Article on modern "Hot" Recording by Bob Katz

Discussion in 'Music Corner' started by KLM, May 18, 2002.

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  1. KLM

    KLM Senior Member Thread Starter

    Below, find a link to a several page article by Bob Katz about music and film recording and some of the problems of the growing trend towards "Hot" recordings with lots of compression. It gets a little technical at times but is worth a read.

    Why don't more people stand up and stop this insanity when it come to recording new music. Check it out (you'll need adobe pdf software to view it):


    Click here to download the pdf document [fixed link - HZ]

    For additional reading go here:

    http://georgegraham.com/compress.html

    As we have discussed in the forum before, this is definitely the way of a lot of rock recordings these days and its sad.
     
  2. BradOlson

    BradOlson Country/Christian Music Maven

    Great article.
     
  3. Steve Hoffman

    Steve Hoffman Your host Your Host

    Some of this article should be commited to memory!

    Required reading for all of us Forum members.

    Everyone should at least skim it, so we are all on the same page, eh?
     
  4. MagicAlex

    MagicAlex Gort Emeritus

    Location:
    Atlanta, GA
    Steve, will there be a test? :D
     
  5. Steve Hoffman

    Steve Hoffman Your host Your Host

    Well, maybe the next time you buy a "remastered" CD....
     
  6. Dave

    Dave Esoteric Audio Research Specialistâ„¢

    Location:
    B.C.
    That should be a mandatory read for all new members.

    Anything you can add Steve as you were there from cd's birth?
     
  7. Grant

    Grant Life is a rock, but the radio rolled me!

    The second link doesn't work either.
     
  8. Andrew

    Andrew Chairman of the Bored

    Took about a minute to load, but the first link worked A-OK for me.
    Comment about the article: I agree with it, but most of the general public doesn't seem to care. Bring up this subject and watch people's eyes glaze over.
     
  9. BradOlson

    BradOlson Country/Christian Music Maven

    And this is the reason why I don't like the actual sound quality of Ricky Martin and other current top 40 recordings. Bob Katz and George Graham know what they are talking about.
     
  10. Tullman

    Tullman Senior Member

    Location:
    Boston MA
    These articles explain what we've all been hearing. I like the idea of having a standard system for engineers to follow.

    Truly, isn't the reason for the high compression and hot levels the use of cheap car stereos, boom boxes, and cheap desk top stereos? I suppose the majority of people are using the afformentioned equipment and us audiophiles are being left out in the cold.
     
  11. BradOlson

    BradOlson Country/Christian Music Maven

    Even though I do use a desktop stereo, it does let me know if the sound quality sounds decent or if it sounds too hot as it does have VU meters plus I am able to set the EQ.
     
  12. Holy Zoo

    Holy Zoo Gort (Retired) :-)

    Location:
    Santa Cruz
    The second link works for me... can you try again?
     
  13. Bob Lovely

    Bob Lovely Super Gort In Memoriam


    All,

    I agree with Steve very much...required reading! In many ways refreshing because I record in an analog domain using a reel recorder with VU's but also disconcerting because I primarily record from digitial sources....."stop the madness" seems like the right way to describe a lot of the "remastering" we hear!

    Bob
     
  14. BradOlson

    BradOlson Country/Christian Music Maven

    I only used top 40 music as an example although I do not like to listen to a huge percentage today's top 40 popular music at all including the Mr. Martin mentioned.
     
  15. Dob

    Dob New Member

    Location:
    Detroit
    Keep in mind that many of the classic records we know and love have been processed to sound "hot". In the pursuit of the "grab the listener" hit record, hi-fi sound can get trampled. Obviously, this approach has paid off enough times that labels keep trying it, as they have for decades.

    Electric guitar players know that "hi-fi" sound, when used to describe guitar tone, is taken as an insult. It means "cold, sterile, flat, too detailed, uninvolving". Most famous guitar effects use processing that is the very antithesis of hi-fi - heavy compression, radical EQ, tons of distortion. There is only one rule - does it sound compelling? Some artists process everything, including vocals, and haven't the slightest interest in "breath of life" sound. Again, following one rule.

    For new recordings, "hot" processing isn't normally an issue for me - I accept the sound for what it is. As an example, take Ricky Martin (please). Whether or not I enjoy his records depends much more on this voice, lyrics, arrangements, etc., than the level of compression. I never say, "Gee, I'm not sure if I like this record - it's so processed!". I'm a MUSIC fan first, hi-fi fan second. I would assume that 99.9% of Ricky's fans don't notice/care about the processing, and if given a choice between the "hot" version and the "hi-fi" version...

