Coltrane/Harman

Discussion in 'Music Corner' started by Nigel KS, Aug 21, 2002.

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  1. Nigel KS

    Nigel KS New Member Thread Starter

    Location:
    Holland
    hey all,

    This is my first thread on this forum and i'm not really sure if this question is answered before.

    I really dig the Coltrane/Hartman album and i'm wondering about the best CD version of this album.

    To my knowledge there are 3 (tell me if i'm wrong)

    Original Impulse CD
    MFSL Gold CD
    Impulse 20bit Super Mapped CD

    Could anyone tell me what the best mastered version is? Yet i only own a copy on CD-r, probably from the first Impulse cd issue.

    thanks in advance,

    Nigel Salles
     
  2. syogusr

    syogusr New Member

    IMO, I'd go with the MFSL, I have it and it is just awesome!!
     
  3. petzi

    petzi Forum Resident

    Location:
    Germany
    I have to agree that the MFSL Gold CD is the release of choice here.
     
  4. Kayaker

    Kayaker Senior Member

    Location:
    New Joisey Now
    I think there was an import K2 remaster from Japan last year that is suppose to be the best sounding one.

    I remember seeing an article in an audio magazine when the MFSL came out comparing it to the the 20-bit remaster. It said the Gold was slightly better, but not worth the price difference. I have the 20-bit remaster and it sounds pretty darn good. Although it seems like the master tape is a bit rough at times.
     
  5. Nigel KS

    Nigel KS New Member Thread Starter

    Location:
    Holland
    thank u all for the advices


    Nigel
     
  6. NoTinEar

    NoTinEar Suspended

    Sorry for getting to the party late so to speak. If you can get the MOFI version, that is the one to have. It's a great album.
     
  7. jdw

    jdw Senior Member

    Interestingly, this is one of the few Coltrane albums that included any "post-production". On several tracks on the Hartman album, sections of Coltrane's horn work was over-dubbed.

    Van Gelder recorded live to two-track, so Coltrane would have been overdubbing while bounces were made to a second machine. This might account for the few rough bits on the tapes, as 1st and 2nd generation tapes were probably spliced together.

    From what I've read, the first issue of the album included the original "raw" tracks. Later pressings included the "bounced" versions with added saxophone.

    Several discographies have listed the varying versions as alternates, when that's not actually what they are. I believe the "bounced" version of the tapes has been used for all CD issues, but I'm not 100% sure...

    John
    vancouver, bc

    PS; one other bit of post-production from this era is an overdub/bounce of one saxophone note at the end of "A Love Supreme". Two horn notes sound, and I always wondered if there was another saxophonist sitting in on the take just to play on the last note!
     
  8. Nigel KS

    Nigel KS New Member Thread Starter

    Location:
    Holland
    Interesting comments u wrote jdw, thank u. Have u ever heard the original "raw" versions and do u know in wich songs overdubs occur?

    Thank u too notinear for your advice

    :)


    n
     
  9. jdw

    jdw Senior Member

    You're welcome.

    A musician from Texas named David Wild has an excellent on-line Coltrane discography;

    http://home.att.net/~dawild/john_coltrane_discography.htm


    He quotes Michael Cuscuna's additional notes to the CD release (Impulse GRD-157):

    "At a later date, Coltrane decided to overdub some additional obbligato saxophone phrases
    behind Hartman's vocals on My One and Only Love, Lush Life and You Are Too
    Beautiful. A new master was made by Rudy Van Gelder, who added some additional echo to
    the three tracks. Although the first release of the album used the original master without
    Coltrane's additional obbligatos, it was later substituted with the new master. This gave rise to
    the rumor that alternate takes of My One and Only Love, Lush Life and You Are Too
    Beautiful existed and were issued on some pressings. No alternate takes exist or have been
    issued."
     
  10. NoTinEar

    NoTinEar Suspended

    Thanks so much for the link.
     
  11. Nigel KS

    Nigel KS New Member Thread Starter

    Location:
    Holland
    thanks again JDW !

    :)
     
  12. Ken_McAlinden

    Ken_McAlinden MichiGort Staff

    Location:
    Livonia, MI
    The overdubbed obligatos are pretty easy to spot, especially with headphones. They are audibly harder to the left and somewhat different in timbre than the saxophone from the original 2-track session. I believe the first one comes in just before the vocal on "My One and Only Love". I have not heard the MFSL so I don't know what I'm missing, but the Labson 20-bit version sounds very good to me.

    Regards,
     
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