From "First to Worst"-When good TV shows go bad.*

Discussion in 'Visual Arts' started by hbbfam, Jun 25, 2017.

  1. DLD

    DLD Forum Resident

    Location:
    Dallas, Tx
    I'd offer it went downhill after Season II, Season III should have been named The Tribulations Of Dana. I thought it picked up some in Season IV. We're vested in the show so we keep on watching. The latest, slightly above average season, had moments.
     
  2. Solitaire1

    Solitaire1 Forum Resident

    Although The Fifth Doctor's run was okay, I just didn't care for that version of The Doctor. I did like The Sixth Doctor (Colin Baker) and his performance overcame some weak stories. Of all of the Doctors, he is the one that is the most take charge. While other Doctors just wander from place to place, The Sixth Doctor went out to right wrongs.
     
  3. Trashman

    Trashman Forum Resident

    Location:
    Wisconsin
    I don't really have a problem with Colin's performance. I think he did a good job overall, even when the circumstances (and the scripts) weren't in his favor. The absurd costume he was given was a huge obstacle, however. While many fans have learned to see around the costume, it made him look like a clown to the general public... and made it seem that the show wasn't taking itself seriously anymore.

    The bigger problem was a producer and script editor who didn't agree on most things.
     
  4. 93curr

    93curr Forum Resident

    Location:
    Toronto
    Looks like they may be doing a third season of 'True Detective' after all. Anyone think there's a chance it will follow Community's lead into "when good TV shows go bad and then go good again" territory?
     
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  5. Oatsdad

    Oatsdad Oat, Biscuits and Abbie: Best Dogs Ever

    Location:
    Alexandria VA
    I don't like Seasons 19 or 20 at all - I think the continuing story gimmick just doesn't work. They stretch too hard to make the shows fit the overall narrative.

    I admire the ambition of S19 and S20 but the shows just aren't very good...
     
  6. Oatsdad

    Oatsdad Oat, Biscuits and Abbie: Best Dogs Ever

    Location:
    Alexandria VA
    I thought Susan's death was a major misstep. While I'm glad they didn't go for soppy emotion, they tried to handle it in the same chilly way they handled all emotional elements, and that just didn't work - it looked too harsh and unfeeling...
     
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  7. Oatsdad

    Oatsdad Oat, Biscuits and Abbie: Best Dogs Ever

    Location:
    Alexandria VA
    Seasons 8 and 9 of "Seinfeld" still had plenty of good shows, but I think they were definitely inferior to the prior years. "Seinfeld" never actually "went bad" but it did decline...
     
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  8. Oatsdad

    Oatsdad Oat, Biscuits and Abbie: Best Dogs Ever

    Location:
    Alexandria VA
    But didn't "SNL" always had a slew of "one-joke skits"? I mean, the series pioneered skits that repeated catchphrases, and that goes all the way back to the "classic years"...
     
  9. Oatsdad

    Oatsdad Oat, Biscuits and Abbie: Best Dogs Ever

    Location:
    Alexandria VA
    I actually think "Modern Family" has been pretty consistent, maybe because I don't think it ever achieved actual greatness. It was always moderately funny with a convenient dollop of sappy emotion at the end - it wasn't great enough to fall far from its heights!
     
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  10. Oatsdad

    Oatsdad Oat, Biscuits and Abbie: Best Dogs Ever

    Location:
    Alexandria VA
    I think we view those shows as "limp" in their early days due to hindsight. Yeah, the first season on "Simpsons" doesn't hold up well, but it was a massive hit and people thought it was hilarious.

    The series just got so much better that the early shows look bad by comparison...
     
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  11. Oatsdad

    Oatsdad Oat, Biscuits and Abbie: Best Dogs Ever

    Location:
    Alexandria VA

    No one told Larry King! :D

     
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  12. Isaac K.

    Isaac K. Forum Resident

    My stress was on "never ending".
     
  13. Oatsdad

    Oatsdad Oat, Biscuits and Abbie: Best Dogs Ever

    Location:
    Alexandria VA
    Aww, thanks! :wave:
     
  14. Benno123

    Benno123 Forum Resident

    Location:
    Ohio
    Exactly. It wasn't bad but reaching its former peaks didn't happen as often as it had before. But after 8 years it's expected. It still was a lot of fun. I love talking with the recent college grads I work with who tell me how much they love Seinfeld reruns .. and the looks on their faces when I tell them I remember watching it on Wednesday nights before it moved to Thursday nights ... and watching the finale as a freshman and the news breaking that Frank Sinatra died that evening.
     
