first. What else does your dealer carry?

 

the yamaha is an excellent sounding amp but the rogue is far more warmer sounding. the caveat here is that it takes time. after nearly 2 years with the CMII including some initially bright amperex tubes, it has rounded off to a swert, lush, warm spatial sound that I have never heard from any solid state amplifier.

 

Isn't it $3500?

 

$2,400

 

Not the normal price, though. Thanks for pointing out that deal. Somebody will be a happy lucky guy.

Wonder if anybody would be crazy enough to drop an extra 1K for silver. Haha!