Anyone use bookshelf speakers without a subwoofer?

ok guys, this is very OT

mods, clear this please

 

Right, let's not go down this path, please.

 

ONLY two i like from the past few years are Random Access Memories by Daft Dunk and Erasures tomorrows world album. Other dance music today has gone to s**t, its awful actually.

EDIT make that a 3rd, i like Gnarls Barkley aswell.

 

Where on earth have you been? Since 1988 when Atari released the ST with integrated MIDI, and Notator released comp software that ran on TOS/GEM ST Atari computers, every "muppet" as you put it has been able to put out "any old *****" he or she wanted. And you're just noticing this now!?! It's been 28 years!

Also, in case you missed it, the music market has always been burdened by its small share of talentless people just like every other field of endeavour. You also might want to go easy on "shop assistants" because some of them grow up to be far more than you'd ever believe. The subject was a subwoofer as an adjunct to bookshelf speakers.

Not really. 90% of all music today is just not to your liking. That doesn't make it bad. Your comment does peg you as a cranky geezer though (i.e., Hey you kids! Get off my lawn!!). And the subject is still supposed to be about a subwoofer as an adjunct to bookshelf speakers.

I think that well designed bookshelf speakers properly positioned in a room that they can effectively load don't need a subwoofer, IMO. Then again, if someone wants chest thumping bass from a small woofer in a small cabinet located in even a room well suited to the particular bookshelf speakers, it's rarely going to happen - wrong speakers for the application.

I'm currently breaking in a pair of Falcon Acoustics LS3/5As that just arrived from Tone Imports. I normally load the room with Harbeth Monitor 30.1's, Spendor A5R's, AR3A's, KEF 104aB's, or Kudos Super 10's. The Falcon Acoustics LS33/5A's are startlingly good though and for now I just can't get enough of them. To my ears they're the best LS3/5A on the market today compared to the Harbeth P3ESR, Graham LS3/5A, Chartwell, Rogers, Spendor, Audio Space and so on. The point is that in the right size room, in this case, bass that is detailed, clean and resonant is present and thoroughly satisfying.

No subwoofer, unless someone is really trying to make their bookself speaker system into something other that what it was meant to be.

 

Im talking about commercial mainstream music, teeny bopper crap. you know the kind that consists of 3 minutes of wobble wobble wobble, usually vocally sampled from music made 40 years ago and then kids today think its something new, yea i can be a miserable fart but who cares, i know what i like and i know what i dont like, i stopped listening to dance chart music in 1999, to me it was the last good year of dance and trance. Djs like brandon block, alaistair whitehead, dave seaman and judge jules, all very talented djs, what have we got now david guetta, who is not even capable of doing a live set without faking it and pretending to push buttons on stage. Here in England its getting so bad i cannot even listen to radio1 it sounds like someone has pushed a rusty screwdriver in my ears, also lets not forget the good old CD itself, as bad as dance music is today its made even worse by stupid amounts of compression and limiters. Today the original pioneers of electronica dance music Kraftwerk are STILL the best and they go back to the 70s.

Remember a time when music was actually worth recording from the radio?

"Kernkraft 400 - Zombie nation" was made on a Commodore64 8 bit computers SID chip, and still now its one of the best and most catchy dance tracks ever made. so why with all this technology now with such powerful pc's are people churning out such rubbish.

Everyones a DJ until you give them a pair of technics 1200's and a mixer

 

Hooefully this isn't too off topic. I'm content with the Pioneer BS22 speakers but I'll upgrade probably next year. What bookshelf speakers under $500 sound good without a sub? Some reviews say the Kef q100 has plenty of bass but others say it's lacking. I don't need something to shake my room. Honestly the Bs22's have decent bass but it could be more defined.

 

Last year I purchased a pair of Harbeth P3ESR's for my bedroom setup (Sony UHP-H1 and Marantz 2238B). Coming from big woofer JBL's (4311B, 4425, 4691 Cabaret, etc), I was underwhelmed with the bass from the Harbeths. I don't listen to loud music in the bedroom, but even still, I wanted to hear more bass than what the small Harbeths could cleanly provide, so I ordered an SVS sub. Fills in the bottom just enough so I don't feel I'm listening to "strained" music.

