"Buzz" from Pro-ject Xpression. Please help

Hello,
I'm aware this is the umpteenth thread on turntable buzz and hum, but I assure I read several threads and haven't come to a solution yet. Any help would thus be appreciated.

I acquired a Pro-ject Xpression equipped with an AT440MLa in 2009. Apart from a negligible hum picked from the cart (especially when it was over the spindle, probably magnetic interference), it has worked very well so far (I did not use it heavily, the cartridge has less than 200 hours). Unfortunately in the past year, a very annoying buzz has chimed in, gradually: it appeared every now and then, it's steadily there now.

In the past few weeks I've decided to take the bull by the horns and played with tonearm, cables and cart in my free time. The turtable is connected to an integrated Marantz amplifier (I have no external preamp). The Marantz is a recent purchase and is not the source of the issue as the buzz was there even with my previous Denon amplifier.

Here's what I noticed.

• The buzz is on both channels.
• The buzz is at a low level (it's definitely there though) but increases a lot when I touch the connection cables to the cart (red and white small cables - see pic) and when I touch the plastic supports of the RCA plugs (red and white plastic supports - see pic). By the way: the small coloured connection cables from toneart to the cart seem very thin to me.
• The buzz has "beats" at about 5 kHz, 10 kHz, 15 kHz and so on (5 kHz interval) - see pic.
• Nothing changes if the motor is on or off (I disconnected the power plug of the turntable).
• The ground wire from turntable to amplifier must be connected. If it's disconnected, a hum generates.

So... What is the issue in your opinion (oxidised cart pins? loose connections to the cart? loose wiring in the arm?) What should I do to try and isolate the issue? I'd like to figure out whether it's something I could solve by myself or should take the turntable to a repair shop.

Willing to provide any other info. Posted some pics.

Thank you very much.
G.

P.S. 1 I don't have a replacement cart but could get one.
P.S. 2 I'll replace the RCA cables moving to double shielded ones as soon as I solve this problem.
P.S. 3 Frequency of power supplies is 50Hz here.

 

It sounds very similar to the problem I had which was the power supply. I detailed my solution at Project Debut Carbon DC – A solution to the noise/hum problem
Hope it's of use to you.

 

I have the exact same hum with my Pro-Ject Debut Carbon. Your description could accurately describe my own problem (I have also a different hum from the motor and another from the integrated but this I can only hear with headphones).

Curious to see if someone has any suggestions.

 

I'm getting mad about this, really. Taking into account some very faint hum that I could live with (no entry level turntable is free from such an issue), this buzz is very annoying and was not there in the beginning. I don't think the cart is the culprit, I'm afraid some of the wiring in the tonearm started to deteriorate...

 

I suspect the same. I broke one of those wires trying to change cartridges once and welded it. Didn't notice that hum before but I can't say for sure it wasn't there so who knows.

 

The good part is that it is not loud at all. I can only hear it if I crank up it much louder than the normal volume I use to hear music.

 

Reminds me of the old doctor joke...

 

Indeed. Probably in spec considering it is average around -85 to -90db, which is actually quite good for a turntable, and many analog devices in general.
-Bill

 

Looking at the noise spectrum, it is most obviously 50hz AC noise, probably induced from powered devices nearby, or even the turntable motor itself, into the arm or interconnect wiring on the turntable. Be sure that the cartridge wire connections are relatively tight. Check to be sure that no power cords run nearby or parallel to the turntable interconnect cables. Think if you have moved any components recently or added a new one or connection to the system. Even new cables or a new power outlet being used. Also check to see if any dimmer switches are in use for lighting or fan controls in the home. That can cause noise in some systems, even if in another room. The good news is that no matter what, the level is very low. We are all surrounded by energy that can create some disruption in some forms, so it's more a case of management than elimination.
-Bill

 

Thank you Bill for your comment.

This is what I thought as well. Not from the turntable motor (the buzz is the same if it's disconnected), but it must be a 50Hz harmonics interference picked from the interconnect wiring somewhere in the tonearm or the cart. I'm convinced the buzz appeared as some connections became gradually loose. I must definitely check all the wire connections, starting from the cart.

I moved the system a month ago (connecting it to another power supply socket in the same room) and nothing changed. I replaced the interconnect cables, which I was sure were the sole culprit (they "rang" when I played with them), but I managed only to reduce the volume of the buzz.

