As I stated before, This was my gateway album into Genesis. After seeing the performances of "Watcher …" and "The Musical Box" on the Midnight Special, I was hooked. A few weeks later, I went to the Record Bar in the mall and purchased it. I've been spinning it a few times a year ever since. I think it's fairly good recording, so I suppose I'm in the minority. I prefer these live versions to the studio versions of all tracks. Due to reading this thread from the beginning, I've entertained the idea of actually getting some non-officially released stuff. The Genesis Live - Test Pressing that The Zodiac had mentioned in post #338 clued me in to this. I should have it tomorrow or Wednesday. Can't wait to get my grubby paws on it and experience this version of "Supper's Ready". If it has better sound quality than the official release, well that will be fantastic!
I haven't heard Genesis Live for many, many years. I bought it on LP (Charisma import to the US) in the early 1980s but never developed a love for it as I preferred to hear the songs in their studio album contexts. Not that some of the versions on the live LP weren't possibly better than the studio recordings, but the record didn't seem to hang together as a single piece the way their studio albums did. Plus it was obvious that Genesis Live only captured a portion of a typical gig of the era and not the complete show. This is one of the few Genesis albums I've never gotten around to purchasing on CD, and my LP is long gone, a victim of my late 1980s vinyl purge as I made the switch over to digital. I'll have to pick up an original CD (probably the 1990s remaster?) as well as the remix included in the live box.
Get 'Em Out By Friday Well we know this song obviously because we're revising live versions we have already been through. I do notice that the live version has a bit of a stumble as the lyrics and beat don't quite hit on time with each other, but frankly in a live selection it is incredibly minor. Gabriel really emulates his studio vocal well here. I do read folks talking about the recording/sound quality, I really have never had a problem with the sound quality. I can hear everything well, and clearly. I have never really listened to this and thought it was substandard. Anyhow you already know I love the song, and surprisingly, to me, most folks here seem to find it very average ... but anyhow that's how these things roll. I guess one thing that is interesting is that you can certainly tell in the quiet sections that the crowd certainly were just sitting and listening to the track being played........ It's kind of odd to me, in some ways, that Elvis and the Beatles seemed to set up a psychological precedent that a good live band needs thousands of people screaming for it to be thought of as rock or good. I personally have always prefered to just listen and watch the band playing ... although I would be lying if I said I had never enjoyed a good mosh pit and a sing along
Stay away from the 1994 remasters and the remixes. They're bad. Pick up an 80s CD if you find it cheap or find a used LP (any pressing will blow away what's available on CD).
The story I've always heard about Genesis Live is that this was a radio broadcast show that got heavily bootlegged, and Charisma decided to combat the pirates by released an official version. This may explain the less than stellar quality of the record. Anyway, I like GEOBF quite a bit, actually I think I give the edge to his live recording over the studio version. Whenever Phil gets a chance to cut loose, magic happens. His rhythm patterns that go from the intro chorus into the slower part of the first verse sounds incredibly difficult. Steve's guitar works perfectly with Tony's keys. And attempting such a challenging song in a live setting (and succeeding so well) shows just how talented these guys were.
I agree, especially about the remixes - they are horrid! Ps. The only 94 remaster I prefer is The Lamb (talk about that later on).
That's not completely correct I think this one, Seconds Out, and Three Sides Live are all pretty fine on the remixes. For studio, I'd only recommend Trespass if only since that album was VERY suspect in terms of how it sounds regardless of your copy, plus the alterations are pretty small on that one. With that said, the original's terrible mastering does have it's merit.
I don't think it takes much musical training to understand key changes, transitions, etc. I think the real difficult stuff in Genesis' music, especially in those early years, is working the harmony, with guitar arpeggios playing different chords simultaneously, bass notes rarely ever on the root, keyboards adding additional layers, etc. It's not easy to make that stuff sound consistent. It takes either formal musical training, superb instincts or a very lengthy trial and error process. I suspect that someone like Banks, who had some formal musical training (that's my impression from his playing technique) could make a huge contribution there.
