Damaged AT440MLA?

It seems my cart (AT440MLA) has all of a sudden developed an unbearable amount of sibilance
I am unsure if this thing has been damaged or just plain wore out..it probably is only 1 year old so I am ruling out being worn
I did drop the needle accidentally on a record and it bounced once or twice

Anyone shed light if I damaged it? It seems to have quite a bit more sizzle lately

Thanks in advance for any input

 

Bump?

 

That cart has a removable stylus. Might be relatively easy to pull it off and check that the cantilever is still is in place/not twisted

 

I had completely forgot about that..thanks!!!!

 

I cannot seem to get it off...I am worried I will really ruin it
Not sure how to do it

 

There are finger grips. You flip down the stylus guard, grasp your tone arm, then pull straight down.

First, though, be absolutely sure the stylus is clean! It could be gunked-up and riding on the gunk, causing sibilance. Use a soft brush (it came with one) and 91% isopropyl alcohol. Not rubbing alcohol. Use a bit of vodka if you don't have 91% isopropyl. Really.

The grips are the ridges along each side on the bottom edges.

 

Damn, this thing looks straight and clean

 

Is it possible there could be some very tiny little pieces of debris on this? Now that I used the soft brush and isopropyl it seems to be "cleaner"

 

Usually a drop and bounce will not do damage. This has happened to me without damage, but damage can occur. Damage is more likely when the stylus bounces laterally across the record rather than straight up and down. Have you checked the stylus for any azimuth error? The cantilever may have twisted rotationally causing stylus lean. This would cause sibilance if the error is more than 2 to 3 degrees. The only other problem I can think of would be cracked or broken epoxy glue, a loose stylus, or the stylus was chipped.

 

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/64036341/heavens on fire sample.wav

Here is a sample of a Kiss song
Original lp
Does anyone hear a sibilance issue???

 

Drop box does not work on IE.. I must dl chrome.. had deleted it after it became corrupt. For the time being the drop box site will not load (blocked)

 

Darn.....I should probably utilize a better site to store samples..thanks for giving it a shot my friend

 

I only have a laptop at the moment to listen and no earbuds, but it MOSTLY sounds okay. I can't be sure if it's the tiny speaks in this laptop or not. The drum hits and reverb sounds pretty clear and shimmery. The loudest vocal parts and the 'ha...ha...ha' stuff seems cloudy/smeary though.

I don't have this LP to compare here, but looking at the track list it is #2 on 'Animalize', so I presume that's what you recorded. If a cart can't track the 2nd cut well then probably nothing will sound as it really should, unless the cart is misaligned to favor the last few tracks or something...I have seen and heard that happen.

I still vote for stylus crud as the culprit. Hate to throw such a technical term at you, but you already improved it by cleaning once so there may have been quite a buildup and you have to work it a bit more with a good bit of isopropyl. Although you say 'it is only one year old', it could certainly be stylus wear. If you play 4 LPs a day, 5 days a week, that's easily 800 hours and you could be seeing some wear. Some claim up to 1500-2000 hours, but you listen to Kiss ... just kidding. Seriously, though, 800 hours is approaching at least around 3/4 of the life of that styli, on average, so the shape of it may have changed enough to start being audible. If you played many fewer LPs than that during the past year, it's probably still fine. If you played many more, or a good deal of used vinyl that isn't clean, then it may be time for a new stylus. We all hate that feeling, when we hear something from a cart and know it has been in use for a good bit, thinking that maybe it's time to replace the tip. You have something tweaked to perfection and then have to replace a significant piece of it for significant money--it's a drag and, for me, one of the only real downsides to listening. But CD lasers wear out and can be a pain to deal with, so no system is perfect.

If you are familiar with using a small square of a Magic Eraser sponge (here it is often just called "ME", available at most stores in the cleaning products), you can try what many do and "dip" the stylus a few times into the surface of the ME. It's made of microfine melamine spongy stuff and really does clean well. Just don't drag the stylus around...a dip and maybe a slight, gentle rotation will scrub things at a microscopic level. If you clean the stylus with each play using a brush, you should rarely need anything more like ME. But ME should probably be in your audiophile arsenal for when it may be needed. One box of 4 ME sponges will last almost forever in cleaning styli.

 

Thanks for your detailed response!
I used a loupe to check my stylus and it had a yellowish hue to it..so I figured it must be a small amount of build up
I cleaned the stylus with the isopr0pyl and checked through the loupe again and the tint was gone and the color matched the cantilever (which I assume is the way it should look)...
The record I used was an an old I bought new and it has seen some pretty bad turntables in my day so I assume the vinyl is pretty bad

I have shopped for 'ME' and I cannot find it in any of my local stores...Walmart and Walgreens

 

It's Mr. Clean Magic Eraser. Search for that. I dislike Wally mart, but here's the link... http://www.walmart.com/ip/Mr.-Clean-Magic-Eraser-Original-Cleaning-Pads-4-Pack/19589657

You can cut a small square, roughly sugar-cube size, and have it next to the TT platter to dip the stylus occasionally, if you like. There have been some interesting threads here and elsewhere, showing various ways to make a holder for a bit of ME so it looks nice, right on the turntable deck.

