Asia: The John Payne years

Discussion in 'Music Corner' started by Musician95616, Jun 2, 2016.

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  1. zen

    zen Senior Member

    When John Payne recorded with Downes (for those 15 years), they never had the same lineup from album to album.
    Not so much a true band, but a Downes/Payne project under the ASIA banner.

    When the original lineup reformed and decided to record a reunion album; I was back on board. Great results!!
     
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  2. walrus

    walrus Staring into nothing

    Location:
    Nashville
    I liked the Payne stuff when I was first discovering it in my college days...I liked that much of it (Arena and Aura, particularly) had a different flavor, and liked how Aura incorporated other musicians who I found interesting. But I haven't really felt compelled to revisit those records in many years, so maybe they weren't as good as I thought they were in my early 20's.

    Curious about the rarities you mentioned...the acoustic gig sounds interesting, and I'm curious about the demos. (I recall something going around the net during the time of Aura that had some extra tracks including "Bad Asteroid," I think I still have mp3's of it somewhere)
     
  3. Galley

    Galley Forum Resident

    I tweeted about my preference of John Payne fronting Asia on the tour with Journey, and was quickly reminded that it was the estate of John Wetton who chose Billy Sherwood. His vocal abilities were certainly lacking in concert.
     
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  4. BrucePadgett

    BrucePadgett Forum Resident

    I too have wondered about Payne’s availability. He did terrific work with Downes before, so why not again? Unless Wetton’s estate has veto power as a co-owner of the Asia trademark, I suppose.
     
  5. carlwm

    carlwm Forum Resident

    Location:
    wales
    You may well be right. However, Wetton & Downes had already built bridges & were working together by the time the film came out & from there, I reckon it's only a small step from Icon to Asia.

    As to the different incarnations of the band, I dearly love the first three albums and regard the reunion albums as a very happy surprise (even Gravitas, with young Sam!) and JW will always be my favourite Asia vocalist but all of the Payne discs are excellent in their own right. Very different but chock full of great songs nonetheless.

    Got to give a big thumbs up for the the three Icon albums as well. Just brilliant!
     
  6. squonkduke

    squonkduke Forum Resident

    Location:
    Roma, Italy
    Yes, the Armada 1 CD includes a live version of Bad Asteroid. the other 2 tracks from that promo CD are Never The Way and Innocence.
    They were both outtakes from the Aura sessions, and in my opinion they should have been on the album which includes some weaker filler material.
    That EP was part of a fan club subscription which only lasted a couple of years.
    You can listen to them on youtube.
    The live acoustic performance was only Downes/Payne from an unidentified american venue. It should have been some local pub or something as you can clearly hear the people in the audience were very few. Anyway, that one is a legit in-house soundboard recording. I strongly believe it was a test pressing for a possible Armada 3 release or something, but it ultimately remained unissued.
    The november 2003 demos CD is another in-house test release with early versions of 3 songs that later appeared on Silent Nation. They are fully developed songs but very different from their final versions.
     
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  7. squonkduke

    squonkduke Forum Resident

    Location:
    Roma, Italy
    Some pics...

    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
     
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  8. JamesLord

    JamesLord Forum Resident

    Location:
    UK
    Actually I would. My favourite is ASTRA by some margin. <puts on flame retardant suit>
     
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  9. Musician95616

    Musician95616 Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Location:
    Woodland, Ca
    "Favorite" I can understand. But their best album?
     
  10. squonkduke

    squonkduke Forum Resident

    Location:
    Roma, Italy
    Who is the judge that establishes what's best and what's worst?
    Who are the jurors?
    In art territory everything is subjective, nothing is objective.
    Just to confirm that, my favourite Asia album is Alpha.
     
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  11. Jeremy Holiday

    Jeremy Holiday Forum Resident

    Location:
    New York
    Great full band live version of Bad Asteroid (with Guthrie Govan and Chris Slade) on the "America - Live in the USA" 2 CD and DVD. Very groovy fusion track.
     
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  12. Runicen

    Runicen Forum Resident

    Sherwood definitely seemed a poor choice after witnessing the shambolic tribute to Wetton played by Howe's Yes a year or so back. He was barely keeping up and he wasn't even singing on that one other than harmony.

    By comparison, what I've heard of Payne (exclusively limited to the Silent Nation album) showed that he could do a reasonable Wetton when pressed, but also had his own sound.
     