The King Biscuit thing, yes. The show featured live music especially recorded for broadcast. I don't think the band would come up with the idea of a live record, at this point in their career. Plus, it was also released to fill the gap between Foxtrot and Selling, with the latter not to be expected anytime soon. In fact, the celebrated "test pressing" might not be a test at all. Banks (or someone else) has stated that there were never plans for a double album, let alone test presses. This, and the fact that the mix is different on the "lost" album, leads to believe the LP is in fact a professional copy pressed for broadcast use. It was common for radios to use vinyl for that purpose, not tape. Sure, Tony is the classical guy. But Steve has a long-going relationship with classical music as well (it was a Segovia recording to "turn" him to fingerpicking) and Phil is not to be undervalued, in fact he had sort of a "contributing arranger" role in the band, by his own admission. And there's no need to know complex harmony to make complex chords. You just stack up different simple chords and see what happens. Rutherford said he has "no idea" what the unconventional 12-strings tuning used in some pieces was: he just tuned the tiny strings until they sounded fine and different, making a de-facto complex harmony by using simple means. The trademarked guitar layered sound was developed as a duo Mike-Ant, and it's easy to imagine that you can come up with many combining solutions just by experimenting. I'm sure they adopted this practical strategy aplenty.
I think the beautiful thing for Genesis was that they each brought something different to the table ... Phil had intricate knowledge of rhythmic structure. Tony seemed to have a good head for composition, the circle of fifths and all that gear, Steve was very good at interpreting and either invented or pretty much perfected some newer guitar techniques that really helped colour the picture in. Mike seems to have a good head for melody. Peter had a vivid imagination. I don't know how schooled in music any of them were, but that is my quick, guess at how it breaks down, somewhat. You don't need to have a classically trained mind to create this kind of music. You need to know your instrument well and have a good ear. As for re-issues. I like my 2008 box sets ... Perhaps I am missing something but the 5.1's sound great to me. Everybody has their preferences, and I am not going to say anybody is wrong or right, but I am very happy with what I have
Just to put it clear, Tony Banks had received some formal training on the violin and piano as a boy. but was self-taught in composition and much preferred playing the piano by ear.
Any more substance to that? Not derailing, I figured most people found the remixes for the live material inoffensive. Yeah, that definitely isn't surprising. There's a lot of Genesis keyboard breaks that sound very improvised and not at all calculated.
They are even more compressed and brick walled then the studio albums. I like the original master of Trespass plus they didn't find the source for the sound affects on The Knife for the remix. Yes, for some strange reason they got better reputation, don't know why.
Not exactly. The radio show wasn't bootlegged - it was never actually broadcast - but they were certainly aware of other boots that had started appearing - the two they named at the time were the Melody Maker Poll Winner's Concert from the Oval, Kennington from Sept '72 and Sheffield City Hall from the Feb '73 UK tour. That sent me off trying to locate both until I discovered that they just circualted on tape and not vinyl as I'd assumed. The band didn't want to release a live album at this stage, but Strat persuaded them it would be a good business move. Maybe the supposed appearance of boots was a factor, although in reality the first proper Genesis vinyl boot was still a while away yet, but Strat's idea was to have it as a mid-price release, essentially a 'best of' to act as an affordable gateway for new fans, which it clearly did, making it into the top 10 in the UK album charts. Never had a problem with the sound quality myself, it was a fair representation of how they sounded on stage then. It would have been good if it had been a double and a bit more effort had gone into the sleeve design, but that wasn't what this release was about.
Edit: Doh! I’m late to the party. This link was posted earlier in the thread. Sorry for the duplication I think this is the version you referenced above:
Today I received the Zal Schreiber ATLANTIC CD masterting of the 1973 Live album - sounds great !!! Nice bottom, very natural treble range etc...I love it !!! I compared it with the 1994 Definitive Remaster...the original ATLANTIC CD is a clear winner !!!
I dumped all my original CDs when I got the Definitive Editions... I've learned the error of my ways - Live is the last one I need to get to complete the pre-DE collection.
Yes, also a nice-sounding disc, but I can't stand the horrible cropped artworks of the old Charisma CDs...that was the reason to buy 1991 Japan CDs...same mastering as the very low-cost UK CDs, but original vinyl LP layout
