Blu-Ray/SACD player recommendation needed

Discussion in 'Audio Hardware' started by Joel Shapiro, Sep 18, 2017.

  1. cyclistsb

    cyclistsb Forum Resident

    I'm not sure what mods are available for the 203 but I know the 103/105 have lots of options...however I went down all these roads and found it better to rip SACD to my NAS then stream to a DAC...IMO this is the best route for anyone who doesn't want to deal with physical media and just have music available at the click of a mouse or device.
     
  2. bradman

    bradman Forum Resident

    Location:
    Lexington,KY
    The 1000 has 2ch analog outs and will have Dolby Vision support. Otherwise, the same player, newer model.
     
  3. Litejazz53

    Litejazz53 Enjoying Sparkling Crystal Clear Digital

    That's the thing that manufacturers don't talk much about, the conversion of DSD to PCM before analog. So many of these small inexpensive players say SACD, but it's all coverted to PCM, so they are not getting what they think they are getting DSD all the way until it is converted to analog at the RCA's out, like the Oppo player. If a person is buying a player for it's ability to do DSD, there should be no point of conversion to PCM, unless the user wants to click on the option. Are you sure the Yamaha has no PCM conversion?
     
  4. Brother_Rael

    Brother_Rael Forum Resident

    Location:
    Scottish Borders
    You can select on some players, if you want DSD, PCM, stereo, etc., and set the defaults accordingly.
     
  5. Black Elk

    Black Elk Music Lover

    Location:
    Bay Area, U.S.A.
    I'm just talking about it as a ripper. I have not listened to mine!
     
  6. Joel Shapiro

    Joel Shapiro Active Member Thread Starter

    Last edited: Sep 20, 2017
  7. Tartifless

    Tartifless Forum Resident

    Location:
    France
    From what is read on reviews and hifi websites it does, though the manual does not give any precision about what it does.

    Sometimes i wish all brands would be clear in their manual, the only ones that clearly state what they are doing so far are cambridge and oppo as far as i know (and surely some higher-end manufacturers but i did not purchase their material up to now).
     
  8. Tartifless

    Tartifless Forum Resident

    Location:
    France
    So one would guess that the 1060 does as the manual does not contain this information...

    Just for my information: why is this eliminatory for you ?

    I had an oppo 105D and a cambridge cxu and decided to keep the CXU even though it converts to PCM first.
    I just liked the sound of the CXU better.
     
  9. Tartifless

    Tartifless Forum Resident

    Location:
    France
    Here is the text from the 1060 manual:
    SA-CD audio is output from the analog (ANALOG OUT and BALANCED OUT) jacks. DSD stereo is automatically selected and the converted analog signals are output.

    The output method selection (DSD or PCM) is only valid for HDMI output.

    And page 45 of the manual states that 2 channel DSD is converted to analog when DSD is selected, and that PCMis converted when PCM is selected.

    I guess if the 1060 was acting like the 681 they would have just used the same text in the manual ...
     
  10. Joel Shapiro

    Joel Shapiro Active Member Thread Starter

    I'm buying a player mainly to play SA-CD's, and if it won't do a native DSD conversion, I'm not getting the full impact of SA-CD, as I understand it.
     
  11. Tartifless

    Tartifless Forum Resident

    Location:
    France
    In the end dsd will be converted to analog. Whether this is done directly or through a first pcm conversion does not really degrade anything.
    It's up to each manufacturer to go for a technology/technique that suits best what sound they want to achieve depending on their dac/filters implementation.

    What you should do is compare multiple players with your setup and decide based on your ears.
    It all ends up in the same speakers from a high-res dsd source.
     
  12. Joel Shapiro

    Joel Shapiro Active Member Thread Starter

    I don't have the ability to compare multiple players. I have to go by reviews, threads like this one, and my own gut. I don't want PCM. I wasted too much time and money on CD's in my life. It's DSD/SACD or vinyl for me from now on.
     
    Last edited: Sep 20, 2017
  13. Tartifless

    Tartifless Forum Resident

    Location:
    France
    I don't understand.
    With sacd you get dsd, whatever sa-cd player you choose, and the player will convert it to analog. You will not have cd quality but much better.
    Dsd64 is approx equivalent to pcm 24/96 (more 24/117) actually.

