Cds demise, or not?

How is the music industry doing world-wide in terms of revenue? I was very surprised Apple Music still operates at a net loss; Spotify's IPO only made the founders wealthy, no surprise there. With Amazon and Google diving into streaming full-force this fall; looking to renegotiate contracts with the record companies for lower prices, who gets screwed the most?

 

The topline from the IFPI 2018 report in April:

"* Streaming revenues grow 41.1% to become largest revenue source, driven by 176 million users of paid subscription accounts

*Third consecutive year of growth following 15 years of revenue decline"

But I haven't read the report and I'm not so familiar with the numbers. Downloadable here IFPI Global Music Report 2018

And presumably there are some 2nd quarter numbers out too by now.

 

I think that it's an interesting question. I think that people who are now in their teens and early 20's will still probably want access to the music of their youth in 20, 30, 40 years. I imagine it would be harder to find a physical copy of an album from 2018 in 2048, just because there weren't as many CDs or LPs produced as in the past. I would guess that streaming services would keep the old catalog titles on their servers in perpetuity if only because the marginal cost is so low, but that's assuming that the streaming model is profitable in the long run and that the same players remain in the market. I certainly do have some tracks (and even a few albums) from the download era that are no longer available and probably never will be again.

 

Though people are often drawn towards niches. It's cool. So, as you say and Sean Connery once said "Never Say Never"...…………………….

 

View Apple's music service as a loss-leader for their iPhone hardware sales. That is really the endgame for many of these streaming services - operating as loss-leaders to attract customers for more profitable products and services. That is how both Amazon and Apple as corporations view music.

 

It's also assuming that all the copyright holders (whether label or artist) are willing to keep the music available, or don't want a rate at contract re-negotiation time that the streaming service(s) balk at and refuse to pay. Not a fair assumption.

 

[QUOTE="Consumers walked away from CD 20 years ago when the internet arrive, the industry didn't choose for that to happen, it didn't want that to happen, it didn't make that happen...[/QUOTE]

Disagree. In the ‘80s, turntables were literally taken off the shelves to make way for the CD players. With no internet to turn to, consumers were forced to walk away from vinyl and buy CDs. Today, laptops are sold without disc drives and artists are releasing streaming-only albums. Again, “the industry” is deciding *for* consumers what they should want and the consumer is left with little or no choice.

Ironically, the end of net neutrality and the bursting of the streaming bubble might make physical media cheaper, easier and more free than streaming. All things old become new.

 

I have always considered a compact disc just to be a different type of record the same way I considered a 78 and LP to just be different kinds of Records and I suppose you could throw an Edison disc cylinder in there also. Since I have a machine to play either format in my living room I'm usually fine buying either one of them or whichever is cheapest

 

Turntables were taken off the shelves because consumer demand was no longer there. Industry doesn't decide - it responds to market forces. Those who get it wrong go out of business. The same thing has happened with CD players.

To you as an individual it might feel like capitalism is making decisions for you. In fact, it is the collective effect of consumer demand in response to technological change that is driving things. Each generation of products, LPs, CDs, etc have their own life cycle. See the graph posted by Chervokas a few posts back in this thread.

There's an inevitability about the demise of physical media due to the elimination of the cost of manufacturing discs.

 

but again, BestBuy is just a piece of **** retail chain teetering on the brink of bankruptcy and should not be considered a barometer for whether or not a format is dead. If all you have around you is BestBuy or WalMart, I honestly weep for you. If that's the case though, you can always buy CDs indie from Amoeba.com... and free shipping with no minimum if you live in the US...

 

Hopefully, CDs will continue to be available one way or another as long as there is some of us still alive and wanting to buy them. Sadly, that won't be forever.

 

I think it's the golden era for all CD lovers right now - Used CDs have never been cheaper, I can buy 10 CDs at my local shop for like 30 bucks, it's great!
I don't think it will last forever though, CDs will come back in style just as heroin in Pulp Fiction. It's just a perfect music format.

Let's be honest - this streaming thing is great (I have a paid Tidal subscription and I enjoy it greatly) but it surely can't last too long: it's too cheap and artists are getting next to nothing. How long before they will be backing off streaming services? 5 years, maybe quicker? And those young people gonna realize one day that having and expanding physical music collection is simply such fun and it looks great at your house. Streaming and downloading is very convenient bu definitely not sexy.

 

I look at the way things disappear from Netflix as bad sign for anyone who thinks streaming is a method of accessing a music collection for any longer than a couple of years.

 

"Steaming" is nothing less than paying someone other than yourself to dictate what you can hear. In lossy low bit-rate quality to boot. Sorry, but I'm not buying it.

