Beach Boys / Brian Wilson Copyright Extension Release Announced for Dec. 17

Discussion in 'Music Corner' started by LeeDempsey, Dec 11, 2013.

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  1. LeeDempsey

    LeeDempsey Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Location:
    North Carolina
    True, publishing royalties are supposed to be paid on these "gray market" releases.

    There are a number of Brian Wilson-related demos that have not been bootlegged. For example, Brian's friend Bob Norberg has several tapes of demos that he and Brian made in their apartment. However, other than the demo for "Little Deuce Coupe" (which appeared on the HAWTHORNE compilation), Norberg hasn't made a copy of these for anyone -- not even Mark Linett. So the mechanism to protect those from public domain release is, essentially, lock-and-key.

    Lee
     
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  2. rstamberg

    rstamberg Senior Member

    Location:
    Riverside, CT
    Thank Christ I'll be dead by then ... maybe.
     
  3. Captain Groovy

    Captain Groovy Senior Member

    Location:
    Freedonia, USA
  4. Pawnmower

    Pawnmower Senior Member

    Location:
    Dearborn, MI
    I personally don't need a comment. They are telling people it's coming out. Brian probably doesn't even remember these songs.
     
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  5. vudicus

    vudicus Forum Resident

    Location:
    UK
    "Thank Him" is one of my favorites, I hope this makes the final track listing.
     
  6. bumbletort

    bumbletort Senior Member

    Location:
    Baltimore, Md, USA
    That title track, though, is the embryo for "Do You Remember?" isn't it? That makes it priceless to me--shows Brian as consummate professional, recycling, perfecting, like his hero Gershwin, for example.
     
  7. LeeDempsey

    LeeDempsey Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Location:
    North Carolina
    Yep, "The Big Beat" is an embryonic "Do You Remember." Point well taken.

    Maybe Mark can figure out a way to autotune Bob and Sheri to get them in the neighborhood of on-pitch!
     
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  8. bumbletort

    bumbletort Senior Member

    Location:
    Baltimore, Md, USA
    Haha! Even a block or two within pitch would be better...

    That whole All Summer Long sessions period fascinates me (well, ALL of the early BBs fascinates me). "Don't Back Down" to my ears is another which had its start earlier--in this case with the Honey's "Hide Go Seek", then evolved through the earlier BBs attempt. It all shows what great songwriters do, what thinking composers are all about. Plus, I have a strong suspicion re "Drive In"--I think that may indeed have originated with the mysterious "Wich Stand". Oh well, seems now I may get the answer to that one in the coming years...
     
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  9. Scope J

    Scope J Senior Member

    Location:
    Michigan
    They should do a vinyls !
     
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  10. LeeDempsey

    LeeDempsey Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Location:
    North Carolina
    I can tell you that Dave Nowlen of The Survivors remembers all of the words, chords, melody, and harmonies to "Wich Stand!"
    And you know the snippet called "Little Surfer Girl" on the 1993 Good Vibrations boxed set? It's actual title was "Teach Me To Surf," and Vickie Kocher (Victoria Hale) remembers the words, melody, and chords! It was supposed to be a duet between her and Bob Norberg.

    It would be fun to have Brian and his band re-create some of these "lost" songs.

    Lee
     
  11. Bellagio

    Bellagio Forum Resident

    Location:
    Southern England
    The wording "Brian Wilson related" is highly advisable as, in some cases, the relation is tenuous in the extreme: as regards the Honeys demos, the link is that in just over a years time he would be married to one of them. Those of us who are exceedingly old will recall the late Derek Bill 'releasing' these five tracks on a Honeys boot in 1978 (with Diane's assistance): as I recall the composer credits were Glantz/D. Rovell, and that two were publishing demos for Haley Mills and The Paris Sisters.

    Removing my picky hat, this is a delightful little surprise, and the tacit prospect of something like this each December for the foreseeable future is enticing.

    Er... except for the SIP discards...
     
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  12. LeeDempsey

    LeeDempsey Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Location:
    North Carolina
    Agree 100% Andrew. I suspect that the inclusion of those tracks may have been the result of some negotiations by the parties involved, who may have agreed to the inclusion of the Brian-produced tracks as long as the non-Brian tracks were also included (so they would also qualify for copyright protection).

    Lee
     
  13. Mylene

    Mylene Senior Member

    It could actually be a bad thing. Since Universal had to get 4th generation cassette copies from fans to make this comp, the fans with tapes closer to the (long lost) masters will be prevented from releasing them in the UK/Europe because of this copyright extension.
     
  14. bumbletort

    bumbletort Senior Member

    Location:
    Baltimore, Md, USA
    Wow! Thanks for this info! I'm frankly obsessed with compositional progressions, especially for people like Brian. Always wondered about that 'little surfer girl' snippet.

    I would love for someone, Brian especially to make some kind of 'record' of these formative songs. There's are nuances in them that will be lost otherwise--they simply can't be captured by music notation. Feel the same way about early Beatle compositions...
     
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  15. Hamhead

    Hamhead The Bear From Delaware

    Some of those are on the Sea Of Tunes CD boxsets, there's still lots of rare (unissued, alternates, and backing) tracks that are on those discs that are not covered on that iTunes set. The Capitol Studios tracks from the "Surfin' Safari" album (County Fair, Little Girl (You're My Miss America), Heads You Win Tails I Lose, Summertime Blues, Cuckoo Clock) which are in stereo are now PD. Some other tracks I see are: The One You Can't Have, I Can See Right Though You, If It Can't Be You, The One You Can't Have which are on the Misc. Tracks 1963 disc.

