Do you regard Green Day as a real punk band?

See the 'What is Punk?" thread for more pointless opinions.

 

Hard to disagree with that. Their covers were uniformly excellent, and pretty much defined what a great cover version is, retaining the spirit of the original while making the song their own. "Surfin' Bird", "Do You Wanna Dance", California Sun", "Let's Dance", and "Time Has Come Today" are Ramones songs when they get through with them.

 

I only caught the last 10 minutes of their set. Stylistically, a good fit for Green Day.

 

Good way to put it. When I was a child, Dookie was a very fresh sounding album and was in constant rotation for practically the entire year of 1994. I wasn't a huge fan of any of their work again until American Idiot and that album, too, was an instant classic. In the 90s, the whole punk label with other kids and teens in the area seemed pretty synonymous with the skateboarding scene and I don't recall Green Day really being part of that - bands like NOFX, Pennywise, and earlier Blink 182 seemed more fitting.

 

No.....there better than that. They're an awesome rock band.

 

They are not a punk band now and have not been for a really long time, but they used to be. That's my story and I'm sticking to it.

I would say that Dookie was the final installment in their punk era. It's fitting that it's on a major as a goodbye to their punk days since the Pistols, Ramones and so many of their heroes were also on a major, lest we forget. Insomniac began their straight rock era, which is where they've been ever since.

 

Green Day definitely became pop, from the get go. There is a a long tradition of pop punk that Green Day is a part of - the Ramones, Undertones, Buzzcocks....all those bands were the foundation of everything Green Day did until 1995 or so.

 

All these people referring to Green Day as power pop. I guess it makes sense for critics who called Elvis Costello power pop in 1978. It was primarily because he, like Armstrong, is a gifted melodist. It was as if a prerequisite for punk was a certain tunelessness. I often wondered if those critics had actually heard "Complete Control." They seemed pretty clueless.

 

No, just punk wannabees.

 

What gets classified as country music these days is not what country USED to be.
I don't see why the rules should be any different for punk. Yes, it doesn't fall into the guidelines and standards of what punk USED to be, but if THIS can be country:



^ currently #1 on the Country chart

Then Green Day can be considered punk.

 

If anyone is interested here an article listing Green Day sales in all formats.

 

My youngest son quite liked Green Day, I used to tease him by calling them Kiddy Rock.

 

Well, they used to be a punk rock band. Not anymore, they did evolve into something different. I don't like American Idiot, but that's just a matter of taste.

 

I keep seeing the phrase "post-punk" being mentioned. They are in no way, shape or form a post-punk band. Not sure what you might think "post-punk" means but it doesn't mean what you think it means.

Post-punk bands
Joy Division
PIL
Wire
This Heat
Gang Of Four
Not Green Day

 

Something I don't get:
Green Day loses their street cred for releasing a "commercial album", yet Nevermind was very slick in production and is hailed as a masterpiece, and In Utero is full of poppy Beatle-esque ballads, yet somehow they didn't lose their "punk cred".

 

When Dookie came out it was the band's first album release on a major record label (Reprise).
And the people from the underground at home (Oakland, CA) didn't like to see their band falling into commercialization. After Dookie came round the band was banned from the native club where they played every night previously.
Generally, punk is always a thing when you're not on a major label... Well, Sex Pistols doesn't count. They were punk from start to end.

Btw, don't get me wrong, I also like Green Day's albums on Reprise etc.

 

Saw them last night for the first time. A terrific 2 1/2 hour concert. They played a torrid version
of `Johnny B. Goode' and at one point they were all lying down on their backs upon the stage
leading the crowd in a sing-along version of `Hey Jude'. If that's your idea of punk.....they do
play quite fast and loud, I'll grant you.

 

No more than I considered The Stray Cats a "real" rockabilly band.

 

I've never understood the thinking that rejects a band as punk because it sounds "too pop". My recollection of the birth of punk is that just about all of those bands regarded as the originals - Ramones, Clash, Pistols - included a big dose of pop melody in their songs. They were all trying to reach the top of the pop charts with their music, and at least in the case of the Ramones, clearly were disappointed that it never happened.

But even the UK punks, the Clash and the Pistols, made music that clearly was melodic and hooky underneath the abrasive guitars, force-beat drums, and wailing vocals. In fact, it's even stranger when some claim a division between the USA and UK punks, acknowledging the pop aspirations and sound of US punks like the Ramones but claiming the Pistols and Clash were uncommercial, darker, political, angrier, etc. In fact, the Pistols and Clash both burst on the scene as genuine UK pop stars. The Clash placed 16 singles in the UK top 40 (that's comparable to what Styx and Foreigner did on the USA charts, btw) and had three top 10 albums, and between 1977-1979, the Pistols scored seven straight top 10 UK singles and three straight top 10 albums, including a #1 album, a record just about any overtly commercial band would be proud of. It was the Ramones that proved far less commercially viable, as they placed only 4 singles in the UK top 40 and none in the USA.

So reject Green Day as punk if you want, but IMO it's hard to justify that on the grounds they were too melodic/pop, because that's been in punk's genes since day one. The first wave of punk aimed right at the mainstream of rock and roll, and wanted to take it over. Acts like the Pistols and Ramones saw themselves as the true heirs to the original heart of rock and roll, and wanted to supplant acts like Pink Floyd and KISS as dominant commercial forces, not live in their shadows as niche dissidents.

It was only after the first wave of punk, when that wave failed to take over the USA charts as had been planned and hoped, that punk turned inward, and redefined itself as an uncommercial music.

 

no, they're poop.
they're not innovative at all, they're the (ahem) "punk" version of Stray Cats meaning a bunch of "pretty boys" (well, the girls like Billie Joe whatever) who were influenced by some great bands like the Buzzcocks and Stiff Little Fingers and some other more hardcore bands and then peddled their wares in a safe manner making it easier for consumption by the masses; they never paid any dues and they DON'T deserve to be in the rock and roll hall of fame. They have a couple decent songs, that's about it for them.

 

They may be a byproduct of, but nothing more than that.

 

I do not.

 

The sort of elitism, where you're "only punk as long as no one has heard you" is a major turnoff for me with regard to the scene. I love the scene. I just dislike the purism so many seem to have. It's not "punk" to keep your music contained to only 100 people...It's kinda selfish in a way. Punk to me isn't about how many records you do or don't sell it's about an attitude. I wouldn't say Green Day were on a level with Sid Vicious in terms of street cred but no punk band really was. Punk is more of anti-establishment mindset to me, and even though Green Day are an old band, they're not establishment rock n' roll the way say U2 is. And I say this as someone who was born after Green Day formed. They've never struck me as an oldies band or the kind of band that fell into the sell-out rockstar trap or any of those cliches. Neither did Nirvana, for that matter. Pop, to me, is a big element of Punk. If you discount pop inflected melodies from Punk I guess Patti Smith wasn't a Punk?

 

It never mattered whether they're punk or not. They were a fast and loud rock band with insane hooks and were just incredibly fun to listen to. The music got U2-level boring later on, but by that time it no longer mattered. A handful of those singles from the 90s still rule.

The same goes for The Offspring.

 

Does he know what a "Green Day" is? (I hope not...)