Any one using an equalizer in thier setup?

Discussion in 'Audio Hardware' started by TimB, Dec 9, 2017.

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  1. Kristofa

    Kristofa Enthusiast of small convenient sound carrier units

    Location:
    usa
    Yep. I use multiposition measurement YPAO then set to flat on my Yamaha AVR. I like the result. I will soon be getting a Parasound Halo integrated and fear my EQ use will cause me to dislike the sound of the Parasound, as I really don’t care for the sound of the Yamaha without it.
     
  2. Silvian

    Silvian New Member

    Yes, the audio world is divided: purists, "don't care"-ists, realists (sorry, I just couldn't find another word and, yes, I'm one of them),..

    And while I do believe that not everything can be accurately measured, or we don't even understand all the variables which come into play when listening - hence so much room for interpretations, impressions, and, well, arguments, I also believe that most of us do not put in the minimum necessary effort to qualify our impressions. And this question, on using an EQ, is the perfect example.

    And so perhaps a better question might have been "did anyone measure their hearing abilities"? If they did, there should be very rare exceptions: we should all use EQ. It is a simple matter of calibrating the hardware to our human imperfections (anatomy, age, stress, tiredness)and preferences (education, taste, mood).

    Go on, do this with any of the online tools available. Then check the frequency response curve of your headphones - there are plenty sites which publish that. Headphones, because it is a much simpler task rather than go into how your room impacts the sound. And these are just two of the many variables in play.
    And now explain how you prefer to have many dBs worth of imbalances but care about some nano whatever it is you are sensitive to. I'm not saying you aren't: good on you, but put everything into perspective. An EQ might not be a free lunch, for very, very few, but it could be a life of better enjoyment for all others.

    I always wondered how those pros in the recording studios use $3-400 headphones and are surrounded by mixing tables (lots and lots of EQs, compressors, etc) instead of using the most accurate stuff there is, with the shortest signal path, the Focal Utopias - the budget is not a problem for them. Again, no offense to those who really are sensitive to those things, but do not say it as if it's the ultimate argument for everyone, it isn't.
    We like audio, that's why we are here, and we wish there would be more like us - I do, so then make it our responsibility to make things clear and easy for those who might have a read and don't know better. Don't scare them away and then pity them, with superiority, that they listen to whatever bad hardware.
    Sorry for my venting, but I get really worked up when I see so many opinions with no base, no qualifications.
     
  3. JBStephens

    JBStephens I don't "like", "share", "tweet", or CARE. In Memoriam

    Location:
    South Mountain, NC
    I use an equalizer as a crossover, rolling off the low end fed to the mains, and the subs bringing in the bottom end. It works very nicely.
     
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  4. Pastafarian

    Pastafarian Forum Resident

    I've not had a tone control for 30 years, I'm not in the no use for them camp but I've never felt the need, I am surprised by so much talk about EQ
     
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  5. Warren Jarrett

    Warren Jarrett Audio Note (UK) dealer in SoCal/LA-OC In Memoriam

    Location:
    Fullerton, CA
    Well, not specifically "boomy bass" and "rolled-of highs", but every recording has a little different tonal balance, and most can be corrected to sound better in any given audio system. I just haven't decided yet if it's really worth the trouble.

    My point really was that the Loki has 4 VERY helpful frequencies chosen for the audiophile sensibilities of low bass punch, mid bass boom, upper-midrange glare, and high-frequency sparkle.
     
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  6. luckyno13

    luckyno13 Forum Resident

    Location:
    London UK
    I think there's talk about EQ because of the dissatisfaction with the much of the current mastering/re-mastering of the like daily discussed in Music Corner.
    Some people are happy to take adjustment into their own hands.

    I'm a Loki owner and very happy with its simple intuitive approach. (My posts on it are in the Loki thread)
    However, it's been turned off for a week and I'm content with most of the music I listen to.
    It's there to fix the occasional CD/Record that just needs a little help!
     
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  7. Mike-48

    Mike-48 A shadow of my former self

    Location:
    Portland, Oregon
    Yes, I agree with that. It has occurred to me that people like playing LPs because the material was well mastered, considering the characteristics of the playback equipment, and not because the medium is in some way inherently superior.

    Many pop/rock/etc recent releases in digital are poorly mastered. Besides the plague of over-compression -- leading to a dynamic range of perhaps 3 dB on many tracks -- there are EQ issues, included HF boosted in reissues. This sounds particularly bad on modern systems, which reproduce those HFs without rolling them off.
     
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  8. Hipper

    Hipper Forum Resident

    Location:
    Herts., England
    Are you wanting to talk about equalisers with a headphone system?

