Crucial Reggae

Discussion in 'Music Corner' started by Jackie P, Jan 22, 2013.

  1. Dubmart

    Dubmart Senior Member

    Location:
    Bristol, England
    I would have liked the 35th anniversary 3LP set, I have a suspicion it was actually pressed, I think it included a live show like the deluxe CDs: https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B00E492...olid=3EFHNCPJMZ1XO&psc=0&ref_=lv_ov_lig_dp_it
     
  2. Bobby Buckshot

    Bobby Buckshot Heavy on the grease please

    Location:
    Southeastern US
    Man that's terrible. Sounds like a complete waste of time honestly.
     
  3. 99thfloor

    99thfloor Senior Member

    Location:
    Sweden
    I didn't know there was a vinyl version of that. I wrote that Deluxe off since the first disc was just the same as the stand alone remaster and the live disc with the Rotterdam Ahoy show was not very good sounding, I think a soundboard recording (and word is it uses one channel of a stereo track, but there is some weird stereo processing on it), I have been content with just streaming it when I wanted to hear it.

    It sounds like an even worse idea than what they did with Exodus, which was a pointless excercise, even if well executed and not a bad listen, at least we got to hear some alternate vocals from the actual master take, this type of frankensteining together material from completely different recordings sounds like they may have taken a cue from the Hendrix Estate...

    Do they have a legal problem with releasing any vintage unreleased studio material, or multi-track live material for that matter? All they have released for a long time now, apart from these remixes, has been either studio material that has been previoulsly released in some form, or live material of dubious quality, often from the soundboard or a broadcast or something, nothing mixed from multi-track (even the Live! Deluxe was questionable in that respect).
     
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  4. Dubmart

    Dubmart Senior Member

    Location:
    Bristol, England
    I just assume that the family have a veto over what gets released and they haven't got a clue what they are doing, plus Rita has managed to destroy enough master tapes that you do wonder what unreleased material is actually left and what condition it is in. At least the new vinyl is at a more or less normal price, perhaps they learned from "Exodus" or maybe the extra £70 they charged per record on that was to pay Ziggy.
     
  5. 99thfloor

    99thfloor Senior Member

    Location:
    Sweden
    There’s tons of session stuff in bootleg-land, where ever that came from originally, maybe those tapes are long lost...

    Main difference is everything is swimming in reverb... The vocal seems to be the familiar take all the way. I wish they would have reissued the original single mix instead.
     
    Last edited: Jun 30, 2018
  6. 99thfloor

    99thfloor Senior Member

    Location:
    Sweden
  7. Dubmart

    Dubmart Senior Member

    Location:
    Bristol, England
    Not sure if this one has any connection, but I do recall being approached by a similar organisation which was basically a made up business where if you paid them and contributed to their coffers you would likely get an award and publicity, that's how a lot of these music business events/days/awards seem to work, either that or the awards go to the people the organisers happen to know, not that I'm cynical or anything.:p
     
  8. Poison_Flour

    Poison_Flour Forum Resident

  9. 99thfloor

    99thfloor Senior Member

    Location:
    Sweden
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  10. 99thfloor

    99thfloor Senior Member

    Location:
    Sweden
  11. Here is a mixcloud mix for the hot Summer days, filled with old school dub and instrumental tracks by Tubby's, Wailers, Aggrovators, Reveolutionaries, Taxi Gang,

    <iframe width="100%" height="400" src="Mixcloud " frameborder="0" ></iframe>
     
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  12. ElevateMeLater

    ElevateMeLater Jesus of Cool

    Location:
    USA
  13. Now here is a list of Tuff Gong, Island-era, Bob Marley singles released in Jamaica, I sure would love someone at Marley/Island/Universal to a serious job on Bob Marley's Island period work in Jamaica, which sound a bit different, slightly rawer and less artistically "prudent" than the stuff released via Island (at I write this, I'm thinking it would have been great if Tubby had done dub mixes of Bib Marley stuff from the 73-80 period)

    I'm sure this list is missing crucial stuff, please do contribute. Only releases during his 1973-80 years!

    Rock It Version
    Stop That Train (instrumental)
    Knotty Dread (yes, different version than Natty Dread)
    Belly Full / version (7")
    Punky Reggae Part of Park 1 / Punky Party Part 2
    Rastaman Live Up
    Blackman Redemption
    So Much Trouble in the World (Instrumental)
    Wake Up and Live (Part Two)
    Every Need Got an Ego to Feed
    Zion Express
    Bad Card + Dub
    Coming In From the Cold + Dubbin’ In
    Redemption Song Band version on the A side of Zion Express (different from the bonus track on a reissue of Uprising)
    I Know 12″
    Trenchtown 12″
    Ride Natty Ride + Ride Diya Dub 12″
    Buffalo Soldiers 12″ + Dub
    Lively Up Yourself alternate (maybe reissued already?)
    Rebel Music + Dub (7″)
    Talking Blues With I Roy
    Ambush + Dub (7″)
    Belly Full + Dub (7″)
    Midnight Ravers + Dub (7″)
     
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  14. Dubmart

    Dubmart Senior Member

    Location:
    Bristol, England
    Island/Universal never had the rights, Bob kept the Caribbean for himself, so they'd not be interested and all the Marley family care about is selling alcohol, cannabis, second rate headphones and record players, not Bob's musical legacy for which they should all be thankful every day.