    For remastered recordings, the sound quality is paramount (why buy it otherwise), and while I like flat transfers, I don't automatically condemn processing. Occasionally I do my own processing/remastering, and the engineer may have already done things to my liking. If I don't like the result (usually), the processing is much harder to undo (as Steve has pointed out), and that is why I prefer flat transfers.

    While it is disturbing that so many engineers are jumping on the processing bandwagon, there is hope. First, many engineers are familiar with good sound (survey in the article) and they probably realize this is just a gimmick. Second, much of this processed music sucks anyway.
     
  16. BradOlson

    BradOlson Country/Christian Music Maven

    I do not like the voices, arrangements, the lyrics, the music, etc. at all on such stuff as Ricky Martin, Britney Spears, etc.
     
  17. Grant

    Grant Life is a rock, but the radio rolled me!

    Look at any ad for Best Buy and Circuit City. They pass those gaudy-looking bookshelf/boombox hybrids as "stereo systems". They are compact, cheap, and what the majority of casual listeners seem to buy and prefer after the home theater system-in-a-box deals. Long gone are the days when most people lust after big, component systems. Now they want those tiny satalite 5 channel speaker setups with the subwoofer that is turned up too loud.

    No one cares about what the audiophile wants. It's too much trouble and expense to please them. They are never quite satisfied, anyway. Most don't buy the music they sell to the kids anyway, so why make the recordings sound good? They have to make the folks who want loud, EQed, and compressed sound happy. That's their mindset.

    I will never find The Isley Brothers on 180-gram virgin vinyl, because most audiophiles aren't interested in it. So, I have my choice of crappy vinyl, or the "remasterd" CD. What are most fans of their music going to pick if they have to buy it? The CD.

    See, it's all about disposable income and priorities. Most people have other things they would rather spend money on. Many pepole just don't have the money it takes to get into the "high-end" sound. It probably hurts to be a music lover with cash to blow.
     
  18. BradOlson

    BradOlson Country/Christian Music Maven

    Here's Best Buy's pitch on just the type of stereo system the casual listener prefers:

    The floor is for dancing, not your stereo system
    Save your floor space with one of our bookshelf compact systems. You get the high-quality sound system you crave in the bookshelf size you need. Sweet-sounding simplicity: Who could ask for anything more?
     
  19. Metralla

    Metralla Joined Jan 13, 2002

    Location:
    San Jose, CA
    Well I have 3+3 on SACD and I love it. I'm a card-carrying audiophile; more so than a rock music completist or collector. Many audiophiles have a far broader taste in music than you appear to credit them.

    Regards,
    Metralla
     
  20. trhunnicutt

    trhunnicutt Member

    Location:
    San Jose, CA
    Grant,

    FYI. From the RedTrumpet web-site.

    LP Between The Sheets
    The Isley Brothers
    Columbia 38674-H
    180 Gram In
    Stock $12.99

    LP 3 + 3
    The Isley Brothers
    Columbia / T-Neck 32453H
    180 Gram In
    Stock $12.99

    LP The Isley Brothers Greatest Hits
    The Isley Brothers
    T-Neck 39240H
    180 Gram In
    Stock $12.99

    The Between the Sheets and Greatest Hits are actually quite good, considering that they may or may not have used first generation masters. Don't know how the SACD may sound. The vinyl is thick and quiet.

    I do agree, however, that many audiophile re-issue COMPANIES do not reissue soul or r&b as standard practice in proportion to other genres. I think it is short-sighted. There are more of us soul lovers than you would believe.
     
  21. trhunnicutt

    trhunnicutt Member

    Location:
    San Jose, CA
    Great articles. Thanks for the post.

    Tom H
     
  22. Beagle

    Beagle Senior Member

    Location:
    Ottawa
    I printed it off. Great article.
     
  23. Grant

    Grant Life is a rock, but the radio rolled me!

    Eh, not judging from any message board or newsgroup or magazine i've ever seen, or most audiophile I have spoken to...but I have not met every audiophile!:D
     
  24. Grant

    Grant Life is a rock, but the radio rolled me!

    Thanks for the tip, but "Between The Sheets" was a worthless title to make vinyl out of, IMO!

    BTW, my use of the Isley Brothers was just an example. DCC did try Al Green but it didn't sell too well, from what I understand.

    Look, i'm not pushing the issue guys, I just made the comment amongst others.:) I do hope the industry cats reading this take notice. It's really hard to get through to them.
     
  25. Grant

    Grant Life is a rock, but the radio rolled me!

    The second link finally works now. I will have something to read today on my day off!
     
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