Can't decide between Pro-Ject Debut Carbon and Essential II

Discussion in 'Audio Hardware' started by Michael LeCompte, Apr 10, 2016.

  1. Michael LeCompte

    Michael LeCompte Active Member Thread Starter

    Asked this on another forum, but thought I'd post here as well. Looking at these two tables for a second system and there's a $100 difference between them. Just want some opinions on whether the Carbon is worth the additional money or if the Essential would do for some occasional listening
     
  2. Bob_in_OKC

    Bob_in_OKC Forum Resident

    Location:
    Dallas, Texas
    I'd say the answer to both questions is 'yes'. The Carbon is worth the extra $100 and the Essential II would do for some occasional listening. I like the tonearm upgrade the Essential II got, as compared to the previous Essential. I still like the Carbon better. The metal platter, carbon fiber arm, and Ortofon 2M Red are good value for the cost difference.
     
    auburn278 and BigGame like this.
  3. Jeffczar

    Jeffczar Forum Resident

    Location:
    Milwaukee, WI
    I had an older debut III and thought it was so horrible I returned it ASAP and vowed to never own another Project. However, I decided to give the RPM1 carbon a shot as I wanted another table to mount a different type of cartridge, I have to say it is absolutely fantastic, not even in the same league as the Debut in my opinion and I think we are talking very similar prices. Might want to check it out.
     
    Daniel Thomas likes this.
  4. BKphoto

    BKphoto Forum Resident

    run away....keep your money...
     
    TheVU, Cyclone Ranger and patient_ot like this.
  5. dbsea

    dbsea Well-Known Member

    Location:
    Seattle, WA
    Can you recommend any alternatives around this price point?
     
  6. Dr Faustus

    Dr Faustus Forum Resident

    I love my Carbon. It also has a nice upgrade path - replace the platter, add the speedbox, upgrade the stylus to the 2M Blue. But the time I've done all that I'll be ready to upgrade the whole turntable. For now, the sound quality is brilliant and I haven't had any issues with it.
     
  7. Daniel Thomas

    Daniel Thomas Well-Known Member

    I'd like to hear the Essential II just fpr that motor, which is different from the infamous Debut motor. Is it quiet? Is that annoying low-level hum gone? It looks like it could be slightly better than the Debut III model, which would be impressive for its price point. Add in a Speed Box and acrylic platter (heck, throw in a Bellari VP130 with Mullard tube) and you'll have a very nice sound system.

    I definitely respect the Debut Carbon series, even though it still has that terrible motor, and the tonearm is too light (6g). I would buy the model with the built-in Speed Box (the deck with a 33/45 button on top). The gloss finish is also very attractive, as is the carbon fiber tonearm.

    I would also give a long look to the current Genie deck with the carbon/metal tonearm. That could be really special.
     
    patient_ot likes this.
  8. Purplefowler

    Purplefowler Forum Resident

    Location:
    Bedfordshire, uk
    I love my debut carbon d/c. No sign of any him, it's been fantastic. I've got the acrylic platter and upgraded to the 2m bronze (the speed box isn't compatible with the Dc although I think there is a new speed box out that is). I couldn't be happier with it.
     
    Rubico and Dr Faustus like this.
  9. richbdd01

    richbdd01 Forum Resident

    Location:
    London
    Push the boat out to the new Rega P3 if you can...
     
    Crazyhorse11 likes this.
  10. BKphoto

    BKphoto Forum Resident

    after going through this I can say go the used route because you are starting out with a higher quality product, then have it restored....your overall investment will be the same and you will have something that you will keep...

    you get a carbon it is at the bottom of the quality ladder, then spend money on speed box, acrylic platter, better cart, etc. and now you are into the 800 to 1000 range...and yet still at the intro stage...IMHO its not a long term solution...
     
    dbsea, juno6000, Helom and 1 other person like this.
  11. Northa40

    Northa40 New Member

    Location:
    Canada
    Michael this is a subject that I myself have been dealing with, here is my story. I purchased a Debut Carbon DC, and returned it. I believe it is potentially a very good turntable but will require some upgrades to make it as good as it could be. My problem with the Carbon was hum/buzz, which I believe is caused by the cheap wall plug power supply. This can be fixed with Project power supply which adds to its cost. I also had problems with noise, that I felt was caused by the metal platter. This can be fixed by adding the acrylic platter, again adding more cost. So, this is what I have done. I down graded to the Essential II, replaced the cartridge with a 2M red and replaced the stock power supply with a power supply from a Cannon printer/scanner. This fixed the noise problem and I am now happy with the Project Essential. Down the road I will most likely pick up the acrylic platter and replace the counter weight as it is to light for the 2M Red. If I had the extra cash I would get the Debut Carbon Esprit, that model fixes the problems that I see in the regular Carbon. Best of luck with your choice.
     