    There are plenty of threads on EQ and speaker listening, and the multiple ways of using them - room correction, tone controls, correcting for poor recordings and adjustments for damaged hearing.

    With headphones, only the last three apply and are easier (although not necessarily easy) to use in these circumstances. In addition it seems some headphones (or perhaps the whole headphone system) have anomalies and users try and correct those too.

    As we've seen, some apply their principles to the EQ concept: they want to hear the mastering engineers' original intentions; they want the simplest possible signal path etc.. In fact there should only be one overriding principle: the music should be played in such a way that you enjoy it. If someone can only enjoy listening to music by employing those other two principles, for example, I feel they are limiting the possibilities of truly getting to the music.

    With headphones, what you ideally should do is match the headphone with an amp to get the sound you want. In other words you look for an amp and headphone (and headphone cable if you believe they make a difference - I do). The only way to do that is to listen for yourself. If you get this right it is unlikely you will need an equaliser for a headphone system.

    You may have hearing deficiencies - as you get older you lose some of the high frequencies (I'm 64 and cannot hear above 10kHz and I am down about 4dB in the 6-8kHz region). In addition there may be differences between each ear (in my case my right ear seems to have lost the 7kHz region). An equaliser can help here although if you've actually made a good selection of headphone and amp it may not be required (I've got a good headphone set up and enjoy the music so don't use EQ).

    Correcting for poor recordings is very difficult because each recording could be different meaning you are constantly fiddling with the equaliser. That could detract from your overall enjoyment so, even though some of my recordings are bass shy, for example, I just accept and love them for what they are. If you have some very bad recordings you could rip them, add suitable EQ, then put them on a CD-R.

    I do use EQ in my speaker set-up, mostly for room correction after using room treatments and careful positioning of speakers and chair. This is not easy to do well, requires much measurement and patience but the rewards are there in the music.
     
  9. I use my dsp, when needed, which is rare, because of room issues. Never needed when using headphones. Those who rage against the use of DSPs etc are welcome to their views; i just dont share them. Each to their own; there are NO rights or wrongs.
     
    showtaper likes this.
  10. Chris Schoen

    Chris Schoen Rock 'n Roll !!!

    Location:
    Maryland, U.S.A.
    This is a very practical use for an equalizer. Something even the audio hardware "purists" might consider. Does perfect "high end" equipment without
    tone adjustments restore hearing deficiencies? I think not.
     
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  11. jeffmackwood

    jeffmackwood Forum Resident

    Location:
    Ottawa
    My main HT has multiple speakers (many more than usual.) At one point, every individual speaker had its own ten-band equalizer, that, as near as possible, was used to give a reasonably flat response. (All of the subwoofers involved in the bass-management process are treated differently, but that's another story). There was a very small amount of noise (mainly hiss) introduced, but nothing noticeable when actually playing music.

    When I installed an Audyssey-equipped pre/pro I took all of the EQs out and relied on it. I thought it was an improvement so I sold off all but one of the EQs (which sits somewhere on one of my surplus gear shelves.)

    With time I grew (sonically) tired of Audyssey and switched it off and went cold turkey. Now unlike the happy or sad face profiles a lot of people seem to draw with their EQ sliders, mine never needed a lot of boost or cut . A combination of great speakers, placement, and room treatments (along with that longer-story bass-management scheme) gives a relatively flat, and likeable, sound "au naturel."

    I personally see no need to go back to using any form of EQ in my main HT. I think there's a lot of things to try before you get to that stage. And then if you do happen to use one, and find that you need it a lot, then perhaps you need to go back to square one as that in itself is pretty telling.

    But like seasonings and food: we all have different tastes in sound.

    Jeff
     
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  12. Michael

    Michael I LOVE WIDE S-T-E-R-E-O!

  13. libertycaps

    libertycaps Forum Resident

    Location:
    Portland, OR, USA
    My valve stereo? Nope.
    Solid State? Yep. dbx 3BX III. And you can pry it from my cold, dead hands.
     
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  14. BIGGER Dave

    BIGGER Dave Forum Resident

    I feel if I’m not going to use a good quality equalizer (like a George Massenburg, Pultec, Manley, etc), I shouldn’t be using an equalizer at all.
     
  15. pdxway

    pdxway Forum Resident

    Location:
    Oregon, USA
    I am using two minidsp. I used them to reduce 50 hz room mode and help with crossover and delay.

    I also utilize my receiver's dsp to further reduce standing waves and do full bands phase alignment.
     
  16. Claude Benshaul

    Claude Benshaul Forum Resident

    I don't use EQ at home but I do in the car because I can't change the speaker's location or move the seat.
     
  17. WestGrooving

    WestGrooving Forum Resident

    Location:
    California, U.S.A
    I use the room calibration feature on my Audio Control Octave EQ. I've compared with and without and do prefer the calibrated sound with my mid-fi equipment.
     
