First impressions of the Nagaoka MP-110 phono cartridge

I get you, but - sorry if I am repeating stuff - does the DL-110 qualify as any of the Shibata, Line Contact, and Microline styli? Earlier on this thread it was claimed that the DL- 110 was only an elliptical/‘special elliptical’.

 

Again, "muffled" is perfectly clear (albeit negative indeed) within a defined context as provided in my post.
I fail to understand why that term couldn't be used in music, however negative it might be.

 

I would say based on my experience (never owing the AT 95e but hearing quite a few on friends who own the AT DDs ) the Denon is the best of those 3 by far. IDG is still an issue on some hotly cut records with a lot of dynamics on the inner groove, but it’s reduced beyond what the Nagaoka is, which to my memory is superior to the AT by quite a bit. I think the only “issue” with that Denon is the fact that it’s an MC at that price point, and when the stylus goes its probably most pragmatic to just buy a new one vs retipping.

To dumb down the conversation, regardless of cut style, it’s plainly obvious to the naked eye that the Denon is significantly slimmer and more sophisticated in shape than the Nag or AT, which is why you’ll see an improvement in tracking. You may get more for your buck with a higher end AT but only if you like that “flavor” of sound.

 

You can use it however much you like, but for me as a reader its impossible to interpret your range of muffled sound. Maybe you just really prefer overly bright and sharp sounds, maybe the rest of your system is muffled, maybe you listen to muffled music, I have no idea.

 

I have owned a few AT (440's) and a few Denon DL-110's. Both great carts, the AT tracks like a champ and is very "up-front" (some think they are "bright"), you need to limit your capacitance
when using an AT440. Denon DL-110 is a decent tracker, has a wide sound stage, and is (imo) more "musical" than the AT440. Having said that, after wearing out my second DL-110, I decided
to switch back to AT with their new VM540 (replaces the 440) - I really like it. Seems a little smoother than the 440, and tracks great. Needs a low capacitance (btw). Recommended!

 

Or maybe you have oversensitive ears that cannot stand brighter frequencies...
If someone says that the found the AT too bright, it's perfectly clear what they mean. As for me, compared to the Nag, it's the other way round, I find the latter muffled rather than the AT too bright.
As for what muffled music is, can you give an example please?

 

The issue with the "bright" sound can be solved in large part by lowering the capacitance between your turntable and phono pre-amp.
I find having a little "bright" quality about the sound preserves more detail in the music. Kind of a compromise there, I guess.

 

Yes, I agree, and I guess my phono amp handles that particular cartridge better than others.

 

Exactly, so would you completely agree if I said the AT was bright, no, I dont think so. We would be in disagreement and what Ive been trying to say is that we dont know exactly why that is, if its the rest of our setups, our preferences, or the music we listen to. And what I mean by music is if its EQd badly, like all of Genesis up until Selling England.

 

It has nothing to do with agreeing or disagreeing with someone's musical preferences.
I read about a lot of people finding the AT too bright before taking the plunge, and I didn't discard their opinions, on the contrary, but I also know what my expectations are in terms of sound and details, and I haven't been disappointed.
If you tell me you find the AT too bright, I'm not going to argue that "bright" is an impossible term to interpret in terms of music and I'll see exactly what you mean, so why would say that about the term "muffled"?
That's all this argument is about.

And as you're from Sweden, you've probably heard about a band called Madrugada.
I don't know if you would define their sound as muffled, but the clarity brought by the AT to their music is, to my ears anyway, a huge improvement compared to the Nag, which, again, is a very nice-sounding cartridge and excellent value for money..

 

The AT 120e is shrill in the treble at times. I never heard the AT440ML, but it has a rising response in the treble per a graph I have seen. The VM540ML addresses the AT440ML bright treble. The VM540ML is never shrill and a graph I viewed shows it has very flat across the frequency range. It is a bargain.

 

Only familiar with the AT440 and the VM540 is an improvement (imo).

 

Everyone is going to get in a tizzy as usual about which carts are truly best in sound (usually biased by their own purchases) but realistically I think many of the carts mentioned can be considered an upgrade over entry level. If anyone is looking at these carts, the real thing to parse out is what exactly you are trying to upgrade. This is much more productive than hoping for a group consensus, which will never happen.

Are you looking for a better mid range and more bass, and don’t want to spend too much? The Nagaoka 110 is a great choice for that. Are you annoyed by mistracking, and want a clean tracking cart even at the end of an LP? The AT and Denon carts are going to address this much better.

The Nagaoka is held back by its stylus from competing with the AT and the Denon offerings even if you like the sound signature. As mentioned above @floweringtoilet did an excellent comparison on YouTube of the Denon vs the Nagaoka and it’s pretty easy to hear the breakup on the Nag, even if it’s very competitive sonically.

Judging a cart is a bit like judging a figure skating competition. There’s the obvious technical mistakes and then there is the subjective art of the performance. To me, the Nag makes quite a few technical mistakes, but I could see how that can be forgiven in light of the performance. If you’re an exacting judge like me though, the technical mistakes poke too many holes in the overall presentation.

 

In recent years, after my son was born, and cried in my ears every day for several hours for the last three years, I became one of those that "have oversensitive ears that cannot stand brighter frequencies". Someone wrote this some posts above and I immediately related. I realized that a couple of weeks back. I also have moderate hearing loss that affect a few higher-mid frequencies in my left ear due to an infection I got years ago. As a result, specially when I'm too tired, I feel some fatigue with too forward brighter music when some brighter horns or electric guitar are panned to the left channel and too forward in the mix.

