Best Phono Stage?

Going to audition the new PH-100 ($900 USD MSRP) from Oracle Audio in the next month or two. It's currently in production and should hit dealers shortly. I want to compare it to the PH-200, which costs almost twice as much.

 

I've had my iPhono up and running for a few months now and love it. I have run my low output Linn Arkiv MC through it and the Ortofon red and blue MM carts. Switching the impedance and gain couldn't be simpler and better thought out. It's also easy to experiment eith impedances as i now understand there isn't always a right number but rather a right range. It's real quiet and clean sounding. Feels like it's not doing anything but amplifying, which is what I like.

 

Couldn't agree more with valvehead on this. A happy marriage between a cartridge and phono stage (or Step Up Transformer) is made by carefully matching the loading characteristics. Get this right and magical things can happen!

 

Agree +1. I think there is more sound to gain from a proper cartridge/phonostage match (and proper alignment of cartridge) then upgrading the table.

 

At the risk of breaking forum etiquette, I have a Dyanvector P75-MKIII I am about to post for sale on AudioGon (I don't have enough of a track record on this form to post to Buy & Sell here, I don't think). The unit is around 6 months old and was used to get me through saving up for an Audio Research Phono Ref 2, which has now replaced the P75. List price for one of these is $895 and I plan to sell it for considerably less than that. If you are interested you can contact me via the forum. Complete with box, paperwork and power supply.

Mods, if this post is inappropriate here please delete it - with my sincere apologies.

 

Another vote for the Lounge Audio LCR MKIII....a bargain at $300

Links to a few reviews on the Lounge LCR
- Tone Audio 995 - http://www.tonepublications.com/review/lounge-audio-phonostage/
- Tone Audio Issue 66 - 995: Sounds That Won't Break the Bank - http://www.tonepublications.com/MAGPDF/TA_066.pdf (Page 103)
- NewRecordDay - Lounge Audio LCR MKII Phono Review - https://www.newrecordday.com/lounge-audio-mkiii-lcr-phono-preamplifier/

Here is a link to Lounge Audio's Website - http://www.loungeaudio.com/#!products/cxf6

 

Regarding the Lounge, It is one of those products that is a genuine product that sounds like it was followed through on the design and put out as a finished product not just a circuit picked out of a book and cranked out in a factory like the others I've tried which just did not sound like they were finished. They were either odd sounding in some aspect or unbalanced or unresolved. I've now run about a dozen different carts through it and my fav combos are a grado (blue in my case), ShureV15III, stanton 881S. The LCR allows the individuality of each come through. I'd like to see people try this because I love vinyl so much I worry young kids might get into vinyl and pick one of the other lesser sounding pres and get a first impression of vinyl as being less than it is. The LCR will give someone a legit experience of what vinyl can be. I hate to suggest it's underpriced but if it where 2x the cost I wouldn't question that and I think of grabbing another just in case! Also, mine changed quite dramatically over the course of a few days of break in so give it some time before you audition critically. And cables matter. I ended up getting a set from the designer that he sells as well

 

Has anyone compared the Vista and the Lounge? Those are two affordable well-loved designs that are often praised.

 

Jolida JD9. You can roll tubes, change out the opamps, variable gain and ohms settings. Sounds great to boot.

 

Has anyone heard the new Phonomena II+? I'm a few months off from actually buying a pre, but the Phonomena is the pack leader based on what I've read around online. Lots of people like the Jolida, but lots of people don't, and lots of people say it needs lots of mods to sound alright/its best (which I'm not really into doing... yet?). I haven't really seen any negatives for the Phonomena, though. Curious if it's worth paying the difference for that + sign or I should just start keeping an eye out for a used II...

Also curious about this Aural Thrills tube amp over at Audiogon: http://app.audiogon.com/listings/ph...eed-2015-05-27-preamplifiers-75042-garland-tx

Seems like a more affordable entry-point for true tubes goodness?

 

Phonomena II is very good, but many people prefer the Lounge and Vista at a lower price. Michael may be using Wima caps in the new version. Don't know for sure. I know he put some in mine and it was a nice improvement.