I can definitely detect it in quiet passages, i.e. between songs, probably because of its "ringing" trait. If it was a low frequency hum I probably wouldn't detect it at all, as it would add to the existing background noise, but it "rings" to my ears instead. I agree that it must be managed rather than eliminated, taking its leven below the background noise floor.

By the way the good news is that, thanks to this issue, I realised the cart needs being re-aligned...

 

As far as I understand, you replaced the PSU of your turntable. I would probably benefit too in more general terms, but regarding the specific buzz I described, the turntable picks it even when it is disconnected from the power supply.

 

So are you saying that the switch is in the off position, or have you physically unplugged the power supply from the wall? Not from the back of the table, but from the wall? Try that if you haven't. Also start unplugging other devices one at a time if that isn't it until you hear the noise stop. I guess you have also tried it without the tables interconnects plugged into the amp to isolate the phono stage and see if that is picking it up by itself? Sometimes in moving gear, it can be spaced closer than before and cause interference. I'd also try disconnecting the soundcard output cables from their input to the amplifier.
-Bill

 

Yes, the tonearm wire is extremely thin and flexible (rubbery almost). I believe it has to be so it can make it down past the pivot area into the tonearm base. Any thicker and it might interfere with the ability for the tonearm to pivot.

Since the harmonic buzz is in both channels, it seems like a grounding issue versus a weak left or right channel connection. Using a wooden toothpick and gently nudging each of the 4 wires and also the black tonearm grounding wire by your cartridge, does the buzz ever quickly disappear? Probably not, but, figured it worth a try since there might be a chance the connection between wire and connector pins became weak (perhaps from changing cartridges or moving it around when aligning it) or, grounding wire connection at that tonearm screw became weak.

Or, if you move the table to a totally different location, is buzzing the same? (again, just something to try).

My old Project made Music Hall MMF 2.1 tonearm has attached RCA cables. From the cartridge, the wires travel through the arm tube down past the pivot point into the tonearm base. Inside the tonearm base are individual terminals for each of the tonearm wires where each is soldered. The RCA cable & ground wire are also soldered here. Since your table has a RCA connector box, perhaps the wires go down the pivot point straight into the RCA connector box? Maybe the tonearm grounding wire has a weak connection in the RCA connector box?

Seems like a reputable repair shop should be able to find the cause of the problem.

 

It is an Xpression III (and it looks like it), I have the same table, and I had the same hum. It was related to my cart connections. It was strongest when I swapped out my Ortofon 2M Blue cart for the 2M Silver cart. It was pretty bad with that cart and would get worse if I aligned the cart or did anything with the tonearm. It disappeared when I swapped it out for a 2M Bronze cart. The hum has been gone for the month I have had the Bronze cart in.

My conclusion was that it was a poor installation of the Silver cart on my end, but it may have been the cart itself.

 

Thank you again for your comments.

I tried what @KT88 and @WestGrooving suggested but didn't manage to isolate and replicate the issue. I unplugged the table and all the devices connected to my amplifier but the buzz is still there. Nudging the wires and moving the cart (I had disconnected it from the tonearm, see pics) there's no substantial change in the buzz, the real difference is when I touch the small wires (with my knees touching the floor): the buzz becomes higher. If I touch the RCA plugs the effect is the same, so I'd say they are not properly grounded. If I disconnect the RCA plugs from the turntable, the buzz becomes more evident but I suppose it is normal. I have a brand new Marantz PM6006 by the way and the buzz was exactly the same with my old Denon, so I would exclude the possibility the issue originates from the Marantz phono stage.
Maybe the tonearm grounding wire has actually a weak connection in the RCA connector box, but I'd need to disassemble it and check.

Yes, it is an Xpression III. To check if the AT440MLa is the source of the issue I would have to replace the cart and check... but I don't have a replacement cart at present.

I'm quite sure this is a grounding issue but I will have to investigate further. Thank you for your suggestions so far.