Probably because of this, I noticed I prefer the laid-back smooth presentation of the lower torque option of my Technics SL-1210GR (a great feature of this turntable that people seem not to appreciate too much but actually makes a big difference).

I have an Ortofon 2M Black which is not muffled by any means. One of these days I put back my Nagaoka MP-110 to play a record with too much surface noise because of some scratches. The 2M Black puts out all the noise a record has, while the Nag doesn't, so I wanted to try it.

Guess what? To my ears, in my system, the Nag had harsher, more prominent and more fatiguing higher-mids and high frequencies than the Black!

I was surprised. Maybe it was due to the headshell: I played the Black with a Jelco HS25 and the Nag with the Technics stock headshell. I'm not sure. But that had never happen before. The Nag was always smoother then the Black.

I soon realized that what was bothering me was not the Nag's highs themselves, but the lack of delicacy and sophistication compared to the 2M Black. I probably finally got used to that level of detail and delicacy to a point I miss it when it's absent.

But man, that unexpensive Nag can deliver some great smooth bass guitar that I kind of missed a bit when I put the Black back on...

 

No.

 

Yeah I dont think you would know exactly what I mean when I say bright, as I evidentally dont experience what you call muffled.
Never heard of Madrugada either.

 

So it's an elliptical?

 

Yes?

 

I guess, unlike you, I can understand what people mean even when I don't experience what they do.

 

Yes.

 

That's exactly where I am at. Not to say I can't enjoy a cart with a less sophisticated conical or elliptical profile, but after a few records I want to go back to the detail and more accurate reproduction. For people that are very picky about how a cart presents its overall "tonality", I highly suggest tunning via resistance and capacitance loading as mentioned above.

 

And yet, there is something charming about a .4x.7mm elliptical and when it's finely polished, as it is with the Nagaoka line up to the MP-300, which is a $500 cart, it gives a presentation and tonality that doesn't seem to be matched with the finer special stylus shapes. To wit, I have an AT95E Frankencart potted in an ebony wood body. I love this cart and would be using it as my daily driver if it weren't for the fact that I botched the job a bit: no matter what stylus I put on it, when I align it, the cantilever is always a bit askew. It's probably not a big deal, but this hobby has brought out the OCD in me and I can't ignore it. Anyway, the point is that many have put a .3x.7mm elliptical, vivid line and even shibata stylus on these carts with great success. Right before I pulled the trigger on the Nagaoka, I found the AT95ex cartridge for $32 and couldn't resist. I performed the surgery and installed it in the Frankencart and used it for about ten days. Yes, the tracking improved and I got a tad more detail, but I found something missing from the music. It was subtle but noticeable. For me the Nagaoka gives me the deep bottom end and rich mids of the AT95 with better tracking and HF extension. No, not on part with the AT120e, and 125LC, but close enough for my ears.

I have loading plugs for 32, 36 and 42K ohms and have tried all three on the AT line that I have, and yes, you're absolutely right, they do change the character of the highs. But I have measured my total capacitance on my rig (Technics SL-1200MK5 and V-LPS), and it's just under 200pf, which is right at the upper limits of AT's recommendation. Most people are probably above that, which does account for the perceived "brightness". However, I have not used this adjective to describe my experience with these carts. My word of choice is "unnatural" or "etched" to describe what I am hearing. Or, if I am going to be generous, I would say "airy." I get why people like that kind of sound: it's what most people associate with audiophile carts. But when that sound is not accompanied with tuneful, rich bass and a bit of that midrange bloom, I had to look elsewhere.

 

Yes but we are back again to what the reason is, which is important yet can not be known without additional information.

 

As far as I am aware the DL-110 sports an elliptical. Here is what Jerry Raskin had to say about the stylus on the DL-110, which is probably the best description you will find: "Best diamond stylus in its price range. Under a microscope, it looks like a 100% nude, square-shank diamond with a very fine cut similar to cartridges costing twice the price. I love it." The cut of the diamond is important, but so are other things like the polish, and the quality of mounting. What I can tell you from experience is that the DL-110 tracks very well at about 1.75 grams. I set up using the Hi-Fi News Test Record, and it sails through the first three anti-skating cuts, and tracks the final one with minimal distortion in each channel on the final "torture" track. I've never found a cart that tracks the torture cut without distortion, many carts simply jump the groove when the stylus hits the vinyl.

I think that is a fair description. I put these clips together to help folks make up their own minds. My own opinions and preferences are really only relevant to me. I don't want to tell anyone what's "better", people can decide that for themselves. The one thing I will say is that in my experience the Denon is the better tracker of the two. I think that is more in the realm of a statement of fact than opinion. To get the best tracking out of the Nagaoka, I had to push it to the high end of the recommended tracking force at 2.0 grams. Below that it did not track very well. At 2.0 grams it could track the first three anti-skate tracks on the Hi-Fi News Test Record without distortion (anti-skate also set at 2g). Adding extra downforce did not seem to help with the final "torture" track. At 1.5 g, the Naga jumped the groove (not unusual), at 2.0 g it would track with fairly high amounts of distortion. If you want to hear what the difference in performance in this arena is with actual music, listen to the T.Rex "Life Is Strange" cut, which is something of a torture track itself when it comes to sibilance. Neither cart can handle it perfectly, but I do hear more break up with the Nagaoka. None of which is to say which cart is better. Some people are super sensitive to sibilance, others not as much. It really comes down to personal preferences, and how much you are willing to spend.

I think these are both good carts, and while you can do better by spending more in either case, you can also spend more and do worse IMO.

 

It's all about making the right choice.