Direct-Drive or Belt-Drive - What Do You Use?

Linn Sondek LP12 - belt. I don't want those motor vibrations passed directly to the platter.

 

Methinks you are only really defending the DD isssue and specifically Technics because you own one.

There really is no need for us to become defensive about performance of kit just because someone criticises it. At the end of the day what matters is that it does the job for you and keeps you happy. To be honest, having looked at your equipment profile, and as you stated that you are not an audiophile type, I am not surprised that you think it sounds just fine. (That is not meant to belittle you or criticise your system, it is just a statement of fact, so please do not take it the wrong way). Unless you have listened to high end systems based on BD TT's and done the comparisons, there is no way you can be judgemental about DD v's BD TT's, especially if you listen to music on a non-revealing system. I am certain that in your system the Technics does a damn good job, in mine it sounded like sh it. A local DJ aquaintance brought his over because he wanted to see what I meant and he was astounded. Whilst my deck is good it is nowhere near what can be had out there.

You live in the home of Linn, you must have an LP 12-owning neighbour or friend. Those are no great shakes either, but hell, you'll notice a world of difference.

The bottom line is that with few exceptions, in the price range between $500 and $73,000 the only good sounding decks are belt driven.

 

Yet, on another thread, people are talking about how the P3 runs fast, causing a "sharp" sound. What's a person to do?

 

started in the 70s with a

Sherwood DD 70s (budget TT)
Dual CS616 DD 80s (not too bad)
Revolver with super tonearm BD 90s (noisy platter)
VPI 19 MKIII BD 2000 (with piano black base)
Win Labs SEC-10 BD 2003 pre 80s design have the pic posted on this forum


sean

 

Yes i have a budget based system, and i readily accept that i am not an Audiophile as such; the thing is that i came to the SL1200 after using models from Rega & Pro-Ject, and being unhappy with them; whether it be QC issues, build quality or how they sounded. If you like a very clinical, analytical sound, then maybe the Rega is the bees knees, but it's not for me.
Of course, if i was able to, or wanted to buy a much more expensive player, regardless of the drive system(which is irrelevant, AFAIAC), then i'm sure i would notice a great improvement. All i am saying is that the DD Technics SL1200 is a good quality player at it's price point, and should not be dismissed out of hand, as many are trying to do here.

 

You can vote for both by checking both boxes, I set it up that way.

 

One of the benefits of those old Technics DD units is their durability. Find a used one, slap a cart on it and it'll play records.

I still own my Dad's old Technics, which I remember him buying back in 1980. It'll run forever.

It was there for me after I got burned on highly recommended audiophile approved "Budget" turntable. That turned out to be a $500 pile of worthless trash. It was comforting to set up the old Technics again, spin some vinyl and just forget about it.

Served me well until I bought my AR. In fact I was pretty happy with it.

To me at least, the strong audiophile resentment against such reliable turntables seems rather unreasonable.

dan c

 

Interesting statements, Dan! Reliability is one issue that never comes up when discussing turntables.

Just what is the reliability of these so-called audiophile-approved tables vs. the DJ, or budget DD tables?

I don't have a DJ TT, but it is a 24-year-old JVC that I still use. It's reliable, and does what I need it to do. the low rumbling below 25Hz can be a bit of a problem on some vinyl, but it gets the job done. Could a budget Rega or Music Hall last that long? This JVC table is the only real experience i've had with owning one.

 

Actually, my Technics SP-10 Mk II from 1977 finally failed this year. It took months to get it repaired and it is still not 100% right. It used to have so much torque that I could not easily slow it down with my finger. Now I can, though it is still pretty stable. I'll be taking it back in for service to try and get the torque right as soon as one of my amps I left there is done.

 

I've had my Linn Sondek for 19 years and never had any problems with it.

 

I've had my Gemini XL-200 for quite a few years and it is very reliable. I've never had it fixed yet.