 

So if you really have disconnected every input from the amplifier, and the buzz is still there, then you have isolated the issue to the phonostage in the amplifier. Now that doesn't mean that there is not an additional, external source that is on the power line and finding its way into the amplifier via the power cord or through the air. If it is through the air, it must have proximity to the amp. If it is through the power line, it could be anywhere in the home. Personally, I think that you have just discovered the noise floor of your phono section. Since it doesn't bother you when in actual use, my advice is to forget about it so that you can enjoy your music.
-Bill

 

Let me explain. I disconnected all external sources and my amplifier did not pick the buzz from the phono input (it picked just a neutral hum). The harmonics buzz appeared when I connected the RCA cables to the phono stage of the amplifier, which is normal I guess, as the cables act like antennas. Then when I connect the RCA plugs to the turntable I expect the buzz to be pushed around the noise floor with a proper grounding system. And I think the issue arises as the grounding system in the turntable does not work correctly, but I don't know if the reason is related to the cart or the connections across the tonearm or the RCA connector box as @WestGrooving suggested (the latter is what I suspect).

Contrary to the old doctor joke, it actually bothers me...

 

Is there a built-in black ground wire coming out of your Turntable's RCA Connector Box? If so, did you make sure to connect that to your amplifier's phono Input Ground Post? If so, and there's still buzzing, it would seem that the tonearm ground wire (that's screwed to your tonearm behind your cartridge) isn't making it to your amplifer's Phono Input Ground Post.

One quick check I would do is with a little VoltMeter with a 'continuity' check function. Touch one meter probe to the tonearm ground wire screw (right behind the cartridge) and touch the other probe to your turntable's built in ground wire. The meter should beep. If silent, there would be a broken ground wire connection somewhere in between.

Otherwise, I would probably find a long piece of thin wire and attach one end to that tonearm ground wire screw (right behind the cartridge) and the other end to your amp's phono input terminal grounding post just to test if that 'kills the buzz'. If so, then it would seem you have a break in your Turntable's ground wire path. Don't forget the remove the test wire from the tonearm ground wire screw.

 

I have experienced this buzz on my Debut Carbon DC (no longer have) and on my 1Xpression Carbon Classic DC. I have learned, in my case, it seems to be generated by my LED lighting. I determined this quite by accident. While trying to fix the dreaded motor hum of the Debut, I had everything dead quiet, I thought, next day, the noise was back!! Seems the new LED pot lights in my kitchen are noisy. If I turn them off all is good, by the way, they are on a different circuit. This brings me to my latest purchase, the 1Xpression Carbon Classic DC. It had the buzz when I used the supplied RCA interconnects, but when I switch those for, of all things, OMEGA PLATINUM VIDEO interconnects, the buzz was greatly reduces. These interconnect are double shielded with foil and braided shielding. I also made my own ground wire by first crimping on the connectors and than soldering them. This also proved to be an improvement. Now if I could just get rid of the mechanical Motor vibration hum. By the way try this link, this fellow gives a good explanation of the ground and shielding problem found on the Debut.

The Objective Turntable

 

I have a 1Xpression. Make sure you separate the grounding wire from the output wires. The grounding wire on my setup came literally molded between the output wires. After I peeled it off the buzz went away. You may be experiencing a different problem though.

 

I have also found 1 other source of motor hum, and that is through the belt from the motor into the platter. I found this out by trying to get rid of motor noise from the motor into the plinth. I got everything dead quiet with the belt off stylus sitting on a record, motor running, all was good. I installed the belt, put everything back together, turned it on set the stylus on the lead in grove, guess what, hum. Damn How do I isolate the vibration through the belt? Any ideas

 

Had a very similar problem myself with a Pr0-ject Expression III and an Ortofon Quintet Red. My Project is one of the older AC models, not sure if this would work with the newer DC ones.

Remove the platter, belt etc. Re-install the two transit screws that came with the TT. Re-assemble the TT and test.

Not entirely sure why it worked for me, but there are a few people on different forums who swear by this on the older AC TT's

Hope it helps.

 

I have the same problem on my 1xpression carbon, except the buzz is louder when I move the arm towards the center, leading me to believe the cartridge is picking some ground noise from the TT motor. Tried different cables and didn't change anything. Any ideas?

 

I just got a project debut carbon and am having the exact same problem as the OP. For me, the buzz happens regardless of whether the motor is on. I'm going to try unplugging stuff this afternoon, moving stuff around, etc. I also did order some new (albeit cheap) RCA cables with ground to see if that helps. Playing with the ground wire on the tonearm itself did seem to help it a bit, so maybe that's a big part of the culprit?

It will drive me absolutely crazy if I can't get rid of it.

 

did you have any success?