 

It really isn't, and this is never going to happen. I think some audiophiles will seek out specific/early masterings or audiophile label releases, but every normal brickwalled release of the last 24-ish years? The opposite of a perfect format.

Netflix is in no way supposed to be a massive repository of the history of film/TV (unfortunately). It's a very different beast from a music streaming service, conceptually. Movie-wise, Netflix is closer to a premium cable channel like HBO, where movies come in and out of rotation constantly.

There's always going to be a handful of records with weird licensing issues that cause them to come and go, but aside from someone like Neil Young throwing another hissy fit, the vast majority of stuff searched for by normal people, regardless of preferred genre, is going to be there.

There are two, if not three now (I think Qobuz has launched) streaming services in CD-quality.

 

CDs are here to stay! There has never been another format for music that even comes close. And it really is a great time to be devoted and loyal to the format. Due to the depressed prices, I am able to add to my collection like never before for just a small outlay of funds.

 

It occurs to me that one possible element of the physical market that is lost in streaming is the ease of being able to give a gift.
A cassette, lp or cd made a great present - sometimes you’d even receive something you’d want. It could be wrapped and given as a token of friendship, respect or love.

Nowadays there has been a shift towards individuals thinking of their own tastes or even accepting a more random selection. Not even sure music gifts are even popular now. I’ve not even received a gift card for years.

Personally, I still like to think that physical formats will continue once the market begins to appreciate once again the advantages of physical product.

CD is the perfect balance - it’s portable, visible and playable in the house and the car .... oh, hold on, where do I slot it in? That’s a pain....

... like I said, they used to make great gifts.

 

The format is great ,mastering isn't - it's the same brickwalled edition on streaming services anyway.

 

Right. And by and large, the mastering isn't good, so thus the format isn't good. Not the fault of the format, but I mean, what's the point of a CD of, say, David Bowie's Blackstar or Rush's Clockwork Angels?

 

Streaming is still too cheap, with the original intention/legacy being to edge out illegal file sharing.
On the other hand, many artists do not own their recordings, so the majority cannot "pull out". And the labels make decent money from streaming, don't they?
So I guess streaming will continue to be cheap, and the streaming companies will never turn a profit, which doesn't matter for the companies owned by the hardware platform providers.
And the artists that do own their recordings will not pull out as that means they get no exposure.
So, the artists get shafted as usual.

 

You're confusing a medium (CD) and a format (Redbook), with mastering. Brickwalled music is not a problem with either CD or redbook. There are CD's out there with a DR of 20 or more. It's mastering that is causing the problem of brickwalling, and it is completely avoidable. Sad as it is to acknowledge - brickwalling is a choice made by labels.

I would argue CD's are the perfect format. It's cheap to make. Players are cheap. It's reasonably durable. It's easily portable. it's well understood. Of course, all this can be undone by a botched master.

This is an interesting comment, and I'd be interested to know where you got this information. As far as i can tell, there is no difference between the Netflix model and say, Spotify. Both license the majority of their content. License can come and go. Why do you think they're different, and where did you get the information to support it? I'm genuinely interested.

 

What's the point of a car? You can get a taxi anywhere you want to go. Or walk. People like to have belonging, people feel a connection to objects and things. Buying CD's and Vinyl has been part of our cultures for 50 years....

 

I don't have a streaming service, but you are behind the times. There are lossless services now, FLAC-based, I believe. I don't know if their libraries are as extensive as the mp3 services, but they're probably pretty darned good.

My first impressions of mp3's were entirely negative, but my workmates were probably playing 128-bit (or 64-bit, or 32-bit) files. When I finally heard 320-bit, I had to admit that it wasn't bad. Not perfect, but not bad. My first impressions died hard though and I was the last guy on the train to still be pulling-out my Discman to switch CD's. When I finally got an iPod, I liked it a lot.

I still have a prejudice towards streaming; being exposed on several occasions and being distinctly unimpressed for various reasons. But my resistance will eventually crumble.

 

I'm sure his comment is based on the number of films that are available at any one time. If I decided that I wanted to watch, let's say, John Turturro's MAC, would it be on Netflix?

 

I'm surprised that virtually every recording contract gives the record company the right to license an artist's music to the streaming companies at a uniform, fixed rate. Only those artists who own their recordings outright have any control. I know that "future forms of media" were often included in a contract, hence, CD royalties were the same as LP royalties even though they were selling for twice the price in the old days. Or maybe streaming falls under the licensing and promo to radio stations.

I'm surprised that there hasn't been a class action lawsuit challenging the definition of "media" or "radio" or something.