    It would be a great comp though, sometimes it's a shame that neither of us are bootleggers, a triple or quadruple LP, press up 500 copies, money back, nice set.
     
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  15. crozcat

    crozcat Forum Resident

    Location:
    Sweden
    Yes, definitely deserves to collected! :righton:

    Also these (alt. mixes):
    Rock It Babe
    Chant / Curfew
    Knotty Dread version
    Road Block / Rebel Music (2 mixes of each)
    Rat Race / version
    Blackman Redemption version
    Rastaman Live Up version (Don´t Give Up)
     
  16. marmalade166

    marmalade166 Sous les pavés, la plage!

    Location:
    Aberdeen, Scotland
    Someone was compiling a version sides compilation for the Marley family, heard about it 3rd hand with a request for some Tubby mixes of a couple of tracks that I have. there's also a Tubby mix of the lLe Perry cut of Don't Rock My Boat that's out there, plus at least one more Tubby mixed Wail'n Soul'm tune

    In the Island era there's also an alternate bub of Rat Race, plus the version side to Distant Drums, a Nyabhingi cut of Yabby you's Love Thy Neighbour featuring Bob, Bunny and Peter on hand drums
     
  17. 99thfloor

    99thfloor Senior Member

    Location:
    Sweden
    Back in 2001 it was announced that the following year there were plans for (among several releases) a "multi CD set" to be called The Tuff Gong Singles, so at least someone has had this though, but this was when that whole reissue program got halted for legal reason. Probably such a set is sitting somewhere assembled and ready to go, and they have either forgotten about it, just don't care or they are just clueless as to what to do.

    A few more versions I could think of: "Concrete" (JA mix), "I Know Dub", "Dub In Trenchtown". Have all the versions of "Smile Jamaica" been released?

    This site is a good reference: bv3

    Do you think that the set that was planned back then was not the Jamaican singles?

    These are from Island singles (acually the first is a Blue Mountan single), still would be nice to have them too of course. The last one has been reissued on the remastered Rebel Music compilation (in a disco mix with the A-side).
    There are so many variations of this track, with different lenghts for example. Are there three main mixes?
    Dub is titled ”Rub-A-Dub Style”.
    There are two unique A-side mixes of ”Rock It Babe” (I think the version side on both is the same).
    There are four different mixes, I have them down as "Rat Race (edit)", "Rat Race Part 2", "Rat Race (alternate)", "Rat Race (Fam's horn mix)"

    Would this have been the compilation I mention above?
     
    Last edited: Jul 8, 2018
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  18. Dubmart

    Dubmart Senior Member

    Location:
    Bristol, England
    Based on what's available and what's been issued/reissued over the last few years, including all the aborted projects, I genuinely believe that either Universal don't care about one of their biggest selling artists and are content just to rake in money from sales of "Legend", or more likely in my opinion there are, or have been people at Universal who care deeply and plan to put out interesting and new releases, but are being thwarted by the family or their representatives who have a veto. If we look at what Universal have been reissuing by other artists, Marley is particularly poorly served, at least since the JAD deal and prior to losing Trojan, the biggest missed opportunity for Marley ever with everything but Studio One under one roof.

    As an example I'd really like the "Jamaican" mix of "Catch A Fire" on vinyl, I'm sure a lot of other people would, after years of waiting Universal Japan issue it, it sells like hot cakes and is deleted, no sign of a European or North American issue even though the Japanese version was pressed in Europe, I know we only got the mix by accident because of the TV show and Chris Blackwell being involved, but why oh why can't we have it on vinyl, I'd much rather that than the new "Kaya" or the Ziggy vanity project "Exodus", "Catch A Fire" is an album shaped by Blackwell/Island, a London mix, "Exodus and "Kaya" are more or less what Bob wanted them to be, stop messing with his vision, give us things like the Ja. singles comp or genuine unreleased material.
     
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  19. marmalade166

    marmalade166 Sous les pavés, la plage!

    Location:
    Aberdeen, Scotland
    No this was last year, I don't know how firmed up it was but apparently someone was going through the tapes
     
  20. 99thfloor

    99thfloor Senior Member

    Location:
    Sweden
    I've been discussing Marley in the thread named "In-depth Sales Study of various major acts", and according to the method used to analyse sales by that guy Bob is ranked #26 for overall sales. Some big artists are missing in the list and the methods used (weighing and balancing "sales" of different formats, etc.) may not be commonly accepted, but the point is he is not only one of Universal's best selling artists, but one of the absolutely best selling artists ever, period.