    Next year, I wonder if the two undoctored 1964 Sacremento shows will see the light of day.
     
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  16. chewy

    chewy Forum Resident

    Location:
    West Coast USA
    the majors cant possibly keep this up year after year. theres just way to much stuff out there. every bootleg of the last 50 yrs couldn't possibly be offically relased in the next 50....
     
  17. felipe

    felipe Forum Resident

    Lee, do you know if the "Thank Him" source will be 1st generation tape or acetate?
     
  18. LeeDempsey

    LeeDempsey Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Location:
    North Carolina
    "The One You Can't Have" - not sure what the EU copyright protection is on the instrumental track of a released take, or the track plus partial vocals. Otherwise some enterprising label would be OOP'ing every single stereo Beatles track and saying that the result is a new performance.
    "I Can See Right Through You" (aka "Go Away Boy") -- good point; since this was intended for The Honeys it would have fit with the rest of the tracks.
    "If It Can't Be You" -- on the set as "I'll Never Love Again" (not sure why the title change, as the copyright registration is for "If It Can't Be You").

    Lee
     
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  19. Driver 8

    Driver 8 Senior Member

    Why can't they continue to do what they're doing: i.e., put this stuff on iTunes or put it out in a limited edition as they've done with the Bob Dylan Copyright Extension releases? What exactly is stopping them? They may even end up making money on this material as the die-hard fans download it from iTunes.

    And if there's something like, say, the Peter and Gordon catalog that they don't want to bother to protect, let the unreleased tracks fall into the public domain.
     
  20. LeeDempsey

    LeeDempsey Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Location:
    North Carolina
    At least the last time I heard, from an acetate. The tape may be in Bob Norberg's possession, but as I mentioned a few posts back, Bob is still not ready to part with his tapes (and not even ready to let someone make a full aural inventory). Mark and Alan had access to the acetate that was purchased at auction on behalf of Brian (from the estate of Dick St. John, of Dick and Dee Dee - speculation is Brian gave it to them to consider recording), but Mark said that the WAV file I provided (which for the life of me I can't remember how I got) produced a better transfer than the de-noised acetate. But the problem is, the WAV file was supposedly from the same acetate! That left Mark wondering if a transfer was made at some point, and then the acetate got damaged. I know that happened with my acetate of "Rabbit's Foot" -- it was in VG+ shape but a little grimy, and an audiophile friend of mine offered to give it a cleaning on his VPI vacuum cleaner. But before I knew what he had done he sprayed a solution of his own concoction on it that had alcohol in it -- and he didn't know that acetates and alcohol don't mix. I could have killed him; it left a swishing sound on every rotation. But I had made 2 or 3 digital transfers with different styli before that, so Mark had multiple files to work with. I still haven't heard the result!

    Lee
     
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  21. guppy270

    guppy270 Forum Resident

    Location:
    Levittown, NY
    I don't mean any disrespect to LeeDempsey at all, but I'm kinda semi-surprised that Capitol is doing this. I can see them "copyright dumping" Beach Boys studio outtakes, such as EMI are doing with the 1963 Beatles outtakes---there would be a big demand for them---but, really, how much money would Capitol be losing if this particular collection of songs went PD? I would think they would appeal to mainly the very hard-core Beach Boys collector. And if they did go public domain, wouldn't it be far more likely that they would appear as free downloads on torrent sites? Has anyone even purchased actual CD-R bootlegs over the last ten years? It just seems like they are going through some hard work (gathering acetates, mastering, etc) for this...
     
  22. rockledge

    rockledge Forum Resident

    Location:
    right here
    I just read today that the Bealtes are going to release some stuff as an album quite soon for the same reason.
    It really is quite absurd that they cannot extend the copyright simply by filing for it again.
    It doesn't make sense to me why it would actually need to be republished by release in order to be protected.
     
  23. Driver 8

    Driver 8 Senior Member

    I believe the idea is "use it or lose it." This stuff has never been officially released. If Capitol wants to prevent it from falling into the public domain, they need to make it available for people to buy and listen to. One would think that serious Beach Boys fans would be happy about this: I've bought previous releases of this nature such as Pet Projects: The Brian Wilson Productions, and I'll buy this. I'm glad the threat of the material falling into the public domain has forced Capitol to put this material out there.
     
  24. rockledge

    rockledge Forum Resident

    Location:
    right here
    Much as I understand that perspective, I still think it is a bit nuts. Intellectual property is still intellectual property.
    The idea that if I copyright something I have to publish it in order for it to stay mine seems a bit loony. It doesn't make sense to me that ownership of something can last for 50 years but on 50 years and one day you can loose it just because you kept it to yourself. That doesn't seem like logical criteria to me.
    That potentially could screw a LOT of people who have willed ownership of intellectual property to their heirs out of something that is rightfully theirs.
    What if, for example, Frank Zappa left a vault full of material that is copyrighted by not yet released, in the hope that it will provide support for his great grandchildren?
    They could lose ownership because his family doesn't put it into public domain before it is financially sound for them to do so?
     
  25. DreadPikathulhu

    DreadPikathulhu Senior Member

    Location:
    Seattle
    I think in the case of Frank Zappa, that vault is secure behind lock and key and the material has never managed to escape. The issue with the Beach Boys and Beatles release is that they've been floating around in collector's circles for decades now.
     
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