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  13. altaeria

    altaeria Forum Resident

    I read some quote from John Payne awhile ago
    where he mentioned he is a bit disappointed by his vocals on the AURA album because the producer had him sing “smoother” than his natural tendencies.

    Personally, I prefer his vocals on that particular album because of that approach. My biggest gripe with AQUA is Payne’s lite-metal vocals, especially on “A Far Cry” (which otherwise would’ve been a classic Asia track).
     
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  14. NorthNY Mark

    NorthNY Mark Forum Resident

    Location:
    Canton, NY, USA
    Same here.
     
  15. NorthNY Mark

    NorthNY Mark Forum Resident

    Location:
    Canton, NY, USA
    While I haven't heard Aura or Silent Nation, overall I find Payne's vocal style to be a terrible match for Asia. While I'm sure he is a fine singer in the pop-metal genre, that is just not what I want Asia associated with. I understood the desire for a singer who didn't sound like a Wetton clone (not that I've ever heard anyone who sounds much like him), but to me, it was a change in an embarrassing direction. There were a few good songs on those albums, but ruined for me by all the groaning and grunting, not to mention lyrics about bad boys and military men.

    I'm not sure Billy Sherwood has the vocal ability to stand in for Wetton, but (IMHO) Payne should not be considered--his style fits with another genre entirely, and there was bad blood between him and Wetton. It would be disrespectful.
     
  16. Musician95616

    Musician95616 Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Location:
    Woodland, Ca
    Here's another bass-playing singer to contemplate: Robert Berry.

    I like his voice, he's a songwriter/producer, played with Palmer in 3 with Keith Emerson, and also worked with Steve Howe (after Steve Hackett left GTR).
     
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  17. zen

    zen Senior Member

    Great choice! I would have preferred Robert Berry on the last Asia/Journey tours. I just couldn't bring myself to listen to Billy Sherwood as the lead singer.
     
  18. evillouie

    evillouie Forum Resident

    Location:
    Toledo
    After John Wetton passed away, Downes said that they were pretty far along in the making of the next Asia album at the time of John's death, and that he wants to finish it one day as a memorial to him. Also, Carl Palmer said that he was going to leave Asia after that tour with Journey because he felt like he was being sidelined by the Wetton-Downes partnership and was just a session player for them. But after Wetton's passing he said that he would remain on board to work on the final Asia album along with Downes.

    So, it sounds like if and when they finish those recordings, Palmer will be gone and it would just be Downes and Sam Coulson. At that point, I would think they should close the door on Asia out of respect for John Wetton. If for some reason Downes wants to reconcile and reconnect with John Payne in the future, they should call their collaboration something else. Maybe he could become the new keyboard player for Dukes Of The Orient? Who knows...
     
  19. gojikranz

    gojikranz Forum Resident

    Location:
    Sacramento
    would be pretty awesome to see Robert Berry in the role, hell they could throw some 3 songs in the set as a tribute to emerson as well.

    hope for the new album they can get steve howe in for some playing would be nice to get the whole band on some tracks.
     
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  20. walrus

    walrus Staring into nothing

    Location:
    Nashville
    Billy is a talented musician, but he's not a compelling lead vocalist at all.
     
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  21. walrus

    walrus Staring into nothing

    Location:
    Nashville
    I agree with all of this...Aura are Payne's best vocals for sure.
     
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  22. walrus

    walrus Staring into nothing

    Location:
    Nashville
    Ah. I have the first one you mention as low-bitrate mp3's that someone probably sent me 15 years ago and I've somehow never lost track of. "Never The Way" is a good tune for sure.

    Thanks for the information!
     
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  23. Rufus rag

    Rufus rag Forum Resident

    Location:
    UK
    Robert Berry has recently formed some sort of supergroup (forget their name) and released a CD! Keep meaning to check it out, big fan here!
    If anybody's heared it I would appreciate their opinions !
     
  24. walrus

    walrus Staring into nothing

    Location:
    Nashville
    Random Payne-era thought: "Obsession" and "Heart Of Gold" are two of the best tracks from the Payne-era, and neither ever made a real studio album. Not that it would've made a difference commercially in 1992, but this decision still blows my mind. Aqua is a solid record, but there's any number of tracks that could've been dropped for either of those songs.
     
  25. paradox55

    paradox55 Forum Resident

    Location:
    USA
    Love Asia's version of Ready to Go Home:
     
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