Are Movies Too Dark? (Roger Ebert editorial on incorrectly projected movies)*

LOL

 

2K images can look fantastic. Avatar was all 2K, and so were many hundreds of successful, award-winning films released over the past 10 years. Resolution is not the issue; exposure range is far more important, in my opinion.

Note also that all movies that go out to film routinely get uprezzed to 4K for laser recording. Also, the visible differences between 2K and 4K are miniscule -- my bet is less than 5% at best. And in most movies, the DP has tons of diffusion on the lights and lenses to reduce resolution. For many actors and actresses of a certain age, sharpness is not their friend.

 

They might be squeezing all the hours they can out of the lamps - they lose a lot of brightness when they hit about the mid-point of their 'rated' life expectancy.

 

But it shouldn't be brighter if both 2D and 3D are projected correctly.

Some of the criticism of 3D here reminds me of the complaints of mp3 by those who rip at the wrong settings and then complain about how bad it sounds.

 

Yeah, at my local theatre, the sound is routinely out during the previews, and sometimes into the beginning of the feature itself. Somebody has to get up and go to the popcorn counter and complain before it gets turned on.

The state of movies and movie-going brings out the grumpy old man in me.

 

I just figured when I went to the movies to watch a film, and it was dark, that it was suppose to look that way. Who knew?

 

meh... I go to two movies a year. I much prefer watching films on my 50" plasma at home. Perfect seats, can pause to pee, costs $2 for me and wife vs. $40 (for tickets and snacks), volume is always what I want, no idiots texting every five minutes, really I have no desire to go to movies any more.

 

For me, I do not mind if a 'dark' movie is made every now and again. I would not wish to see every movie appear 'dark'....

 

On Neil Young's new site (video)
he says DVD sounds better than cd.
He mentions that MP3 sound....... sucks.

 

2k = 2000 dollars

Hi Vidiot..meant economics.

But thanks for the info !

 

Me too, brother . . . The one I notice most often is that no one dims the lights when the movie starts. I actually become a grumpy old man at that moment -- I sit in my chair and shout, "Dim the lights!"

 

I'm getting to that point. So far this year the only trips I've taken to the theater were for the Philly Film Festival. I figured there was some cool stuff there that might not show up on DVD.

 

Here's Sony's reply regarding this issue: http://www.engadget.com/2011/05/26/sony-stands-behind-its-digital-projectors-claims-the-only-thing/

 

Interesting comment in the Press Release:

If the system is setup for 4.5fL (studio recommended) in 3D, it will play 2D content at about 14fl without glasses and filters, which falls well within the SMPTE spec of 14fL +/- 3flL. RealD filters for Sony systems only reduce the light by about 20%, because light out of the Sony projector is already polarized, unlike our competitors.

At least they're admitting that a "normal" 3D image is 4.5fL, which is only 1/3 as bright as a regular 2D movie. This is what I've been saying for years: that 3D movies are less than half as bright as a regular film.

Hopefully, this will kick Sony's butt in terms of making it easier to remove the 3D assemblies when they're not needed. Believe me, as a mastering engineer, I can tell you that we work our fannies off for every pixel of information that gets on the screen, and sometimes struggle with really minute changes. If the projector is suddenly 3fL darker (a loss of about 20%), this will have a huge effect on the picture quality -- crushing dark images, making bright scenes look a little muddier, even making colors less vivid. 3 foot-lamberts may not sound like a lot, but trust me, that's a lot of damage on a 20' screen.

 

The worst "dark-offender" movie I've seen is The Cook, The Theif, His Wife and Her Lover. Sat in near total darkness during much of that film way back in 1989. Great movie, though.

 

I can remember back around 1983, there was a horror film, The Keep, which was slammed by critics as being "the darkest film ever made." I think the story was, director Michael Mann was reportedly unhappy with the quality of the creature special effects, so he had the lab darken those shots to try to hide the bad effects work. It got awful reviews on Laserdisc. The movie did so badly, it has yet to get released on DVD (one of many "lost Paramount titles").

 

I'm disappointed with the darkness of many films, but there are scenes that play in shadows.

3D has been lost on me. I still say it won't catch on until it becomes the equivalent of holography. Meaning no glasses. I know it's beyond our current reach, but I'm certain it will come. Then it gets a fair test.

 

haha I remember watching that and thinking exactly that is was EXTREMELY dark. It was dark to the point of not being able to easily follow what was going on.

 

A tech post made to Ebert's page (for those keeping score):

"Just so everyone knows, looking back at the projector and seeing twin beams of light does NOT automatically mean it's a Sony projector with a 3D lens. There are other systems that create two beams of light such as some other versions of Real D and Digital IMAX.

Here with input of some technician friends I have put together a summary of
what happens when 2D is shown in a theatre equipped for 3D with the various systems in use today:

Real D with the simple "Z Screen" in front of the lens: Easily moved out of
the way for 2D.

Real D using the XL or XLW optics used for larger screens: This can be
removed or slid out of the way for 2D. There is even a device that will
move it automatically. However, even if left in place when turned off it
decreases brightness just a little.

Real D using the split field lens (only on Sony projectors): Generally
requires a technician to remove and replace BUT the polarizing filters can
be removed and replaced by theatre staff---if company policy allows it.
Removing them increases brightness on 2D shows.

Master Image 3D: This is a spinning filter wheel in front of the lens and
will move down out of the way for 2D.

XPand 3D: This system uses LCD shutter glasses so the correct eye sees
only the proper frames which the projector is interleaving. 2D
presentations project normally and there is no dimming of the 2D picture.
There are no filters except the shutter glasses which you won't be wearing
for 2D.

Dolby 3D: A small filter wheel inside the digital projector moves out of
the way for 2D which then projects normally.

True Film IMAX: 2D shows run on one projector as usual. No change in
brightness.

Digital IMAX aka Fake IMAX or LieMAX: This system uses two separate
projectors side by side. When running 2D, the polarizing filters move out
of the way automatically. Both projectors are still in use for 2D
presentations so there will still be twin beams of light.

Technicolor Film 3D: The 3D lens is removed from the film projector and a
regular lens put in. 2D movies are run normally.

A very small number of theatres use twin digital projectors and simple
polarizers ala Digital IMAX. Rare because having two projectors is
expensive. They would remove the polarizing filters and project a 2D movie
on one projector unless they need to utilize both for added brightness. "

Derek

 

That is true: Some of the fake-Imax theaters are using "stacked" digital projectors to bump up the brightness. This can actually look really good, when the projectors are very closely aligned. But these won't look dark -- technically, they could be a lot brighter than the normal 14fL SMPTE level.

 

I think most movies are too dark from scratch 1 Esp. those with special effects - to mask the bad state of many of those effects they place them at night or in the shadow of a dark forest, a cellar etc.
The worst offender was Armaggeddeon though.
At that poor lit lightning I always fall asleep.
Well used to, nowadays the deafening sound pressure keeps me from falling asleep (and attending a movie since the first chapter of Lord Of The Rings....the clapping of those horses still scare me when I think about that..
I actually left the place after half of the movie...because of that terrible noise.
Before that I saw Trainspotting , which has been the last movie I enjoyed watching (actually went twice ).

 

I seem to recall that back in the dark ages in NJ (mid late 60s) a projectionist
was well paid union job.

 

They most likely would have been -- in the last several years though their numbers have dwindled.

 

Now, the 16-year-old high school ***** who's selling Jujubes and burning the popcorn in the lobby is the guy who kickstarts the projector every so often. It's a wonder there's any picture and sound at all in theaters, they get so little attention from technically-qualified people.