  18. 56GoldTop

    56GoldTop Forum Resident

    Location:
    Nowhere, Ok
    When I used "less than lovely" 4-way 15 inch floorstanders, EQ was absolutely necessary to deal with mid-bass suck-out that could swallow the Grand Canyon and quite a few Chucky dolls; just not listenable any other way. However, my system such as it is, currently, is exceedingly enjoyable without it but with careful positioning of the loudspeakers.
     
  19. slinkyfarm

    slinkyfarm Forum Resident

    Location:
    Winchester, KY
    I broke myself of the habit shortly after I signed up here. I might dig it out of the garage again someday if I set up a dedicated listening room, but probably only to correct for the speakers and the room. I have a reverb amp and some other goodies that I haven't played with in years too.
     
  20. AcidPunk15

    AcidPunk15 Forum Resident

    Location:
    New Brunswick, NJ
    Can anybody recommend any bargain price solid Equalizers?
     
  21. bluemooze

    bluemooze Senior Member

    Location:
    Frenchtown NJ USA
    Schiit Loki.
     
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  22. GuildX700

    GuildX700 Forum Resident

    Location:
    USA
    NO. :tsk::unhunh::unhunh::unhunh::tsk:

    I don't need, want, desire, nor find any need or use for one in PLAYBACK, no matter what kind, or how "good" it may be.

    Not that I'm ignorant of what they can or can't do.

    I've used them in live sound and recording.

    BUT.....those sonic arenas my friends are another whole different matter than using one in strictly a playback system of finished audio works.

    I've never heard one do any sonic good when one was in use in a good or better, fairly well sorted out audio playback system, regardless of price.

    And.....If the system had some serious sonic issues? Well, it still made matters worse overall.

    The sonic trash they can & will insert into the PLAYBACK signal chain is a far greater sonic penalty than anything I could ever expect one to improve in any sort of an attempt in "fixing" what I was listening to.

    Fix your system, what ever part or parts are that bad which drove you to that decision to get one in the first place.

    And if your source material is that bad, well, suffer through it, because in the end you are most likely no audio engineer which frankly makes you into someone who is dabbling in and attempting to fix things you have far from any true skills or knowledge to delve into.

    Sorry to be so frank, but my guess is most folks that are attempting to use one most likely need to hear the harsh truth and reality of the of the matter. :shrug:
     
  23. Pastafarian

    Pastafarian Forum Resident

    I don't believe boosting the high frequencies will improve you perception of those frequencies and I think what people describe as bad EQ is a poor digital front end (probably the DAC). I say this as I've heard some of the maligned CDs sounding fantastic through my friends dcs CD player.
     
    Last edited: Dec 13, 2017
  24. AcidPunk15

    AcidPunk15 Forum Resident

    Location:
    New Brunswick, NJ
    What about this

    Technics SH-Z360 equalizer for $50
     
  25. Silvian

    Silvian New Member

    Being frank is a given, I hope we all are, and it is very much appreciated. What we don't seem to be is clear, as clear as one can be in writing, without knowing each other's history and so on.

    In a previous post on this thread I invited those who claim that an EQ deteriorates the sound to qualify the statement - no one accepted the challenge. Even better, I suggested, to compare, for their own case of course, how come they can put up with many dBs of EQ imbalances but not being able to put up with, and I say "whatever" because in my 30 over years experience in HiFi, not for a moment I was bothered by anything you seem to be bothered by. I accept that I may simply not be sensitive enough to those things, or perhaps no one explained well enough what I should be hearing. In many occasions I ran A/B comparisons, I tried to understand the theories (I do have some scientific background and I can read charts, I understand physical/electrical terms and all that), I even tried to map the usual audiophile terms with such electrical characteristics, again, for a better understanding of the variables in play.

    So, in order to get somewhere with this thread, and hopefully learn something, would you mind trying to explain?
    Empty statements such as:
    - "those sonic arenas ( live sound and recording) are another whole different matter" or
    - "I've never heard one do any sonic good", or
    - "it still made matters worse overall", or
    - "The sonic trash they can & will insert into the PLAYBACK signal chain is a far greater sonic penalty than ...", or
    - "my guess is most folks that are attempting to use one most likely need to hear the harsh truth and reality of the of the matter."
    mean nothing usefull for those who try to understand. Since you use such strong adjectives like "sonic trash", "harsh truth", "sonic penalty" which suggest, to me, how dramatic the alteration to the sound is, and with your experience on both sides of the equation, it should be, finally, straightforward and easy to understand, and even if I may not be able to hear it, perhaps others will.
    Thank you
     
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