Electric Light Orchestra - Secret Messages as originally intended

Discussion in 'Music Corner' started by peterpyser, Feb 24, 2015.

  1. lawrev

    lawrev Forum Resident

    I'm interesting in securing the most accurate version of the original album. That's it. Everything in order as is known, using the best available versions to make that a reality. Same with the acetates. If the SMS releases those online, you can bet your bottom dollar that I am securing those too!
     
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  2. Koabac

    Koabac Self-Titled

    Location:
    Los Angeles
    Thank you, I'd love to see your updated list - and, yes, I would definitely include the various other versions of songs from this era as a "bonus disc" of sorts, placed on the playlist directly after the main SM version with the various other versions and mixes thata are different enough to be worthy of inclusion.
     
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  3. 'elo 'elo

    'elo 'elo Forum Resident

    Location:
    Liverpool
    Exactly!
     
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  4. Neonbeam

    Neonbeam All Art Was Once Contemporary

    Location:
    Berlin
    OMG! What's that Jeff is holding? A beer? A..... fag? Rock N Roll Is King, indeed! :evil:
     
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  5. lawrev

    lawrev Forum Resident

    This would have been taken shortly before the fateful band meeting wherein Jeff told the guys that SM would be two disks, thereby completing the record contract, and no tour to support the final album. Essentially, telling the guys during the tour that ELO was no more in a short period of time.
     
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  6. There wasn't a band meeting as such - I'm guessing you're referring to the backstage incident (again in Sweden) witnessed by several fans and journalists that took place just two days before Bev fell ill? Yes, I'll definitely be covering that in great detail by offering two very different yet equally official takes on the outcome...
     
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  7. TrekkiELO

    TrekkiELO Forum Resident

    There was a meeting called "The Meal" around the time that Jeff Lynne won his suit against Don Arden where he told band members they wouldn't get their fair share of royalty profits, this is one main reason for Kelly Groucutt's lawsuit and why ELO Part II/The Orchestra ultimately exists.
     
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  8. TrekkiELO

    TrekkiELO Forum Resident

    Yeah, the Afterglow liner notes by Ira Robbins of Trouser Press fame and also Casey Kasem's American Top 40 from April 2nd, 1983, right before "Der Kommissar" at #15 tell this story about where their warm up act After the Fire's drummer Pete King (RIP) drums for Bev Bevan who had kidney stones on The Time Tour in Germany!
     
  9. grimble

    grimble Forum Resident

    Location:
    London, UK
    Kelly was on a wage wasn’t he? And how can you tell someone they’re not going to get their ‘fair share’? And wasn’t the Don Arden suit after SM and therefore after Kelly left?

    Apart from that...
     
  10. TrekkiELO

    TrekkiELO Forum Resident

    Kelly Groucutt along with all the other former band members weren't just hired hands or session musicians, such players are not usually in the album credits and on back covers. When it's your lawsuit, especially if there's a settlement out of court, you can tell someone anything, that's where they put their trust!
     
    Last edited: Aug 11, 2018 at 2:24 PM
  11. grimble

    grimble Forum Resident

    Location:
    London, UK
    Everyone apart from Jeff, Bev (and maybe Richard) were salaried and on a contract.
     
  12. TrekkiELO

    TrekkiELO Forum Resident

    Well, Kelly Groucutt must have had some sort of a case where songwriting goes, otherwise it wouldn't have gotten that far, again hired hands or session musicians usually don't get credit in the album credits/covers as full Electric Light Orchestra band members, just look at Steely Dan, Steve Miller Band, Fleetwood Mac and many more for comparisons!
     
  13. grimble

    grimble Forum Resident

    Location:
    London, UK
    I’m not disputing that they were bona fide band members, but they were also, to put it crudely, employees. They were paid an income for being in ELO.
     
    Last edited: Aug 11, 2018 at 2:40 PM
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  14. Chazzbo13

    Chazzbo13 Forum Resident

    Location:
    Johnstown, PA
    But I believe that to be the gist of the suit...band members defined their positions one way, and were never told otherwise until that particular point in time...if Kelly had believed he was simply a "staff member" all along, there would have been no real basis for the suit...
     
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  15. Beatmaniac

    Beatmaniac Forum Resident

    Well, I just saw Jeff in Houston. What a show they put on... wow!!

    I would have loved some deeper cuts, but I mean it’s a comeback tour we all know that won’t happen.
     
  16. TrekkiELO

    TrekkiELO Forum Resident

    My point exactly, if so, then don't list contracted musicians as actual members when they're clearly not, that's why it's now Jeff Lynne's ELO, because as a faceless band like The Electric Light Orchestra was, you open yourself up to scrutiny from me along with many other purist fans, a bag of worms!
     
  17. brainwashed

    brainwashed Forum Hall Of Fame

    Location:
    Boston, MA
    Eh? Wings members (other than Paul, Linda and Denny Laine) were all duly credited. but were always salaried employees. This was and is common practice. Especially when groups go through original members. Kelly was NOT an original member. And as far as I know he was never a partner. Ron
     
  18. grimble

    grimble Forum Resident

    Location:
    London, UK
    What was the suit? I believe it was that he thought he should have been paid more, which may have been related to realising that the writing was on the wall for ELO. I don’t accept he wasn’t aware he was on a salary.
     
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  19. grimble

    grimble Forum Resident

    Location:
    London, UK
    The fact is Kelly and most other members of ELO were on wages.
     
  20. TrekkiELO

    TrekkiELO Forum Resident

    Look, then don't list them as official band members in ELO's album credits or on back covers!

    Fact, Mike de Albuquerque, Wilf Gibson, Mike Edwards, Colin Walker, Kelly Groucutt, Mik Kaminski, Hugh McDowell, Melvyn Gale and Louis Clark all contributed to The Electric Light Orchestra songwriting process.
     
  21. grimble

    grimble Forum Resident

    Location:
    London, UK
    You might want to check those album credits you’re fond of in relation to that last paragraph.
     
  22. TrekkiELO

    TrekkiELO Forum Resident

    Although Kelly Groucutt was NOT an original member, he was still credited!
     
  23. TrekkiELO

    TrekkiELO Forum Resident

    Just because it states "All songs written and produced by Jeff Lynne", doesn't mean that those members didn't contribute to the songwriting process! Were you there in the studios with The Electric Light Orchestra?!
     
  24. grimble

    grimble Forum Resident

    Location:
    London, UK
    Well you can use the album credits as evidence to support your opinion or not. You seem to want to use them to support one of your arguments and ignore them to support another one.

    In the knowledge I’m correct I’ll dip out of this until it gets interesting again.
     
  25. ampmods

    ampmods Forum Resident

    Location:
    Boston, MA, USA
    Arrangements perhaps... but the songs were brought in as finished melodies, chords and lyrics by Lynne.
     

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