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  15. Oatsdad

    Oatsdad Oat, Biscuits and Abbie: Best Dogs Ever

    Location:
    Alexandria VA
    Still not sure "SNL" packed in more "catchphrase characters" in later years than in the "classic era", though I will agree the writers/actors became more conscious of that side of the series. When it became clear movies could be ginned out of regular characters, they worked harder to develop them - IIRC, the Tom Shales "SNL" book discusses that...
     
  16. Oatsdad

    Oatsdad Oat, Biscuits and Abbie: Best Dogs Ever

    Location:
    Alexandria VA
    My pick: "The Flintstones".

    Once they introduced Pebbles, the series started to decline, and each new character - Bamm-Bamm, Hoppy, Gazoo, etc. - offered another sign of creative desperation.

    Still some good episodes in Seasons 4-6, but the show definitely dropped off in quality...
     
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  17. wingsoveramerica

    wingsoveramerica Active Member

    Location:
    Williamsport, Md
    That 70s Show and Little House on the Prairie come to mind.
     
  18. Isaac K.

    Isaac K. Forum Resident

    It seems to me that you are trying to argue against a point that I never intended to make. The problem isn't the one joke skits, it is the length of those skits. The skits of the golden age of SNL as well as the ones today are just long enough, but many of the ones from the 90s are simply torturous in length. Comedic effect seemed to take a back seat to the need to pad out a 90 minute time slot.
     
  19. George Co-Stanza

    George Co-Stanza Forum Resident

    Location:
    America
    Agreed. The last two seasons were still really good, but the humor was almost a bit too slapstick and cartoonish at times. The writing wasn't nearly as clever without Larry David. Seasons 4-6 were the pinnacle.
     
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  20. ohnothimagen

    ohnothimagen PORKCHOPS! Productions

    And yet the first season of The Simpsons contains at least a couple of my favourite episodes: "There's No Disgrace Like Home" and "Moanin' Lisa":righton:

    Give me even the lamest first season episode over just about any episode since season 12 or so...
     
  21. Sure - I recall thinking at the time that the first season of The Simpsons was great, but then watching episodes just three or four years later, with their slack pacing and lame animation, and thinking "how did I find this so funny?" :)
     
  22. Nip Tuck
    Started out interesting and funny at times. Final seasons was dreadful.

    Shameless
    was fun and then became very dark and boring.
     
  23. GLENN

    GLENN Forum Resident

    Location:
    Kingsport,TN, USA
    I think what the producers might not have understood was that viewers of long-running series almost always grow to love the characters over time, even when those characters are supposed to be unlovable. Maybe the acting transcended what was on the page, but I think most people found things in those characters that they could relate to. On most episodes they were simply self-involved, but they were seldom outright mean. This is why Susan's death and the finale are the two moments of Seinfeld that just did not work.
     
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  24. 93curr

    93curr Forum Resident

    Location:
    Toronto
    I didn't mind the meanness so much as the unnecessary redundancy. (which is a poite way of saying I didn't mind when fictional characters were mean to other fictional characters but I didn't like it when the writers were mean to the audience) Sending them off to jail seemed like an okay idea, but who thought it was smart to spend half an hour of the finale on a clip show?? Especially when they aired a one-hour "best of Seinfeld" clip show right before!?
     
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  25. Strat-Mangler

    Strat-Mangler Forum Resident

    Location:
    Toronto
    Disagree completely. Rewatched the whole series recently. Basically, the show's focal point in the first season was John Kelly (David Caruso). It's actually comical to watch now because he was like Superman. He was everywhere, could do no wrong, always had a plan, was composed 99% of the time, etc. Just ridiculous. But the show was nevertheless interesting.

    After he made his ridiculous salary demands which were the straw that broke the camel's back (after a whole year of him acting like a prima donna on set, throwing a garbage can at Dennis Franz, etc), they filmed a few more to start the season and then had no real focus at first, stories going pretty much everywhere. After a while, yes, they did put the focus on Sipowicz and that was a good thing. He was a complex character with plenty of flaws, stuff to work out, he was a little hard to understand and empathize with, but his character's story arc is what the show became. He went from a malicious racist, sexist, alcoholic, with anger issues and a dark view of the world to a good man.

    The show was his redemption. It's actually brilliant if you watch the series from the start. You barely recognize Sipowicz and can't believe somebody would be such a good actor as to eventually make him lovable. It's a tour-de-force and a testament to this acting chops.
     
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