 

I don't know how long a Music Hall turntable could last, but the one I bought lasted one day. I sent it back because it made so much noise, I could hear it in the next room.

 

Voted "Belt Drive".

Have a modified Thorens TD160 which I purchased new about 1979/1980 and, apart from the obvious occasional belt changes and addition of engine oil to the bearing (I know - it's supposed to be far too heavy but I can't notce any difference) never had a problem apart from my ham-fisted attempts to adjust the height of the motor (as I added mass to the platter) which removed the "cross" of one of the "cross-headed" screws.

 

I don't doubt that a quality turntable like that would run for years. They still demand high prices on the used market. If one wants to get into vinyl on the cheap, an old Technics might not be such a bad deal. I just don't have much faith in many of the "entry level" turntables. $500 is a lot of scratch for most of us, especially if it turns out to be wasted.

I'm not saying all new turntables under a grand are junk. Don't get me wrong. I am, however, saying that spending $30 on an old DD isn't very risky at all. And if it ends up working well, then it's a very good pathway into the nutty world of vinyl.

dan c

 

From my own experience:

- I regularly use a Thorens TD150mk2 turntable. They stopped making these 31 years ago.
- A good friend of mine is a Rega dealer. He regularly services Rega turntables that are five, ten, twenty years old or more. They need a new belt and replacement oil in the bearing every few years and they're as good as new.
- the number of Lin Sondeks still spining happily is amazing. Again, it is easy to replace the belt and oil.

In contrast, my friend in the hi-fi shop sometimes gets direct drive turntables in for sevice. In most cases all he can do is tell the owner that they either cannot be repaired or are beyond economic repair.

 

I sold my 30+ year old one to another SHF member last year and he says it is going strong as ever.

 

If I can scrape a couple hundred together (without first spending it on vinyl )I'd like to someday buy a good used belt drive like a Thorens.

 

Can I check belt drive twice since I have two BD 'tables?

 

Wow...that's another point that I forgot about. One of the great things about Regas is that they are so extremely reliable. That's the great thing about simple designs. Linns tend to go out of adjustment regularly, especially the older ones, but it's not that difficult to teach yourself how to keep it running optimally, from what I've heard.

 

Get back with us after twenty, thirty or forty years, like some belt-drive 'table owners, and we'll see.

 

I've had a little experience with PT 'tables (I almost bought a Tarantella once), but my dealer absolutely loved them. He was very sad when they went out of business. He did say that they did break down once in a while, especially in comparison with Rega, but he equated that to owning something like a Ferrari. Sure, they're in the shop a little more often than you'd like, but you can't get that kind of performance anywhere else. When he stopped carrying the line, he quickly replaced it with Michell, which he now considers to be the best 'tables in the world. But I think he really misses his Pink Triangle Anniversary.

 

Denon DP-23F, direct drive. 17 years old and still going strong.

When I purchased it in 1988, it was to replace my circa 1973 Dual 1229Q, idler wheel.

Back in 1988, one of the selling points of direct drive turntables was their supposed superiority to belt drive turntables. By 1988, I don't think any idler wheel turntables were still being sold, although I believe every cassette deck had an idler wheel to power the fast forward and reverse spindles.

 

DP-51F here. Over 20 years and never a problem.

 

Mine has been banged about a bit form 3 house moves, still works fine but I did have to get the power supply fixed a few years ago, they often failed. Apparently one of the new mods is a better power supply. It appears that the original one is not repairable once the quartz something or other that controls the speed chage goes, unless you only want to play 33rpm's.

This was the first TT to use an acrylic platter and was considered a revolutionary design at the time.

 

Heres a TT hear the yesterday and was very surprised at how good it sounded at the price:

http://www.argos.co.uk/webapp/wcs/s...001&langId=-1&catalogId=3151&productId=117615

Can be found for as low as £39.00! the sound is really really good taking the price into account. A good cheap way for someone to dip their toes into vynil without breaking the bank.