    Moreover most of the sa-cd dsd layers are created from pcm hi-rez masters.

    A good reading here :
    DSD vs. PCM: Myth vs. Truth

    In the end both are just digital format with a different technology but similar results.
     
    Dan Steele and Brother_Rael like this.
  14. Joel Shapiro

    Joel Shapiro Active Member Thread Starter

    I don't believe theories. I believe my ears.
     
    Litejazz53 likes this.
  15. Tartifless

    Tartifless Forum Resident

    Location:
    France
    Then you definitely need to go for a listening session.

    DSD to analog through a 1-bit dac conversion sounds better : this is theory.

    24/192 pcm sounds better : this is theory.

    In the end your ears will tell.

    But one thing is sure, whether the conversion is direct or through pcm does not change the fact that you get hi-rez audio converted to analog.
     
  16. Litejazz53

    Litejazz53 Enjoying Sparkling Crystal Clear Digital

    You are so very correct in regard to the labels putting out DSD that is really PCM, but I really do enjoy digital everything, and if I had my "rathers", I would rather have a DSD product done right, and sure I have some pseudo DSD products, some came from Chesky Records, and they are great, but as you say, not a solid DSD product, but when it is, it's wonderful. PS Audio has really been doing lots of research on building the BEST mousetrap with their Direct Stream DAC. They have a consultant that designed the new DAC, his name is Ted Smith, and he is certainly an engineer's engineer, he thinks at a different level than most people. A standard HP or SABRE DAC was not good enough for him, he had to have a chip that was programmable, and spent years getting it polished. You are so right DSD VS PCM is very complicated. With all said and done, if the music is pure DSD, it's top shelf, and I think you will find many more people gravitating to DSD that is pure, if they are not hoodwinked by the record company, which certainly does happen. Here is Ted discussing DSD, as I said he thinks on a high plane.

     
    Dan Steele likes this.
  17. Brother_Rael

    Brother_Rael Forum Resident

    Location:
    Scottish Borders
    Good luck with that. Maybe MQA is what you really need.
     
    c-eling likes this.
  18. c-eling

    c-eling Forum Resident

    You should be paying more attention to the mastering than format. DSD/SACD don't mean squat if the dynamics from the mastering is compromised.
     
    George P, Bill Mac, gd0 and 1 other person like this.
  19. Brother_Rael

    Brother_Rael Forum Resident

    Location:
    Scottish Borders
    This. Best advice you'll get Joel.
     
    Dax_Frost, Bill Mac and gd0 like this.
  20. Bill Mac

    Bill Mac Forum Resident

    Location:
    So. ME USA
    Excellent advice without a doubt! I have a good size collection of SACDs and have found mastering is far more important than the disc format. I have quite a few CDs that are very well mastered that put some of the SACDs in my collection to shame.
     
    Dan Steele and c-eling like this.
  21. gd0

    gd0 Looney Tunes and Merrie Melodies

    Location:
    Golden Gate
    Then you'd be well advised to make a serious DSD-PCM comparison for yourself. It isn't convenient or easy, but you'd gain considerable insight on a topic which is split right down the middle opinion-wise.

    My result (years ago) was that the two were indistinguishable. On mid-fi equipment, it should be noted. It's reasonable to speculate that a high-resolving, room-treated, big-bucks system may reveal differences. If you have such a starship, sure, pursue DSD if only for the peace of mind that you're passing the most direct signal.

    But yeah, mastering is WAY more important.
     
    prognastycator likes this.
  22. I'd be willing to take those SACDs off your hands if you don't want them any longer.:winkgrin:
     
    c-eling likes this.
  23. Joel Shapiro

    Joel Shapiro Active Member Thread Starter

    You don't quit.
     
  24. Bill Mac

    Bill Mac Forum Resident

    Location:
    So. ME USA
    What a guy! Send me your address and I'll ship them off to you ;).
     
    c-eling likes this.
  25. c-eling

    c-eling Forum Resident

    Man I would of given you a great deal on my entire Gabriel set :laugh:
    Think I have a couple Mode's left and a Aja SHM
    Journey-Escape is a keeper :)
     
    Bill Mac likes this.

Share This Page