    While reading that guy's site something was brought to my attention that almost boggled my mind: in large parts of the "third world", such as many African countries, there is of course no way to legaly neither buy nor stream music, but this will surely eventually change, giving access to streaming via mobile networks. In Africa I'd say most people do not know many of the biggest international selling artists, like Elvis, The Beatles, The Rolling Stones, Queen, Led Zeppelin, Pink Floyd, etc., but I'd say basically everyone knows Bob Marley (the only competition he might have in that regard is Michael Jackson), imagine what will happen to his "sales" numbers when all of Africa can have access to streaming music and that becomes part of the equation... Perhaps that, when the day comes, finally will give Universal and/or the estate (whoever is holding things back) a kick in the butt to get stuff released.

    What would have been cool is if, instead of these 40 remixes, they had released an Exodus/Kaya sessions box set, with some alternate (vintage) mixes and takes of songs, much of this material was recorded with horn arrangements which ultimately went largely unused, those would have been nice to have for example.

    Ok, well there was the compilation called In Dub Vol. 1, the name implies the first of several, so maybe they are making a Vol. 2...?
     
    Last edited: Jul 8, 2018
  21. Dubmart

    Dubmart Senior Member

    Location:
    Bristol, England
    Reggae had already had a big impact in Anglophone Africa prior to Marley's death, hence his appearance in Zimbabwe in 1980, there were actually Zimbabwe based Reggae labels and likewise developed markets for Reggae in West Africa and South Africa, I'm not sure how much of that history has transferred to the consciousness of the continent's very young population, but I agree that of all the big historic artists Marley is the one who may appeal most to Africa, perhaps the only other contender would have been James Brown and his appeal is on the wane. Marley's message of revolution, and political change with an Afrocentric spin is still relevant today and once you have hundreds of millions of Africans streaming that's going to equate to billions of plays, I suspect you have a better understanding of things than many at Universal or the Marleys come to that.

    "Brother, you're right, you're right
    You're right, you're right, you're so right!
    We gon' fight (we gon' fight), we'll have to fight (we gon' fight)
    We gonna fight (we gon' fight), fight for our rights!
    Natty Dread it in-a (Zimbabwe)
    Set it up in (Zimbabwe)"

    Perhaps he was singing about the future as well as the present, set up Spotify in a Zimbabwe.:)

    I've heard a few unreleased Marley mixes and some raw session tapes, but I'm not sure how many or what genuine contemporary mixes there are, definitely a potentially more interesting avenue to explore though.
     
  22. 99thfloor

    99thfloor Senior Member

    Location:
    Sweden
    I'm not sure how poular or well known J.B. ever was, but as I noted Michael Jackson is probably the other international artists, besides Bob, which many Africans is sure to recognize, he is huge, and with young people too.

    Yes, why not, it works for that too. :)

    The only country in Africa where Spotify is available is South Africa, but 50% of Africa's population has a mobile phone, and basically none of them can stream music, that is some potential... :eek:

    The "horns mix" of "Is This Love" which is on Songs Of Freedom is great, there's also a mix of "Natural Mystic" with horns on Countryman, I'm sure there must be more such proper mixes of songs, there are some others on YouTube, but many sound a bit rough.

    They could also do something with albums like Survival and Uprising (but no more 40 mixes), and then there's Natty Dread for which there was a rumuor that a Deluxe was prepared. Also, although I know many think there are too many live releases already, there must be multitracks of shows from which proper live releases could be mixed. But I agree that top of the wish list is a release of all the singles mixes/versions.
     
    Last edited: Jul 8, 2018
  23. Dubmart

    Dubmart Senior Member

    Location:
    Bristol, England
    If you listen to a lot of seventies African music you soon realise just how popular and influential James Brown was, or just look at the footage of him in Zaire, like Marley Brown was inspirational, a black man who met with presidents and prime ministers, who shaped and reshaped entire genres of music and embraced Africa, Jackson was just some pop star who didn't even want to be black let alone embrace his heritage plus his musical legacy, "Off The Wall" and "Thriller" included doesn't stand up to Brown and Marley's decades of musical evolution, always at or near the top with hundreds of recordings in their catalogues.
     
  24. 99thfloor

    99thfloor Senior Member

    Location:
    Sweden
    I wasn't making any assesment of quality or influence, and I like James Brown while I don't care for Michael Jackson, but I still argue that in the present MJ and Bob are the two international "legacy" artists whose music is alive and well among the African music listeners. I actually don't understand why MJ is so poular there (while Bob seems natural), but he is.

    Sorry for leading the thread off topic, here's an attempt to tie it together...:

    Neither "Crucial" nor "Reggae" really, but there you go... :D
     
    Last edited: Jul 8, 2018

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