 

I have the Elac ub5's and they have decent bass down to ~45hz. If you can get them away from the wall they come alive. Amazing bass from a 5 inch "woofer". They take some power to drive properly though.

 

Pioneer-killer 8¨woofer :

Reference II Bookshelf Speakers | Klipsch

Amazon.com: Klipsch RB-81 Reference II Two-Way Bookshelf Speaker - Black (Each): Home Audio & Theater

 

But did their Atari ST come with a subwoofer? (Mine didn't...)

 

I tend to agree, but I was about a yard or so from my speakers, hehe

Me too. I find a band I like then go to their label's website. Usually this provides a wellspring of samples to check out.

 

Greetings from Randolph, just down the road from you ... get the sub, fill in the bottom, cleans up the rest. You don't have to turn them up to 11 or make it sound like "one of those cars" as a friend of mine says ... I'm playing Cambridge Soundworks Model 6's with a sub, just enough to fill in ..by the way - pull them out from that wall as much as you can - it's all better including the relations with the neighbors

 

I think subs are totally out of the equation in an apartment, unless you're determined to break your lease. Besides, most apartment rooms would load better with bookshelf units anyway, unless we're talking about a loft conversion or something similar.

 

I've run subs in apartments for almost 20 years. I don't recall having a complaint even once. Y'all must be living in some cheap shtboxes if your neighbors can hear your subs that clearly.

Either that or you're playing Disaster Area concerts at full volume...

 

Then I guess it depends on the apartment and how well the building was constructed. I live in an apartment and I have a REL B2 right in the middle of the living room and it's used quite a lot. Never had a complaint.

That's my setup in the study and honestly I can't say that I experience any lack in the bass department with the LS50.

 

When I initially replied to this thread, I didn't realize "apartment living" was part of the challenge. That said, I lived in one apartment or another for 20 years. Each time, I had a home theater 5.1 setup. Each time, I had no problem with a sub. That said, apartment living isn' about NEVER hearing your neighbors, or them hearing you... it's about courtesy. To me, that meant never using the sub past 9PM on a weeknight, and later on the weekends. Always worked out just fine for me. That said, YMMV. Every building and every neighbor are different

And I couldn't disagree more, respectfully, with the concept that a 2 channel setup with bookshelf speakers, is somehow made blasphemous by the addition of a sub. I just fundamentally disagree.

There are all types of factors, not the least of which is what one as an individual enjoys hearing.

I like some thump in my hip hop. Less in my classic rock. A sub affords me the ability to dial up the bass form 0-100, and everywhere in between. That is my take, and like the counterpoint, neither is "correct". It's subjective. That, to me, is the "correct" answer.

 

+1!

 

So the difference between the Harbeth P3ESR and Monitor 40.2 is just obnoxious bling?

 

I disagree too but in all fairness if you are particular about sound quality, it really isn't so easy to add a subwoofer such that all it does is complement your main speakers with some low end extension and not call attention to itself- as a distraction to the sound.
It can be done and the results are spectacular but it takes effort- beginning with careful selection of the right sub for the job.

 

Doesn't that monitor between your LS50's destroy the imaging ? I would think that would sound better with those speakers pulled out further. I also use a sub in an apartment but I have the sub set at a low volume.

 

Nope. Imaging is fine, surprisingly. Maybe the monitor is acoustically transparent or I managed to be lucky for once and sit just where it doesn't restrict anything.

Actually I prefer lately to listen to music in the study and not the living room because I really like the combination of the TEAC amplifier and KEF speakers for desktop audio.

 

They are seen in different parts of Vermont but the Northeast Kingdom is probably the VT moose hotspot.

 

This all depends on the quality of your main front speakers really, a good pair of fronts will eliminate the need for more bass. A lot of people think adding a sub will magically improve everything, most cases this is not true. modern speakers now sound amazing and im a big fan of wharfedale speakers, you get a lot of sound for little money, even my little 9.1's rattle the living room with rich creamy deep basslines

 

True with good recordings. Anemic records will benefit from a sub. I don't even turn mine on if the recording has good bootom end.