... That record may just have damage from mistracking. Probably cut loud and some of the transitions in the vinyl have been chiselled away. Even very good styli will do this. Styli shaped like the MLa will do it least of all, but when the damage is done, it's done. That said, some stylus shapes ARE more forgiving and may miss much of the damage and "read" the groove in places that weren't nicked previously. Like the DL-110. My AT440MLa is wonderful, but I always hear bad stuff like on your Kiss LP more with the AT than with the Denon. That said, maybe the AT always reveals more detail and it shows up nuances and flaws, but I don't think so...I think the DL stylus is a shape that can avoid the damage and sounds better. Your mileage may vary and others have their favorites, certainly.

 

The issue I am really having is with a recently purchased 180 gram lp Purple Rain by Prince
There is a cymbal on the song Purple Rain that sounds like sandpaper being used and comes flying out of the speakers....almost unbearable
Maybe the issue is the combo of my AT and that specific pressing?

 

It could just be the pressing. Cymbals are tough, from mic to your ear, tough to replicate the sound properly. Have you look at the specific track? It may be pressed badly there. Sometimes you can get 'no fill' on a pressing, it will have a zippery sound and may even look whitish rather than the usual black vinyl color. 180G and heavier pressings seem to have more no-fill than the old school pressings, since the vinyl "biscuit" they are smushing in the press may not distribute well enough in the pressing cycle since there is so much material to squeeze and mold properly throughout.

Your profile isn't completed in your personal info, so I'm not sure what TT and arm you have, but setup of a cart can mean that everything sounds quite good EXCEPT those few spots where the groove is very demanding. Such as cymbals, especially at a high level. Just be sure that stylus is clean and your cart is mounted/aligned accurately, including stylus overhang. Even 1/2 millimeter will make a difference on many tonearms with stylus overhang.

EDIT: I see an AT-PL120 TT now in your profile...just added or maybe I didn't see it on my mobile screen before. It's possible that you are finding some LPs that reveal the limitations of that tonearm. Not trying to be elitist at all, just reality, and it may be time to upgrade when you can if that's still your current TT and your ears are now finding limitations.

 

Yeah, I better get to updating my profile
I have a Pro Ject Carbon now with the AT440mla..which I run through a DJ Art Pro preamp
And I switch between my computer (for needledrops) and an old Technics system I bought in the 80's..and it needs work..pots are all dirty and sometimes my right channel drops out in the phono stage

 

Tracking at what? I use 1.4G on my vintage Sony. Do you have a stylus weight gauge? There are some very accurate digital ones on Amazon, less than 20$. Or you can use the balance type.

You will sometimes hear differences of a tenth of a gram on a good TT, with some LPs. You may want to add .05 or .1G and see what that does for your Prince album tracking. You can go up to 1.8G and still be in spec, or down to 1.0--not likely the direction you need to go.

Some TTs have stylus force settings that are accurate and repeatable, but never trust the scale on a TT until you check it out with a decent gauge. I don't care how expensive a TT is, confirm with a gauge and if the TT weight scale is accurate you can put the gauge away for another TT check another day.

 

Tracking at 1.4 right now
I do have a weight gauge
I have set up the null points with the protractor the table comes with....I have tried to be thorough with everything..I am wanting to verify that somehow it is my stylus....
I am considering sending back the Prince lp to Amazon and giving another one a shot
Right now I am tracking all sorts of lp's..some pressed in the 50's and 60's and some more current ones to see if I am finding the sibilance on those as well

 

All good. Sounds like you have covered the bases. And the cart is broken-in by now, since the AT takes at least 25-30 hours to start sounding as it should.

Do you still have the 2M Red listed in your profile? If so, can you try that or was it worn? It's a bit of a hassle but if you can try another cart and confirm the issue on an LP, then that's a good scenario. It's the LP and not any part of your setup then.

 

Yeah, I still have the Red...I bought the AT just a couple of weeks after I bought the table so it has very little use on it
I have considered swapping it back in but it was so frustrating getting the AT on
The cart wires on the Pro Ject are so tiny I was worried I was going to ruin one of them so I am hesitant to make the switch..I am chicken

 

Understood. Well, if the AT440 has less than 30-40 hours on it, I'd let it ride. You may be surprised. Mine sounded great at first, then it really sounded great. I could hear things in the next room that I never noticed before. A fret being released, a certain edge to a guitar strum. Carts are one of the few things that I believe actually need break-in. Until you have 100+ album sides, an AT440MLa is probably still not broken in.

 

BuddhaBob, thank you so much for taking the time to help me!!
Very much appreciated
I have listened to a few more records...some 200gram, 180 gram and some old RCA Victor stereo Al Hirt lp's
Maybe the sibilance that I am hearing is more with the actual records and not due to my stylus

 

Al Hirt! Sugarlips! Enjoy!