 

I'd looked at the Lounge, but I'm using a LOMC cart and tacking on an SUT would cut out the savings. Had missed the Vista, though. I'll have to take a look. I'm definitely looking to make a sizable step up from the V-LPS v.1 I'm currently borrowing (in anticipation of one day getting moving up from a DL 103), so if the Vista would be around the same price/performance ratio as the V-LPS, and if the Phonomena's higher price (especially used price) is justified by performance improvements, I'm willing to swing for the latter...

 

People seem to think the Vista is better than the Phonomena II for much less. It can also be customized by swapping out resistors (solderless). Seems to be well designed and very small, and can cover LOMC in one shot. I would not know what to choose between it and the Lounge with an SUT or maybe the Piccolo head amp. Tough call. Phonomena II, as I mentioned, is very good. It has a bunch of capacitance though, which makes it a tough match for the AT MMs.

 

Jupiterboy,

Can you maybe explain how capacitance impacts things? I'm going to be getting back into vinyl and just picked up a Phonomena II, so your comment about it having "a bunch of capacitance" has my interest.

 

Sure. A moving magnet tends to have a high-frequency resonance that can be in the audible range because the MM design has higher inductance than a comparable moving coil design. Capacitance is the sum of the cables connected to your cartridge plus the capacitance of the phono stage. Different MM designs start out with different levels of inductance, so there is not a blanket application of theory. Some cartridges (Shure) like a fair bit, maybe 300 pF or so. Audio-Technica carts tend to like very little, like 100 pF or less. That low number is hard to achieve, but is necessary if you don't want the high frequencies emphasized.

In my case, I had the Phonomena modified to provide 68 pF and 136 pF rather than 200/300, as it is designed. My tonearm wires add another 33 pF, so they are very low. I measured a 1 meter interconnect recently at 350 pF. 100 pF may be more common for inexpensive interconnects.

Hope that helps. Hagerman calc goes into more depth, and shows charts.

http://www.hagtech.com/loading.html

You should be able to find a good cartridge that works with your tonearm and your phono stage, but do put some time in looking at the interactions and you will hear the benefits.

Cheers.

 

Thanks for the info. I'm going to be using a Clearaudio Performance SE table which has the Satisfy Carbom direct-wire arm, and for now am tentatively planning on using a Nagaoka MP-50 cartridge, which is "Moving Permalloy" similar to MM. Hopefully this combination will work well.

 

I don't find inductance specs for this cart, but if it is like this one, more capacitance may make for a more pleasing sound. That is good, because more is easy to get.

http://www.tnt-audio.com/sorgenti/nagaoka_mp11_e.html

 

And yet another vote for the Lounge Audio MKIII.

Let me put it this way. I am an upgrade whore. I just upgraded to the Cronus Magnum 2 by Rogue and I'm already looking at what is beyond that -(this is not a hit on Rogue, this is the finest piece of equipment I have owned, but it just goes to demonstrate the disease I have.) That said, I have never even thought about upgrading the Lounge phono stage, it is that good!

 

Pm sent!

 

this poo poo'ing of MM is a zeitgeist imo. I don't recall this in the 80's and I've never heard any high frequency resonance. I've tried about 6 MC's and 24 MM/MI's and always preferred a good MM for the rock and jazz music I listen to. Maybe classical or some other genre would shine a bit more on MC but I couldn't get a nice rich deep midrange out of the MC's i tried. But all the carts i've tried are under $500 a piece so if your budget is above that who knows, but even then I'm sure there's a high end MM that competes with MC. This idea that MC is a better technology is false, it's just another technology and gives a different sound, the same way a dynamic driver is a different technology than a planar magnetic. Sure the planar does some things better, due to the technology of it, but same goes with dynamic. Every tech has +'s and -'s inherent to them

 

Show me an MC that has the characteristics described (bolded) and I'll buy it. In the meantime you'll have to pry a good MM/MI out of my cold dead hands!

 

I used MM cartridges for many years. MCs sounded a bit too toppy. Switched over to a Dynavector and got hooked. Plenty of midrange richness in my 20xH.

 

I just bought one...should be here in a couple days...

 

Dynavector carts and phono stages are some of the best bang for buck upgrades on the market, as long as you like the characteristics of them.