    Spsesq likes this.
  12. SpeedMorris

    SpeedMorris Well-Known Member

    Location:
    Iowa
    The Essential III is a huge upgrade over the II. Question is when it hits our shores.
    Would much prefer the $299 Music Hall MMF 2.2 to either of the currents, though.
     
  13. Northa40

    Northa40 New Member

    Location:
    Canada
    yup I agree, in Canada they are not out yet, they are coming but you need to pre order :(
     
  14. Spsesq

    Spsesq Well-Known Member

    Location:
    New Jersey
    I have the Debut Carbon Esprit. It comes with the upgraded platter in acrylic and the speed box built in. I have had it for over a year and a half. No hum, no motor noise and I upgraded to the 2M Black after speaking to the dealer and to Ortofon. I have no complaints and would recommend the ProJect without hesitation. Good luck in whatever you pick.
     
    Big-Faced-Child likes this.
  15. Northa40

    Northa40 New Member

    Location:
    Canada
    Sweet, that is what I would like to have, maybe some day, but In Canada, it will set you back over $1000 plus the 2M black. Just a little steep for me.
     
    Spsesq likes this.
  16. Rob9874

    Rob9874 Well-Known Member

    Location:
    Surprise, AZ
    That's exactly what I've done with my Debut Carbon, and love it. I have no complaints. Granted, I haven't A/B'd against other models, nor am I willing to spend $1000+ on a turntable right now. I'm about drop $1000 on speakers which I think will have a larger impact on my overall system than an upgraded turntable.
     
  17. Spsesq

    Spsesq Well-Known Member

    Location:
    New Jersey
    The ProJect Debut Carbon Esprit with an Ortofon 2m red costs US $599.00 ( $801.00 Canadian). That is complete no need for anything else so long as your amp has a phono stage

    Pro-Ject Debut Carbon DC Esprit SB - Red

    I bought my set up from this vendor and this vendor is located in Minnesota US which is closer to Canada than Minnesota is to my home in New Jersey. Go for the Debut Carbon Esprit
     
  18. Digital Vinyl Infidel

    Digital Vinyl Infidel Forum Resident

    Location:
    North America
    Rega. planar 1.
     
    Cyclone Ranger likes this.
  19. Marshall_SLX

    Marshall_SLX Active Member

    Used RP3 or P3 - 24 or even a good condition Original P3 will be the same cost roughly as a new DC Carbon and will IMO be a much better option.
     
  20. Michael LeCompte

    Michael LeCompte Active Member Thread Starter

    agreed. Had the rp3 fitted with the Elys cartridge and sounded wonderful. Sold it only because I had too many turntables
     
    Marshall_SLX likes this.
  21. Northa40

    Northa40 New Member

    Location:
    Canada
    When I first saw them coming to Canada I inquired and was told they were going to be $1000, but you are right, after doing some internet surfing I did find one for $800. I need to save a few more green backs before I can get one. soon I hope.
     
    Spsesq likes this.
  22. Marshall_SLX

    Marshall_SLX Active Member

    Used Pro-Ject Expression will be better than a Carbon Esprit, in Australia ive seen them as low as $899 brand new with a 2m red. I just saw a Pro-Ject expression for sale locally in Aus with a speedbox and a 2m red for $500, 3 yrs old. The arm on the expression is a substantial upgrade, it could take a 2m bronze and get the most out of it where the esprit could really only go up to the 2m blue. I would still advocate the Rega P3's instead but if you are staying Pro-Ject the expression is worth it over the esprit.
     
  23. ukrules

    ukrules Forum Resident

    Location:
    Union, Kentucky
    Hummmmmmmmmm......
     
  24. Marshall_SLX

    Marshall_SLX Active Member

    Not to mention the issues with static restarting the motor when changing lp sides
     
  25. Litejazz53

    Litejazz53 Forum Resident

    Would highly recommend you spend just a bit more and get the Rega RP3 in lieu of the Carbon because of the humming problem. If you do choose the Carbon, once it is set up, please conduct this humming test, and if your Carbon is quiet, your good, if not, send it back the next day, here is the test as shown on YouTube. Mine did exactly what this man's Carbon did, and there was no getting it right!



    Pro-Ject Debut Carbon Hum Elimination Mod
     
    Marshall_SLX likes this.

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